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I know that Grey Knights are pretty much hopeless, but I wanted to try out something a little different. Based on what models I have lying around, here's what I came up with:

HQ 1
GK Grand Master, sacred incense, hammerhand
Retinue of 8 GK Terminators

HQ 2
Malleus Inquisitor Lord, psycannon, emperor's tarot, terminator armor
+ Warrior, Sage, Familiar

Elite 1
Callidus Assassin

Elite 2
6 GK Terminators, 1 psycannon, 1 Thunderhammer/storm shield

Elite 3
6 GK Terminators, 1 psycannon, 1 Thunderhammer/storm shield

Troop 1
5 Grey Knights, incinerator

Troop 2
5 Grey Knights, incinerator

Troop 3
5 Grey Knights, incinerator

Heavy Support
Lance Strike

Total: 1996 points

I could potentially swap out one of the GK squads for some Stormtroopers with plasma, but a little reluctant to do so (I wanted to be more or less "pure" GK). The assassin is sweet, I know the lance strike is sub-par but it's still a little fun. Thoughts?

I personally do not find the Grey Knights to be hopeless at all, my only concern with them is that they are usually footsloggers because their transport of choice, (Land Raider) is to damn exspencive. . .

I have played alot of games against a GK army with 1 command terminator squad, 3 terminator squads, 2 or 3 GK squads, 1 GK Dreadnaught, 1 of the oribital bombardments (it was the strength 10 ap 1 one with the ordinance blast)

He gets around the foot slogging by using teleport homers in his gk troop squads, and marching while relying on that cloaking thing that makes them act concealed, and then deep striking the terminators in front of the gk squads. . .

I have 8 assault cannons, 4 missile launchers, 5 plasma guns, and 2 melta guns, and I have trouble hurting him enough to avoid his massive assault. 

This could be my tactics, and the fact that I usually am drastically short on assault power but it does show you how deadly gk's can be. . .

Thinking about your list however, my biggest point of contention is the Incinerators, get psi-cannons maxed instead the better range, rate of fire, and ap, really make a difference compared to the incinerators, the incinerators I think are mainly for anti-eldar armies, (alot more effective against dark eldar though when you think about it, demons, cover saves, and horde reduction)

I'm thinking he's taking the incinerators because they're a lot more useful if you're getting ready to charge into h2h, where the GK's are pretty decent.

Just a guess though.

Well actually psi-cannons don't stop you from assaulting if i remember correctly?

You NEED to have 2-3 dreadnoughts with twin linked las cannons and missile launchers.  They are the only units available that can reliably destroy high AV models.  I have been playing a pure GK army for close to a year now with mixed results and the dreads are essential to any chance of killing heavy vehicles.

Also, the incinerators are a real waste of points.  Buy as many small squads with 2 psycannons as you can afford.  I usually play with 4 squads of troops (6-8 man) and 2 termy squads with 1-2 psycannons each.

Darrian

hmmm. . . a friend of mine plays fine with just one gk dread, i think its because of his nasty terminators, and that psychic power where you can double your strength is rather nasty.

You are correct citadel, Psycannons don't stop you from assaulting... however incinerators use that big honkin template... which is far more useful if you're about to start mixing it up in h2h.

Well there could be another reason how much do those Psi-Cannons cost versus the Incinerators anyway?

Posted By KiMonarrez on 02/25/2006 2:00 PM
You are correct citadel, Psycannons don't stop you from assaulting... however incinerators use that big honkin template... which is far more useful if you're about to start mixing it up in h2h.

When I'm assaulting with Grey Knights, generally I DON'T want to use a template weapon. Too many kills and either I wipe out everything there and am left hanging to the wind, or you kill everything within charge distance. Take Psycannons because you can use them to shoot on the way in before the assault round, plus the higher strength is useful.

As I have said, Psi-Cannons are great all purpose weapons, but the Incinerators have quite a few advantages to killing eldar and Imperial guard. . .

I have played against a couple Imperial Guard Armies that like to use chameleon cloaks (I know I spelled it wrong), a couple times the little bugger pulled off a 3+ cover save, and another friend of mine just had to fight Al-Taioc in a city battle and the buggers got a 2+ cover save, just to be clear Flamer Templates work damned well. . .

Psycannons ignore cover also...

