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Ok so while I'm all for new models and while the models being premiered look great the whole Storm of Magic bit dosen't make sense to me.

1. 8th edition makes it so that creatures like those being introduced in SoM are easier to kill and less viable options to take. And then they come out with a book that details 40 some odd monsters that any army can take. "Oh yeah let's make it so that monsters and such aren't as viable and then focus on making a bunch of new monsters".

2. The article on GW USA says that ANY army can use the monsters in the book, while this balances things out rules wise by allowing everyone to have something it completly flies in the face of almost every piece of fluff written. How is someone going to be able to justify taking a Chimera in a Dwarfen army? Or how about a Manticore for Lizardmen? of course there are some exceptions and fluff based allowances in addition to counts as monsters "I'm thinking of a clockwork dragon called a Rune Wyrm for Dwarfs). But most of it just dosen't make sense.

What do you guys think?

Shoo Dwarfy and let us play with our magic and monsters! In all honesty I think dwarves just got overlooked but at the sametime this is terrible for everyoneelse. The big new monsters only soak up cannon fire as you said and the new magic is meh...but dwarves can still deal. Over all i think it is like apoc and should be treated as such

But dwarves get to use magic!?
Somehow
in a twisted vortex of logic

Went through the newsletter about the SoM and was not impressed by monsters turning up in several armies

Giants with WE for example looks like they just ran out of ideas. To be fair the logistics of creating and producing a new monster for every army would be difficult.

Also it looks like it would cost an arm and a leg for all the gubbins

I dare say it will prove popular and good luck to those who will enjoy it, but not for me thanks

The point of the monsters isn't to be monstrous terrors on the battlefield, the point of the monsters is to assassinate enemy wizards sitting on fulcrums (only way to get them is basically a one on one duel).

As for the monsters themselves, as I understand it, they are mostly of the generic sort and they are bent to the will of the user with magic(OR in the case of dwarves, runes of binding), etc. so there is really nothing unfluffy about it. Its not like they are letting dwarves field ratogres or anything like that.

In any case, this is definitely not like apoc. Its not really meant to be the fantasy big game system (as witnessed by the fact that the magic dice pool is not intended to scale), its more like cities of death or planetstrike: a different way to play with a focus on a certain type of warfare, in this case primarily magic but also monsters (you'll notice there is no mention of siege engines or anything of the sort).

Thanks for the explaination Chaos
So the monster allocation to armies does not impact on standard games.
Misunderstood the purpose of the book!

chaos0xomega wrote:The point of the monsters isn't to be monstrous terrors on the battlefield, the point of the monsters is to assassinate enemy wizards sitting on fulcrums (only way to get them is basically a one on one duel).

That would be a serious waste of points, the point of monsters is to be monsterous.

As for the monsters themselves, as I understand it, they are mostly of the generic sort and they are bent to the will of the user with magic(OR in the case of dwarves, runes of binding), etc. so there is really nothing unfluffy about it. Its not like they are letting dwarves field ratogres or anything like that.

Nothing was said in the article about how Dwarfs will be able to do it if they can so for that we have to wait till they say something or for the book to come out. And being able to cast a spell to summon some monster dosen't make the examples I put any fluffier considering there are some armies that would never have anything to do with some of the monsters shown and even have fluff of activley hunting them down.

In any case, this is definitely not like apoc. Its not really meant to be the fantasy big game system (as witnessed by the fact that the magic dice pool is not intended to scale), its more like cities of death or planetstrike: a different way to play with a focus on a certain type of warfare, in this case primarily magic but also monsters (you'll notice there is no mention of siege engines or anything of the sort).

This is true but at the same time no one said it was supposed to be like apoc. At least not in this thread lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oops nevermind I take that last part back my bad

The Dwarfs are unique in that they cannot command the Winds of Magic as other races do, so instead, they utilise Ancestor Runes. These ancient artefacts can be struck from atop an Arcane Fulcrum, their powers ranging from direct damage to healing your units. The Ancestor Rune of Grungni even enables a Dwarf unit to re-roll all failed To Hit rolls in close combat in addition to the Fight in Extra Ranks rules. Consider that proposition with a unit of Hammerers or Slayers for a moment. Another skill for which the Dwarfs are famed is their ability to effectively shut down the enemy Magic phase. With the sheer quantity of power dice flying around in Storm of Magic games, this is certainly harder to achieve, but there is no doubt that Dwarfs can easily generate a huge number of Dispel dice. In addition, they have easy access to multiple Runes of Spellbreaking, unlike the single Dispel Scroll available to every other race.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?catId=&categoryId=cat640007a§ion=&pIndex=5&aId=17000009a&start=6&multiPageMode=true

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:But dwarves get to use magic!?
Somehow
in a twisted vortex of logic

Went through the newsletter about the SoM and was not impressed by monsters turning up in several armies

Giants with WE for example looks like they just ran out of ideas. To be fair the logistics of creating and producing a new monster for every army would be difficult.

