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Ok so I was thinking about a scenario, lets say the tau invaded a imperial world with a lot of civilians, and they took the planet. Do you think the tau would start killing the innocent civilians for "the greater good"

No. They would be offered to join the Greater Good.

Also, this really isn't hypothetical or anything, because it has happened before.

In 40k, innocence proves nothing....

But this thread will not end well.

Quite possibly, the High Command may not be very happy about it. As above has said, I hope Corporal Reznov or Brother Coa remain far away from this thread, else is devolve into an argument thread.

Nerivant wrote: Also, this really isn't hypothetical or anything, because it has happened before.

were has this happened before exactly

bombboy1252 wrote:

Nerivant wrote: Also, this really isn't hypothetical or anything, because it has happened before.

were has this happened before exactly

It'd be easier to list the times where they did start killing civilians.

Nimbosa.

I think that's it.

You join the greater good and get a relatively good life (minus a level of freedom until you prove your belief to the cause) or you get sent to work camps.

Tau have taken imperial worlds before.

BluntmanDC wrote:You join the greater good and get a relatively good life (minus a level of freedom until you prove your belief to the cause) or you get sent to work camps.

Tau have taken imperial worlds before.

Yeah, but only Imperial worlds with LOT of population are Hive Worlds. Taros was only a small mine world ( with 12.000.000 people ).

Its simply 2 choices when a planet is invaded:

- a join us and live under our rules
- die and be replaced with our own colonists

Opposing forces and "unbelievers" aren't accepted in the 40k-verse on the same world.

Brother Coa wrote:

BluntmanDC wrote:You join the greater good and get a relatively good life (minus a level of freedom until you prove your belief to the cause) or you get sent to work camps.

Tau have taken imperial worlds before.

Yeah, but only Imperial worlds with LOT of population are Hive Worlds. Taros was only a small mine world ( with 12.000.000 people ).

Why did you quote me?

And seeing as lots is a non-descript word with no actual number value you point makes no sence.

bombboy1252 wrote:Ok so I was thinking about a scenario, lets say the tau invaded a imperial world with a lot of civilians, and they took the planet. Do you think the tau would start killing the innocent civilians for "the greater good"

To finish here and NOT to start a fight, or trolling on Tau side...

When Tau take Imperial world with high population, they offered the population a choice of joining their empire. The one that refuse that will either be killed or indoctrinated.
And yes, at Nimbosa Tau started to kill innocent civilians. But it was actions of their insane commander who only see Tau as equals and all other races as weak, he was killed after that campaign by joined Tau-Imperial strike force.

Beside that one incident all other world's.....ah... in fact the only other world that accepted the Grater Good ( Taros ) has gone without violence toward population. Tau even hired local gangs to fight against IG. But they failed everywhere else ( Nimbosa, Targa, Kronus, Kaurava, Zeist... ), and it was stated in 5'th edition that Imperium with Ultramar had begun to reinforce worlds near the Tau Empire to try to slow down their influence.

I will say nothing else to provoke racial insults. And I think the time has come to lock this thread as well.


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BluntmanDC wrote:
And seeing as lots is a non-descript word with no actual number value you point makes no sence.

But only worlds with LOT of populations ( millions, billions ) are only the Hive Worlds, right?

I mean, Taros was regarded as "low populated mine world" with12 million people.

So my point indeed make sense.


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BluntmanDC wrote:
Tau have taken imperial worlds before.

I quoted because of this, Tau never took Imperial world with billions of people on it.


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iproxtaco wrote:... hope Corporal Reznov or Brother Coa remain far away from this thread, else is devolve into an argument thread.

To late

Brother Coa wrote:Beside that one incident all other world's.....ah... in fact the only other world that accepted the Grater Good ( Taros ) has gone without violence toward population.

The novel "For the Emperor" descibes another typical example of a human planet joining the Tau Empire. Kroot and Vespid homeworlds also were not subject to violence. Guess there are a lot more examples. Here the background text from Battlefleet Gothic on that topic:

As the Tau Empire expands out from its homeworld, the Tau inevitably encounter new races previously unknown to them, and to each of these an offer of allegiance is made. There are many aggressive, arrogant and selfish races in the galaxy, however, and even the Tau often find first contact results in nothing more than yet another bloody war. There are other races however, who readily accept the message of the greater good and take up their place in the Tau Empire. Some of these races are small, perhaps located on just a single world, or else primitive with little useful resource to offer the Tau, in which case their accession to the Empire is simply a formality, with the benevolent Tau offering protection to these lesser races while they can expect little other than appreciation and friendship in return.

Other additions to the Empire are advanced in themselves, and the union of two such cultures provides valuable new knowledge, technology and understanding for both parties. Such races, where able, fulfil their debt to the Tau Empire by a series of tithes which suit their own particular abilities. Able craftsmen, for instance, may be called upon to provide manufacturing capacity, while aggressive or warlike races will be obligated to provide troops to the armies of the Tau. There are other races still who do not wish to fully submit to the Empire, but who likewise have no wish for war with the Tau and will instead strike up armistices or treaties of neutrality, opening up lucrative new markets or providing new allegiances for mutual protection. Such races are also likely to hire themselves out as mercenaries to the Tau Empire when the opportunity arises.

