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I used to have a DE army back in 3rd edition up till about halfway through 4th editions run. Then losing hope that I would never get a new book I sold the army. Now with new models and new rules I am very tempted to rejoin the hunt. Here's a list I came up with, which is more or less the same as the list is used to run in the old book.

HQ
-Archon (125pts)
w/ Power Weapon, Combat Drugs, Soul Trap, Shadow Field
-Archon (125pts)
w/ Power Weapon, Combat Drugs, Soul Trap, Shadow Field

Elites
-5 Incubi (197pts)
w/ Klaivex, Venom (Splinter Cannon)
-5 Incubi (197pts)
w/ Klaivex, Venom (Splinter Cannon)
-5 Incubi (197pts)
w/ Klaivex, Venom (Splinter Cannon)

Troops
-9 Kabalite Warriors (186pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Raider
-9 Kabalite Warriors (186pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (205pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (205pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider

Fast Attack

Heavy Support
-Ravager (125pts)
w/ Night Shield, Flicker Field
-Ravager (125pts)
w/ Night Shield, Flicker Field
-Talos (125pts)
w/ Chain-flails, Extra Close Combat Weapon


Anyways there's the list. Anyone who plays DE and sees a major flaw that they have found playing please let me know as comments and critique are what this site is all about.

If you're going to take the Soul-Trap, you want a weapon that will actually effectively kill MC's and IC's. I'd take either an Agonizer or Huskblade to make use of the Soultrap.
No Flickerfields on the Raiders? And you took them on Ravagers? Wha?
Where are the Archons going? I assume they'll be with the Warriors, which is a waste. You're spending 100+ each on combat HQ's and putting them with a dedicated shooting unit.
Agonizers and debatably Sybarites in general are a complete waste of points on Warrior Squads. Drop them and take Flickerfields on your Raiders, at least. Also take a Splinter Cannon on the other 2 units of Warriors.
The Talos has absolutely zero synergy with the rest of your army. Every other unit in your army is mounted except for the slow, dinky Talos going 6" a turn with no ranged weapons as opposed to 12". It just doesn't fit.
I don't really know what you should do with the Archons. You have the right idea with the smaller units of Incubi in the Venoms but the Klaivex is a bit of a waste without powers or Demiklaives. You could cut down to units of 4 with a Klaivex and take Haemonculi in each one. You'll have points left over afterwards for other stuff. That being said, I don't know exactly what would work. I don't field Incubi.

HQ
-Archon (125pts)
w/ Power Weapon, Combat Drugs, Soul Trap, Shadow Field
-Archon (125pts)
w/ Power Weapon, Combat Drugs, Soul Trap, Shadow Field

Usually the Soul Trap is paired with a Husk Blade because it insta kills. From my experience the combo doesn't really work. It's incredibly tough to snipe out a weak enemy IC and survive long enough to wreak havoc with your new strength 6. If it isn't worth it with a Husk Blade I doubt that you could kill IC's well enough to make it work with a simple st 3 power weapon.

I don't really like the Archon much at all. It takes just six wounds on average to make him fail a save and basically end him. Plus, saves are now taken one at a time on the Shadowfield. If you are dead set on running the Archon I would drop the Soul Trap and take an Agonizer. I would probably take one maximum.

Elites
-5 Incubi (197pts)
w/ Klaivex, Venom (Splinter Cannon)
-5 Incubi (197pts)
w/ Klaivex, Venom (Splinter Cannon)
-5 Incubi (197pts)
w/ Klaivex, Venom (Splinter Cannon)

This seems like overkill but it might be fun. Competitively 3-4 Trueborn with Blasters is a better option.

Troops
-9 Kabalite Warriors (186pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Raider
-9 Kabalite Warriors (186pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (205pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (205pts)
w/ Syrabite, Agoniser, Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider

Never, never, never take Warriors geared for CC. I'll say it again. Never take Warriors geared for CC. They are bad at it and will fold. Warriors have a very solid ranged weapon. If you are charging then you aren't shooting the rapid fire gun and that's a huge mistake. Squads of 5 with a Blaster in Venoms work best for Warriors. Wyches and Wracks are the CC Troops choice.

Heavy Support
-Ravager (125pts)
w/ Night Shield, Flicker Field
-Ravager (125pts)
w/ Night Shield, Flicker Field
-Talos (125pts)
w/ Chain-flails, Extra Close Combat Weapon

The Night Shields are pretty meh but some like them. I love flickerfields. In fact, always take them on vehicles. The 5++ is definitely nice. The Talos doesn't fit here. It's too slow and will never do anything. Take a third Ravager and be happy.


