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Very soon I have a game against a friend who has a DE army, I have no clue how I will stand a chance against them with CSM. I played his army with my BT and it didnt go very well lol. So I now know the MEQ killing ability DE have.

I really dont know anything I could use thats very effective against DE from the CSMs. The only time I beat his DE I've done it with my IG army. So I know how to kill them as IG and I know how to get killed by them as any sort of MEQ. But I can't exactly run a CSM army like a IG army so I pretty much am just gonna start from scratch on what to use on him that might be good.

Any crticism would be great, lol. Other than, "Dont even put your army on the board lol". Because that was my first thought lol. 0% chance of me winning this one lol.

Heres a rough list:

1500pt chaos vs DE
HQ
DP-MoT, wings, BoC=175

DP-MoS, wings, Lash=155

Elite
Termi(3)-Combiplas x1, RAC=125

Termi(3)-Combiplas x1, RAC=125


Heavy
havoc(5)-4 ML=155

havoc(5)-4 ML=155

oblit(2)=150

Troop

CSM(10)-plas, champ, pf, rhino, iocg=250

CSM(10)-plas, rhino, iocg=210

Looks very different from my normal lists I run, so I'm guessing it will probably suck lol. CC welcome lol.

I would try and get 3 Combi-plasmas in each Terminator squad, its 6 shots compared to the 5 you have now, and to be honest, the Terminators are only likely to get one turn of shooting.

I think Havocs could actually be better than Oblits against DE, because of all the S8 Dark Lances about, insta killing the Oblits. Only thing that might be a good idea is getting 2/3 more men in those squads. Maybe the Chaos Marines aren't really worth ithere, especially if you don't have 2 special weapons.

I can't remember if CSM can take a ML in a squad of 5 (rarely take CSM, can't remember much about there wargear atm) or even a plasma, because i would be tempted to run them as 5 man squads, and have 7-8 in the havoc squad. As many ML and Plasmas as you can fit. Heavy Bolters would also be useful as well, although they are an after thought in a way.

Ahh, just checked Dex, and you can't take ML unless you have 10 in a squad.
If you have the models, try something like this maybe:

2 Daemon Princes
2x 3 Termies (3 Combi-plasmas)
4x 5 CSM (Plasma)
25 Havocs (spread out into 3 squds, 8 ML, 4 HB)
Thats about 1500 points a fair ammount of fire power.
this is assuming your opponent is using a fully mechanised DE army, if not this list may not be the best option (it may not be the best option anyway)

If you want a army that hurts DE get a terminator squad(5-man) upgrade them all to be champions with lightning claws and put them in a land raider (as dedicated transport) with extra armour no more upgrades for the land raider, and that should round you up to 250pts (i know costly...but you should see those 25 power weapon attacks ...yes a nice little stocking filler for your army).

rodgers37 wrote:I would try and get 3 Combi-plasmas in each Terminator squad, its 6 shots compared to the 5 you have now, and to be honest, the Terminators are only likely to get one turn of shooting.

I think Havocs could actually be better than Oblits against DE, because of all the S8 Dark Lances about, insta killing the Oblits. Only thing that might be a good idea is getting 2/3 more men in those squads. Maybe the Chaos Marines aren't really worth ithere, especially if you don't have 2 special weapons.

I can't remember if CSM can take a ML in a squad of 5 (rarely take CSM, can't remember much about there wargear atm) or even a plasma, because i would be tempted to run them as 5 man squads, and have 7-8 in the havoc squad. As many ML and Plasmas as you can fit. Heavy Bolters would also be useful as well, although they are an after thought in a way.

Ahh, just checked Dex, and you can't take ML unless you have 10 in a squad.
If you have the models, try something like this maybe:

2 Daemon Princes
2x 3 Termies (3 Combi-plasmas)
4x 5 CSM (Plasma)
25 Havocs (spread out into 3 squds, 8 ML, 4 HB)
Thats about 1500 points a fair ammount of fire power.
this is assuming your opponent is using a fully mechanised DE army, if not this list may not be the best option (it may not be the best option anyway)

Yeah, I'm going to take out the RAC more than likely. Probably just going to do all combi-plasma.

I cant really be running the CSMs in such small squads because I'm going to be playing a kill points game, and my friend is going to shoot them with raiders all day which will negate their 3+. So I'm thinking just bring ten and in rhinos for survivability.

And I'm deffinelty going to re-write my list in a little while to really focus on the heavy weapon spamming. Hes going to have something like 6 or more raiders and ravagers lol.

And I'm concerned about the DPs because of all the 4+poison on the table with rerolls to hit (splinter racks).

One thing Ive considered is taking out the termis and instead running chosen as my elite choice. So I can REALLY spam heavy weapons lol.

B-DWAGGG wrote:

rodgers37 wrote:I would try and get 3 Combi-plasmas in each Terminator squad, its 6 shots compared to the 5 you have now, and to be honest, the Terminators are only likely to get one turn of shooting.