Giants with Wood Elves isn't too absurd of an idea, however. Giants tended towards being wandering vagabonds who'd fight for anyone who treated them nice.

They're like enormous lost puppy dogs that follow you home.

And then club your home when it tries to 'eat' you.

Anyways. The "monsters turning up in several armies" seems to be limited towards the 'generic' monsters like Hydras, Cockatrices, Chimeras, and the really big riderless Dragons. They're also mentioned to require something called a "Scroll of Binding" which implies there's some kind of magical mindmessery going on in those cases.

Thanks Kanners
It is all making sense now.

When I got the newsletter and read the descrption of SoM it was 4:30...
in the morning.

My brain was working at 10% efficiency. 10% of next to nothing is not a lot! I could have sworn that it said that the dwarves had a wizard ?!

Well...Dwarfs have always kind of/sort of had Wizards in the form of Runelords.

The end effect(Magic!) is achieved through different means though.

I know, but I honestly thought it said Wizards and magic, as in something new and distinct from Runes and Runesmiths, that had been shoe horned in.

Sleep deprivation is not good

Dwarfs get Ancestor Runes, hence their summoning or whatever. Still, meh. I'll just play it for the lulz, but I'm liking the idea of pacts or whatever. I can bring back Beastmen + WoC lists! =D

Cryonicleech wrote:Still, meh. I'll just play it for the lulz,

And that's the point. This isn't an expansion to make the game tighter for tournaments, it's an expansion so you can plonk your army down with a new monster or two and laugh while you obliterate each other with spells and assassinate wizards with said monsters.

Yeah, I don't think SoM is intended in any way to be for super serious games. It seems more like rules to have crazy battles with almost all your models. It also gives me the chance to buy a Lammasu.

off topic- In the White Dwarf though it has a little box & "Finecast" around the Cold One- those are already made in plastic so...?

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:

The Dwarfs are unique in that they cannot command the Winds of Magic as other races do, so instead, they utilise Ancestor Runes. These ancient artefacts can be struck from atop an Arcane Fulcrum, their powers ranging from direct damage to healing your units. The Ancestor Rune of Grungni even enables a Dwarf unit to re-roll all failed To Hit rolls in close combat in addition to the Fight in Extra Ranks rules. Consider that proposition with a unit of Hammerers or Slayers for a moment. Another skill for which the Dwarfs are famed is their ability to effectively shut down the enemy Magic phase. With the sheer quantity of power dice flying around in Storm of Magic games, this is certainly harder to achieve, but there is no doubt that Dwarfs can easily generate a huge number of Dispel dice. In addition, they have easy access to multiple Runes of Spellbreaking, unlike the single Dispel Scroll available to every other race.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?catId=&categoryId=cat640007a§ion=&pIndex=5&aId=17000009a&start=6&multiPageMode=true

4 ranks of Hammerers that reroll misses, yes please!

I does look like this expansion in going to be very interesting and I am very interested in getting a Lord on Manticore.

I kinda understand the 'common monsters' idea, after all, when you summon a monster, it's just genna' be whatever was nearby that you could bend to your will.

I get it, I just don't want to play it.

The fluff was quite blatantly thrown together just to shift plastic. It really is the Fantasy equivalent of Planetstrike. Strange rules with vague background writing to try and justify it all.

I don't really play the game, and if I did, I wouldn't do it competitively, so I don't really understand the ins and outs of it all. It looks to me like quite good fun though, magic and monsters being my favourite things in fantasy.


I think that's a new sculpt, more dinosaur-esque, and there's no lizard on its back. Why it's in finecast though, is totally beyond me

giant stegadon wrote:
off topic- In the White Dwarf though it has a little box & "Finecast" around the Cold One- those are already made in plastic so...?