Hope this helps.

I agree that if you take soul trap, get a huskblade. But you need something better to link these archons up with than warriors. IF you want a huskblade, go with wyches and get shardnets and tarpit enemies ICs. If you do decide on a agonizer, you could also pair one up with 4 incubi. with two Archons in an army, you could do both here.

The list looks fun, but a third ravager will help with some anti tank. Today i fought a GK 2k tournament list that had something like 9 transports and 3 dreads. My list had twenty something lances, and I got murdered (partially due to an inability to roll over a three...). Here, I count 14.

Night shields mattered alot back when things like carnifexes could murder you from half a board away and you had to just sit there and eat it. Not really worth it anymore, not to mention how much skill it takes to play NS games with an excorsist. The flickerfields are nice if they work. My wonderful rolling has yet to make a single FF save, so in my opinion, they are not worth it at all.

The soultrap/huskblade combo is pretty much set in stone. Maybe an agonizer or djin blade would go with it, but neither are as good as the huskblade.

Now, statistically, the 5man incubi tend to pay for themselves in a round of combat with marines pretty well. I love mine, but it looks like they are just not as useful as the blasterborn. The venom spam adds the needed horde control, while lance spamming helps keep down vehicles and heavy infantry. The storm of power weapons is less useful than it looks. Then again, there are so many times where I see an expose power armor squad just asking to get incubied on but didn't take them that game. Sadly, I will replace mine once I get some more of those nice new models (the new ones make great trueborn in armies that use old models).

The talos is a fun model. That being said, it is not as good a model as a ravager. The new ones are pretty, but that force org chart sort of kicked it out of most lists. I hate shelving mine, and each game I play I think, "oh a talos would be fun" but don't take it because, well.... a ravager is just so much better.

Yea I tend to agree with most of the comments here when thinking them through.

However I do disagree on one thing.

I don't really like the Archon much at all. It takes just six wounds on average to make him fail a save and basically end him. Plus, saves are now taken one at a time on the Shadowfield. If you are dead set on running the Archon I would drop the Soul Trap and take an Agonizer. I would probably take one maximum.

The Archon is brawlic. In my old army my Archon would butcher entire marine units by himself. Sure he could chose what combat drugs effected him each turn (ie he was always S5 with the punisher), but still the new ones have way more attacks. I do see the point of giving them agonisers, so I will do that.


So here's a new list. It's very vanilla now, but I love massed troops anyways so it could be loads worse. I was also thinking I could replace an Archon with the Duke Siliscus just to boost all my poisoned weapons. Anyways just a thought

HQ
-Archon (135pts)
w/ Huskblade, Combat Drugs, Shadow Field
-Archon (135pts)
w/ Huskblade, Combat Drugs, Shadow Field

Elites
-4 Incubi (153pts)
w/ Venom (Splinter Cannon)
-4 Incubi (153pts)
w/ Venom (Splinter Cannon)
-5 Incubi (175pts)
w/ Venom (Splinter Cannon)

Troops
-10 Kabalite Warriors (175pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (175pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (175pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (175pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
-10 Kabalite Warriors (115pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon
-10 Kabalite Warriors (115pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon

Fast Attack

Heavy Support
-Ravager (105pts)
-Ravager (105pts)
-Ravager (105pts)

I would personally cut the whole 3rd incubi squad (or the 2nd archon) and put flickerfields on everything

I would swap two warriors squads and take some wyches. the warriors will get punked in combat. combine assualt with incubi and start passing out the pain tokens. and i agree to dump the talos and take a ravager. they are only good in a webway list.

ps=welcome back to the dark side

Ok so based upon your comments I have another revised list


HQ
-Archon (145pts)
w/ Huskblade, Soul Trap, Combat Drugs, Shadow Field
-Archon (135pts)
w/ Huskblade, Combat Drugs, Shadow Field

Elites
-9 Incubi (258pts)
w/ Raider
-9 Incubi (258pts)
w/ Raider

Troops
-10 Wyches (210pts)
w/ 2x Hydra Gauntlets, Raider
-10 Wyches (210pts)
w/ 2x Hydra Gauntlets, Raider
-11 Kabalite Warriors (124pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon
-10 Kabalite Warriors (115pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon
-10 Kabalite Warriors (115pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon
-10 Kabalite Warriors (115pts)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon

Fast Attack

Heavy Support
-Ravager (105pts)
-Ravager (105pts)
-Ravager (105pts)

Add haywires to the wyches, lest they get caught by a dreadnaught or killa kans.