And I support the motion to close this thread before harm is done.

Brother Coa wrote:

BluntmanDC wrote:
And seeing as lots is a non-descript word with no actual number value you point makes no sence.

But only worlds with LOT of populations ( millions, billions ) are only the Hive Worlds, right?

I mean, Taros was regarded as "low populated mine world" with12 million people.

So my point indeed make sense.

You still seem to think that the word lot actually means a number.

The population of Earth is currently estimated at 6.93 BILLION, the Earth would not be classed as a hive world (i think anyone would class a figure that goes into the billions as alot).

Hive Worlds would be nearly impossible to conquer, but a world like ours would be possible.

Kroothawk wrote:

As the Tau Empire expands out from its homeworld, the Tau inevitably encounter new races previously unknown to them, and to each of these an offer of allegiance is made. There are many aggressive, arrogant and selfish races in the galaxy, however, and even the Tau often find first contact results in nothing more than yet another bloody war. There are other races however, who readily accept the message of the greater good and take up their place in the Tau Empire. Some of these races are small, perhaps located on just a single world, or else primitive with little useful resource to offer the Tau, in which case their accession to the Empire is simply a formality, with the benevolent Tau offering protection to these lesser races while they can expect little other than appreciation and friendship in return.

Other additions to the Empire are advanced in themselves, and the union of two such cultures provides valuable new knowledge, technology and understanding for both parties. Such races, where able, fulfil their debt to the Tau Empire by a series of tithes which suit their own particular abilities. Able craftsmen, for instance, may be called upon to provide manufacturing capacity, while aggressive or warlike races will be obligated to provide troops to the armies of the Tau. There are other races still who do not wish to fully submit to the Empire, but who likewise have no wish for war with the Tau and will instead strike up armistices or treaties of neutrality, opening up lucrative new markets or providing new allegiances for mutual protection. Such races are also likely to hire themselves out as mercenaries to the Tau Empire when the opportunity arises.

And I support the motion to close this thread before harm is done.

Thanks for the info, and for supporting my request


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BluntmanDC wrote:
You still seem to think that the word lot actually means a number.

The population of Earth is currently estimated at 6.93 BILLION, the Earth would not be classed as a hive world (i think anyone would class a figure that goes into the billions as alot).

Hive Worlds would be nearly impossible to conquer, but a world like ours would be possible.

That's what I was thinking to. When OP asked question and put "lot of civilians" he actually meant Hive World. The only world I know with lot of civilians is Hive World.

And it will be hard for them to even conquer our world, not because we "have USA, and High Tech, and bad-ass solder" - but because we are stretch across all continents. On most Imperial Worlds populations are concentrated in or near the major cities. That is not the case with our world.

Why do Tau threads always devolve in to petty flame wars and get closed down? Can't we have one thread where we can discuss things without being insulted?

No.


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And Tau very rarely kill anyone as long as they don't attack them. The only example where they weren't given the option of joining was Nimbosa, where the commander of the strike force was executed for brutality.

TrollPie wrote:Why do Tau threads always devolve in to petty flame wars and get closed down? Can't we have one thread where we can discuss things without being insulted?

No.


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And Tau very rarely kill anyone as long as they don't attack them. The only example where they weren't given the option of joining was Nimbosa, where the commander of the strike force was executed for brutality.

I think we can have a tau thread with out getting into a flame war. We just talk about the tau and not flame people.

Here is a fine question that get to my mind.

Suppose that Imperium change it's alien policy a little: if Impeirum of Man asked the Tau to join them, would the Tau join the Imperium?

Brother Coa wrote:Here is a fine question that get to my mind.

Suppose that Imperium change it's alien policy a little: if Impeirum of Man asked the Tau to join them, would the Tau join the Imperium?

If somewhere along the line it would benefit the Tau, they might. If they were threatened with extermination if they didn't, well, they're not idiots. They know when they're screwed.

TrollPie wrote:
And Tau very rarely kill anyone as long as they don't attack them. The only example where they weren't given the option of joining was Nimbosa

Incorrect. Nimbosa was given the chance to join, but Nimbosa did not want to join. The Tau then assaulted to "enlighten" the planet.

where the commander of the strike force was executed for brutality.

Incorrect. Brightsword was not "executed". He was censured for the brutality he employed against the Guard he fought planetside.

There's a difference. Censure is a fancier way of saying "warned not to do that again".