I think Havocs could actually be better than Oblits against DE, because of all the S8 Dark Lances about, insta killing the Oblits. Only thing that might be a good idea is getting 2/3 more men in those squads. Maybe the Chaos Marines aren't really worth ithere, especially if you don't have 2 special weapons.

I can't remember if CSM can take a ML in a squad of 5 (rarely take CSM, can't remember much about there wargear atm) or even a plasma, because i would be tempted to run them as 5 man squads, and have 7-8 in the havoc squad. As many ML and Plasmas as you can fit. Heavy Bolters would also be useful as well, although they are an after thought in a way.

Ahh, just checked Dex, and you can't take ML unless you have 10 in a squad.
If you have the models, try something like this maybe:

2 Daemon Princes
2x 3 Termies (3 Combi-plasmas)
4x 5 CSM (Plasma)
25 Havocs (spread out into 3 squds, 8 ML, 4 HB)
Thats about 1500 points a fair ammount of fire power.
this is assuming your opponent is using a fully mechanised DE army, if not this list may not be the best option (it may not be the best option anyway)

Yeah, I'm going to take out the RAC more than likely. Probably just going to do all combi-plasma.

I cant really be running the CSMs in such small squads because I'm going to be playing a kill points game, and my friend is going to shoot them with raiders all day which will negate their 3+. So I'm thinking just bring ten and in rhinos for survivability.

And I'm deffinelty going to re-write my list in a little while to really focus on the heavy weapon spamming. Hes going to have something like 6 or more raiders and ravagers lol.

And I'm concerned about the DPs because of all the 4+poison on the table with rerolls to hit (splinter racks).

One thing Ive considered is taking out the termis and instead running chosen as my elite choice. So I can REALLY spam heavy weapons lol.

Taking out terminators is a BIG mistake as if you have icons or dedicated transport they become you best friends

happygolucky wrote:

B-DWAGGG wrote:

rodgers37 wrote:I would try and get 3 Combi-plasmas in each Terminator squad, its 6 shots compared to the 5 you have now, and to be honest, the Terminators are only likely to get one turn of shooting.

I think Havocs could actually be better than Oblits against DE, because of all the S8 Dark Lances about, insta killing the Oblits. Only thing that might be a good idea is getting 2/3 more men in those squads. Maybe the Chaos Marines aren't really worth ithere, especially if you don't have 2 special weapons.

I can't remember if CSM can take a ML in a squad of 5 (rarely take CSM, can't remember much about there wargear atm) or even a plasma, because i would be tempted to run them as 5 man squads, and have 7-8 in the havoc squad. As many ML and Plasmas as you can fit. Heavy Bolters would also be useful as well, although they are an after thought in a way.

Ahh, just checked Dex, and you can't take ML unless you have 10 in a squad.
If you have the models, try something like this maybe:

2 Daemon Princes
2x 3 Termies (3 Combi-plasmas)
4x 5 CSM (Plasma)
25 Havocs (spread out into 3 squds, 8 ML, 4 HB)
Thats about 1500 points a fair ammount of fire power.
this is assuming your opponent is using a fully mechanised DE army, if not this list may not be the best option (it may not be the best option anyway)

Yeah, I'm going to take out the RAC more than likely. Probably just going to do all combi-plasma.

I cant really be running the CSMs in such small squads because I'm going to be playing a kill points game, and my friend is going to shoot them with raiders all day which will negate their 3+. So I'm thinking just bring ten and in rhinos for survivability.

And I'm deffinelty going to re-write my list in a little while to really focus on the heavy weapon spamming. Hes going to have something like 6 or more raiders and ravagers lol.

And I'm concerned about the DPs because of all the 4+poison on the table with rerolls to hit (splinter racks).

One thing Ive considered is taking out the termis and instead running chosen as my elite choice. So I can REALLY spam heavy weapons lol.

Taking out terminators is a BIG mistake as if you have icons or dedicated transport they become you best friends

Not when they deepstrike get one round of shooting then are shot to nothingness by raiders. Something about wounding on 2+ and no saves for me, but a lowsy 5+ invul.

Versus most armies your advise about termis in a LR with LCs would be good, but vs raider spam I would stand a 0% chance of winning lol. It would literally be the worst possible spam list to use against my friends army all his stuff is AP2 or AP1. So termis kind of lose their usefulness when their best attribute (terminator armor) gets negated every shot. And Termis in CC with witchs, I'd be in CC all day....Till the Incubi come up with the Archon, lol.

Just want to point out my list was same account of KP.
I just think that the extra shots will be more useful. Because rhinos are going down turn one to that many lance shots...

rodgers37 wrote:Just want to point out my list was same account of KP.
I just think that the extra shots will be more useful. Because rhinos are going down turn one to that many lance shots...

Ok, I see your reasoning now lol. That might actually be better than the rhinos. More than likely hes going to be using decingrators though or whatever they're called. The S5 AP2 one. So hes very ready for a footslogging army lol.

What I think Im going to do is take elements of you list you helped me with (small CSM squads to get more plas) and then I'll take my list and then drop the termis and bring in chosen for even more anti-raider spam.