The FlickerFields really should go back onto the Ravagers. I'd trade in the HydaGs for the points. Even though I have only played 30 or so games, I can't count how many times an opponent has given me a disgusted look followed with a curse, when a raider or ravager survives shooting or being assaulted, because the Invuln Save kicked in.

Wychs are not going to win a fight against killa kans even with haywire, I've tried it. Wych weapons should be an afterthought, and should be dropped for flickers on the ravagers.

The incubi units are probably too big, but fixing that takes a lot of work. Something like -1 archon, -1 incubi squad, reduce other incubi to 4 and put in venom, reduce wychs to 9 total no wych weapons, add 2x trueblasters in venom, add 2x heamy with liquifier, add flickerfields to ravagers. I'm not doing the math on that one to figure out if the math works, but that is the idea anyways. Loading up on too much powerful melee will leave them in the open after they eat a squad in a single round to die to enemy shooting.

Dracos wrote:Wychs are not going to win a fight against killa kans even with haywire, I've tried it.

Agreed, they won't win, but they may as well not be helpless, and there are enemy tanks to multi-assault, drop pods (automatic hits!) etc.

I like your list, I know venoms are the rage right now but I think they are overrated, anyways my opinion aside here are my comments:

Keep incubi in raiders but drop number a few models. Pickup phantasm greenade launchers on your archons, it will give the incubi assault grenades if the archon is joined to them so they can benefit from their initiative as much as possible. I would recommend dropping the incubi to 6 per squad, use the free points to upgrade your vehicles.

Swap out one of the Wycherley squads weapons for 2x shard net and impalers. That unit becoms your anti assault unit, you charge bad mean assault units and drop their attacks down low, then charge one of your incubi units in the same turn to do the bu of the killing.

Not necessary but if you plan on keeping your archon with a unit most of the game consider giving one a clone field for variety, for n archon in s unit that doesn't take a lot of fire it works better in assault many times.

Your second list looks like a lot of warriors have no ride, they need rides, the vatos need their rides homey

You have a squad of 11 warriors with splinter cannon and blaster. Considering you have an elite slot free consider upgrading them to true born and give them max splinter cannons and make the squad smaller.

haywire grenades are a waist of points on wyches. if your getting assualted by dreads or kans you're prob losing already, and if your wyches are assaulting tanks you're prob winning anyway. wyches should be assaulting infantry and only infantry otherwise youre not using them right. thats what DL and blasters are for

ejhellstrom77 wrote:haywire grenades are a waist of points on wyches. if your getting assualted by dreads or kans you're prob losing already,

There's a 9 dreadnaught/Drop Pod BA list out there. And I field 24 lances at 1850. It wasn't enough to deal with all of the dreads, but the wyches were able to start balancing out the KPs by slapping haywires upside the Drop Pods.

The kans? In another (memorable) game, I tied up the kans with one set of girls, while the other unit's hekatrix knocked orks off the objective and won the game. Not quite the plan at the time, but the opponent was surprised that the wyches didn't fold after ... IIRC 3 rounds of h2h.

ejhellstrom77 wrote:and if your wyches are assaulting tanks you're prob winning anyway. wyches should be assaulting infantry and only infantry otherwise youre not using them right. thats what DL and blasters are for

Right, "winning anyway". The opportunity of assaulting tanks and infantry, as part of a multi-assault comes on that crucial turn 2 (all the guys know the reach of DE AlphaStrike in my local meta). Why let up and waste the opportunity to disable a tank while you're splattering troops too?

Pretty much most lists I've seen, and advice from the DE heavies here on dakka, advocate haywires.

Ok so another revision inbound. I understand that you all seem to disagree with the wych weapons, but personally I want to use the Hydra gauntlets as i think punch daggers are some of the coolest CCW's available. So now I have dropper the Archons all together, and instead have 2 Haemonculi ancients which will be attached to the incubi squads for the wonder FNP. Anyways as usual comments and critiques are always apreciated

HQ
- Haemonculus Ancient (115pts)
w/ Agoniser, Liquifier Gun, Animus Vitae
- Haemonculus Ancient (110pts)
w/ Agoniser, Liquifier Gun

Elites
- 7 Incubi (214pts)
w/ Raider
- 7 Incubi (214pts)
w/ Raider

Troops
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (175)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (175)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (115)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (115)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon
- 10 Wyches (210)
w/ 2x Hydra Gauntlets, Hekatrix, Agoniser, Raider
- 10 Wyches (210)
w/ 2x Hydra Gauntlets, Hekatrix, Agoniser, Raider

Heavy Support
- Ravager (115pts)
w/ Flickerfield
- Ravager (115pts)
w/ Flickerfield
- Ravager (115pts)
w/ Flickerfield

What's the point of taking Ancients? They can be ID'd by Powerfists just like regular Haemies.
I can see the use of an Animus Vitae but you only get one. I'd rather have a Crucible to be honest.
Why do you have 2 foot units of Warriors? They have little synergy with the rest of your army due to their lack of speed and in Annihilation they're pretty much free points.