Even a small change in "Kill the Alien" would probably cause the inception of a civil war in the Imperium. I don't think either side would want the entire other side to "join" but I think peaceful coexistance would be possible if a treaty were signed and adhered to. It'd never happen because it wouldn't be grimdark enough and would result in less skulls to put on GW models.

they call it the greater good for a reason. The opposite being the greater evil. All things outside of the greater good=greater evil. Evil from any viewpoint is to be killed. Thus civilians that did not join the greater good are evil and should be killed.

wanax wrote:they call it the greater good for a reason. The opposite being the greater evil. All things outside of the greater good=greater evil. Evil from any viewpoint is to be killed. Thus civilians that did not join the greater good are evil and should be killed.

And your title rocks

Brother Coa wrote:Here is a fine question that get to my mind.

Suppose that Imperium change it's alien policy a little: if Impeirum of Man asked the Tau to join them, would the Tau join the Imperium?

No. Same reason no one allies, Tau think they are "more right" than anyone else.

Kanluwen wrote:
There's a difference. Censure is a fancier way of saying "warned not to do that again".

Wow, you're story is really different from this one:

Humiliated, Brightsword stole a ship and fled, looking for one of Farsight's Enclaves. But he had to stop to refuel on Fi'ri'os and so the newly appointed Commander Shadowsun and her soldiers caught up with him. In the middle of a street on a city on Fi'ri'os, Brightsword unsheathed a knife, cried "For Farsight!" and charged Shadowsun. Shadowsun replied by making her Fusion Blasters do the talking for her.

agnosto wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
There's a difference. Censure is a fancier way of saying "warned not to do that again".

Wow, you're story is really different from this one:

Humiliated, Brightsword stole a ship and fled, looking for one of Farsight's Enclaves. But he had to stop to refuel on Fi'ri'os and so the newly appointed Commander Shadowsun and her soldiers caught up with him. In the middle of a street on a city on Fi'ri'os, Brightsword unsheathed a knife, cried "For Farsight!" and charged Shadowsun. Shadowsun replied by making her Fusion Blasters do the talking for her.

Cite a source, because that reads like fanfic

No. The Imperium doesn't support the Tau's idea of the 'Greater Good.'

To the OP: Probably not. Most civvies would be offered a chance to join the Tau (and a bunch of propaganda to help that along). Think of the Tau as being like communists with really good PR. They want other worlds to see that 'See? People who join us are happier and healthier than people who stayed with their Imperial masters.' This encourages more worlds to defect, or surrender without a fight, or switch sides once actual shooting starts. It makes future battles harder for the Imperium since the civilian populace isn't so sure they don't want to be Tau.

There is some suggestion that the Tau are not as nice as they appear to be. The work camps joke aside (it's possible, but I have never seen support of it. Not saying it isn't there, just that I haven't seen it.) the Tau are just as evil as everyone esle in the 40k universe. There is some suggestion that the Tau will chemically or medically sterilize the native population of the world, so that the 'happy, healthy, productive' population dies out in a generation or so anyway, paving the way for actual Tau colonists.

And, of course, more converts to the Greater Good means more people to stick on the front lines to suck up those nasty Imperial bullets, while the Tau remain safely ensconced in their Broadsides.

Long story short, not unless they have to. The Tau consider the humans to be more valuable as PR tools than as corpses.

As I've said before, there is a novel series with a group of aliens very very similar to the Tau (idealogically and operationally). It's called The Damned, by Alan Dean Foster, the first book is called A Call to Arms. I highly recommend it, both because it is one of the best sci-fi books I have ever read, and because the ideology of the Amplitur is very close to the Tau.

Kanluwen wrote:

agnosto wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
There's a difference. Censure is a fancier way of saying "warned not to do that again".

Wow, you're story is really different from this one:

Humiliated, Brightsword stole a ship and fled, looking for one of Farsight's Enclaves. But he had to stop to refuel on Fi'ri'os and so the newly appointed Commander Shadowsun and her soldiers caught up with him. In the middle of a street on a city on Fi'ri'os, Brightsword unsheathed a knife, cried "For Farsight!" and charged Shadowsun. Shadowsun replied by making her Fusion Blasters do the talking for her.

Cite a source, because that reads like fanwankery.

Last Chancers, forget which one.

So basically, you're citing "Kill Team" and a battle that was at that time not in the Tau codex.


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As a sidenote:
This lack of information and complete and utter stupidity of the timeline for Tau?

Yeah. This is why it's hard to have a discussion about the Tau.

Tau, do accept imperial citizens if they agree to follow, but i also think that if the imperium devoted any significant amount of recourses to the elimation of the tau, then... the tau would go bye bye, as much as i like the tau

Kanluwen wrote:So basically, you're citing "Kill Team" and a battle that was at that time not in the Tau codex.


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As a sidenote:
This lack of information and complete and utter stupidity of the timeline for Tau?

Yeah. This is why it's hard to have a discussion about the Tau.

Meh. You're usually the one that argues that black library books are canon. Cherry-pick much?

Agreed, that's why arguments are inevitable with Tau discussions because GW was even more vague than usual when they wrote the fluff. Hopefully the next codex will be more consistant but I'm not going to hold my breath.