Incorrect, Psi-cannons ignore invulnerable saves not cover saves. . . Incinerators ignore both. . . oh and both have AP 4

GKs do need some armor popping power, but the dreadnought is not the way to get it. Armored fist squads is how I'd do it. Then you get mobile bunkers for your GKs with lots of dakka and AV12 as well as a heavies.

Also, at least 1-2 thunderhammers in bigger GK termie squads is a good way to give you a small edge vs. vehicles and monsters.

Agreed, 1 thunder hammer is all I ever think you would need though in a termie squad, any more and it gets rid of your advantage of strength 6 initiative 4 weapons, and still lets you bust any vehicle well, especially ones foolish enough to try and tank shock you. . .

(Grey knights are fearless, so they pass morale check, the attack auto hits, thunder hammer automatically stuns the vehicle meaning it can't kill you, oh and its still a nasty thunderhammer strength 8, might even be funny to use that spell hammer hand)

Posted By citadel97501 on 02/27/2006 9:04 PM
Incorrect, Psi-cannons ignore invulnerable saves not cover saves. . . Incinerators ignore both. . . oh and both have AP 4

Check YMTC...But it boils down to Psycannons only allowing armor saves and a cover save not being an armor save, so it can't be taken against psycannons.

Who on earth told you that? Cover saves are cover saves not invulnerable saves. . . Page 25 of the BGB, explains it more fully but basically it says their not the same thing. . .

Example: 1
my name is Dave the scout, I am a Veteran Sergeant Scout who for some reason has a Rosariusr: 4+ armor save, 4+ invulnerable Save. . .

I have a psi-cannon shot at me, I will not get any save at all because the psi-cannon is to strong for my armor to stop, and its special rules ignore my invulnerable save. . .

Example: 2
Now later that day, Bob the scout, I picked up Dave's Rosarius because he wasn't using it and am hiding in this lovely reinforced bunker, I found: 4+ Armor Save, 4+ Invulnerable Save, 4+ Cover Save

The same damned grey kniight shoots at me with his psi-cannon, I will not get an armor save at all because the psi-cannon is to strong for my armor to stop, and its special rules ignore my invulnerable save, but thankfully I duck just in time as three rounds shatter on the Plas steel contruction, I thank the emperor and return fire at the Grey Knight. . .

Example: 3
The grey knights commander teleports in and fires his Incinerator to cleanse Bob in the bunker. . . Bob won't get a save at all, because the ap of the incinerator is 4+ equal to his armor, the rosarius once again is worthless, and the flamer template turns the building from cover into an oven. . .

Read the rules for Psycannons.

'ONLY armor saves can be taken...'

A cover save is NOT an armor save, thus can't be taken.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/Default.aspx?tabid=93&forumid=15&tpage=1&view=Topic&postid=31704

ok, then if only Armor saves can be taken, Psi-cannons are the most powerful weapon in the game because no one including a terminator gets an armor save, in the BGB its referred to as a Armour save, (The correct queen's english spelling btw)

I added that to the wonderfully bizarre thread you gave us a llink to. . .

I chose incinerators over psycannons because of the points cost involved - psycannons cost more than twice as much as incinerators. I wanted at least one special weapon in each squad, but couldn't afford the (unfortunately overpriced) psycannons.

i heard that a new codex is on the horizon, possibly for daemonhunters and witchhunters to be in the same codex, but it'll probably be another year or so away yet, hopefully including some plastics!

Two things I'd like to point out

1: GK teleport homers don't work, they rely on the old balst template format of deep striking, this no longer exist and don't affect 5th ed deep striking (but I'm sure a friendly opponent will take pity on your 3rd ed codex and let you use them as normal teleport homers)

2: citadel, either you missed the fact your friend takes and inquisitor or your friends forgetting you need one for orbital bombardments. Just mentioning (also, that type of bombardment is called a lance strike if your interested, for the purpose of list building it is considereda 2nd best bombardment availible to DH forces)

Elsewhere, I prefer no speical weapons. We GK's pay for the pivalige of a storm bolter with a speical rule and a nemisis force weapon. Psycannons encourage you to stay still so you can use it at full range, you should let the enemy come to you because we are too expensive to take on hordes while (despite out CC buff) we will not beat dedicated CC troops who haven't been whitled down by SB fire. If you must have special weapons, take a purigation squad, give them all incinorators and stike them in a land raider. Tank shock with the 'raider to get everyone in a nice line then disembark and flame them. If they exist after this, you can assault them.