HQ
- Haemonculus Ancient (115pts)
w/ Agoniser, Liquifier Gun, Animus Vitae
- Haemonculus Ancient (110pts)
w/ Agoniser, Liquifier Gun

There's just no real point to taking an ancient. Also, the Animus Vitae does not work in conjunction with other CCW's like the Agonizer per the DE FAQ. Which means that it is worthless. I'd take two Haemy's with Shattershard at the most. Maybe just one for 65 points. If you drop down to just one with Shattershard you have enough points for three Trueborn with blasters in a Venom...

Elites
- 7 Incubi (214pts)
w/ Raider
- 7 Incubi (214pts)
w/ Raider

7 is a solid number. I think in some ways you could go down to six if you need more points.

Troops
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (175)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (175)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon, Raider
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (115)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon
- 10 Kabalite Warriors (115)
w/ Blaster, Splinter Cannon

I'm not crazy about 10 man Warriors. The Cannon is pretty mediocre when not on a Venom.

- 10 Wyches (210)
w/ 2x Hydra Gauntlets, Hekatrix, Agoniser, Raider
- 10 Wyches (210)
w/ 2x Hydra Gauntlets, Hekatrix, Agoniser, Raider

These will struggle to survive without a Haemonculus. It's the way it goes.

Heavy Support
- Ravager (115pts)
w/ Flickerfield
- Ravager (115pts)
w/ Flickerfield
- Ravager (115pts)
w/ Flickerfield

Solid, standard, reliable.


If you drop both Ancients, 2 Wych weapons per squad, and 1 Wych out of each squad then you have 275 points. You could add a Venom with three Blaster born and 2 Shattershard Haemonculus for the Wytches.

Get rid of talos and get flikers.

You need more anti mech so your innucubi have something to assult.

Smitty0305 wrote:Get rid of talos and get flikers.

You need more anti mech so your innucubi have something to assult.

Probably reading the whole discussion would be useful before posting something that no longer relates to the discussion on hand. Just a thought

For everyone who is paying attention, Haemonculi are there essentially for a possible ownage round of liquifier gun shooting and the free pain token? That almost seems like a waste to me. Wouldn't taking more stuff that can kill be better in the end so that I can get pain tokens on the field quickly? I guess the DE really have changed a lot since the last book (in terms of tactics)

I'm not a odds expert I had to look this up but with a full squad of wyches in combat with a Dread or Kan they are not with you.

first you need to roll 6's then 6's again then a 5 or 6 a six again to wreck or destroy.
so with 10 dice you have about a 85% to roll just one 6. so just to be lucky say you roll 2.
now you have to roll another six. with two dice to roll and get a six your odds drop to about 30%,
ok so lets say you get one, now to roll another six your odds drop to 16%.
so by luck or miracle you roll another six "BOOM!" the Kan or nought explodes and now you have to roll more sixes to keep your wyches. so now your odds are back up to 85% to roll just one six, so 8-9 wyches are dead.

now your argument goes"but ill glance it to death" all the while youre still stuck in combat and your wyches are dying or occupied

Dark Eldar are the fastest army in the game you should flying circles around Dreads and Kans and if youre playing a dread or kan list why are you taking wyches anyway. you shoould be taking warriors/trueborn with blasters in venoms/raiders

if you have 24 DLances and its not enough you are doing something wrong(no offense) cause I do just fine with 12 or 13 even against mech IG and Dreadlists. you have to prioritise your targets and keep shooting until they are stunned or destroyed. and stay away from them

I too was a big advocate of haynades until I was shown this and playtested it (thanks cheese!)

14 Incubi? Overkill. Drop some and try and get some trueblasters.
The warriors need Raiders, their Newspaper Armour won't save them in the open.
100% need flickerfield on all vehicles. It helps so much, you won't believe.
You don't need agonizer on haemies. they start with wyches, then leave so the wyches can have a pain token, since haemies can't have fleet.