Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

This is an idea for nanosuits.

is it undercosted?


Nanosuit 28 pp,
Elite take no slot
Post-human warrior WS3 BS4 S3 T3 W1 I3 A2 Ld10 Sv 4+


Special Rules:
Hit and run, Infiltrate
Post human Warriors
All Members of the nanosuit squad are subject to the fearless special rule
Commando:
These units can neither score nor contest objectives


Wargear:
M12 Nova
Scar
Nanosuit 1
(The sergeant instead has a nanosuit 2)

OPTIONS
May take a nanosuit 2 for… 20
may exchange their Scar for one of the following:
Sniper Rifle… 10 points
X-43 Mike… 15 points
Gauss Rifle… 20 points
If none of the above are chosen...
may take an underslung gauss attachment on their scars…. 5 points ea.
[This works like a Combi weapon.]
Any model may replace their Scar For a Grendel… 5 points
Or a Scarab… 5 points
Any model may replace their M12 nova for a…
Hammer… 2 points
Majestic… 10 points


M12 Nova:
Range 12” S3 AP- Pistol

Hammer:
Range 12” S3 AP5 Pistol

Majestic:
Range 18” S4 AP4 Pistol

Scar:
Range 24” S4 AP- Assault 2

Grendel:
Range 30” S5 AP4 Assault 1

Scarab:
Range 18” S4 AP- Assault 3

Sniper Rifle:
Range 36” S- AP6 Heavy 1, Sniper

X-43 Mike
Range 12” S8 AP1 Assault 1, Melta

Gauss Rifle:
Range 36” S- AP4 Heavy 1, Imperial Gauss
Imperial Gauss:
Is strength 5 versus vehicles, and wounds all models on a 3+, it maintains the Rending rule

Gauss attachment:
Range 12” S- AP4 Heavy 1, Imperial gauss

The two nanosuits have their own rules.
Nanosuit 1:
The nano suit applies a 4+ armour save, representing it’s armour.

It has four modes, each chosen at the beginning of the shooting phase. You may only choose one, but different models may have different modes.
- Armour: Default mode, This applies heightened armour and reduced pressure on the body as a bullet hits. As a result, it allows the model to shrug off more powerful shots than it would usually be able to.
o This gains the user a 3+ armour save, and a 6+ invulnerable save
o +1 to toughness
o The user may not run or join an assault
- Speed: This makes the users actions much faster than he would’ve been before, allowing him to move with much greater speed and agility
o This gives the user the Fleet of foot special rule
o +2 to initiative
o May fleet 3D6 choose the highest.
- Strength: this allows the users actions to be done with a much heftier blow, or with more stability. This is the ability of combat and shooting.
o The user gains +1 strength
o The user gains +1 BS
- Stealth: The user is literally cloaked, making them hard to fire at, and impossible to see at range, however, should they become fired upon, they will be weak to attack at any range, as most of the suits power is diverted to cloaking.
o The to hit this model, the enemy must shoot as if shooting in night fighting.
o If the mission is night fighting, they may not be shot at, or assaulted for the duration.
o The user may not shoot.
o The user gains the stealth rule.
o The users armour save is reduced to 5+.

The Nanosuit two builds on the tech of the first, being more capable and more powerful than its predecessor, it combines modes, and allows them to work more fluidly.

The suit also gives the user a 4+ armour save, and a 6+ invulnerable save. In addition, should the model be killed put him on his side, in the following turn, roll a D6 [after the assault phase but before moving onto the next phase.] on a 6, the model is put upright again. If not, or if the unit is stuck in combat or would land over enemy models, he is removed automatically.

The nanosuit as only three modes
- Armour: The armour in this situation is not quite so standard, and is something of an assault tool.
o It affords the user a 3+ armour save and a 5+ invulnerable save
o +1 to toughness
o The user may not run or join an assault.
- Power: the speed and strength modes are integrated into one mode, and afford more power to the user. In addition, this mode can intergrate with either armour or stealth, abiding by the drawbacks of each
o The user gains the fleet rule,
o +2 to initiative
o +1 to strength
o +1 to BS
o And may Fleet 3D6 choose the highest
- Cloak mode: the cloak applied now is more effective, and even allows the user to fire while using the cloak, but the cloak is particularly poor at taking damage.
o If the model hasn’t moved, it may fire a scarab or a sniper rifle.
o If the model has moved, it may fire the M12 nova or the Hammer.
o Gains the stealth rules
o The users armour save is reduced to 6+
o The to hit this model, the enemy must shoot as if shooting in night fighting.
o If the mission is night fighting, they may not be shot at, or assaulted for the duration.

This looks rally cool . . . not over costed . . . at least in my opinion.

What FOC slot do they take?

Nice.
these are great rules but maybe a bit over winded in the rules section.
still. incredibley good though.

thanks for the feedback

I assume elites is probably the best place for them
I also built them to be IG, but I think that they'd replace storm troops, who are useless anyway.
or, at least, only nominally useful

I REALLY don't like commando rule. IMHO it must be change because it's not good at all.
You can really make them into 10 separate units, all with fancy gear but only get one KP when you kill at least 5 of them?

Do they act as different units then "independent"?
If they do and wounds don't go from one to another when not maintaining coherency this is pretty OP rule. Also they can all shoot different target, others are not bound by one model being assaulted and many more. This rule is giving way, waaay too much bonuses and should never exist.

If they do count as a unit, it's really strange that some guy can die half of battlefield away from another model.

too complicated

Macock, have you played Crysis 1?

If you haven't then don't comment.
if you have, you'll realise they don't act as a squad. they're commando and therefore act alone.

what this rule means is that YES the can each attack different targets... but how powerful are they really? The most they're getting is 3 kills.

IF each of ten models counted as one killpoint, then surely you'd be getting 10 unfair killpoints?

I suppose it works like combat squads, but that each model is alone. the reason you only have to kill five or 3 is because if you had to kill the entire squad, you'd be targetting too few guys.

HOWEVER: to compensate, that squad may fire at multiple nanosuits, meanint they have potential to kill more than one of the.

I suppose they could attack any nanosuit within shooting range. would that make more sense?

I have no idea why are you so aggressive.
I did play Crysis 1 but that is totally irrelevant. Commando rule is just terrible (in wh40k!!) and it won't work.

To get past kill points rules you are basically disregarding coherency, wound allocation, moving and shooting rules. Plus it takes one FoC slot only. You are not just bringing something unique to the game - you are drastically changing many core rules to the game. Why do you think jotww is so frowned upon? Because among other things it does the same thing, maybe even less so.

And 10 killpoints for 10 units is NOT unfair. Every unit in wh40k is working according to this. There are SOME additional rules to this like in Space wolves but still it's the same principle - if you (don't) kill a unit - you get KP.
You are trying to do - if you kill 5 units -> you are getting 1 KP. Another 5 units are not worth squat.
Besides, even if they would be 1KP each, think how annoying they would be in objective missions which are 2/3 of games (depending on environment of course).

Many units should work as independent models but they don't because it would bring too much unbalance and chaos to the game.

This is MSU to the extreme and taking away all drawbacks.
It's a cool idea but it won't work in squad oriented game like 40k. Those units should be used in some skirmish game where everything already is independent by default.

The unit should work more like Heralds or Haemonculi. You can buy X amount and they operate individually and each give up their own KP.

It doesn't matter how they work in a video game, they have to work for 40k.

I could do that, but y'see, I'm trying not to force someone to have to take five killpoints in one option. If they wre nonscoring, and couldn't contest, that'd solve that problem.

As an observation, the nanosuit is very similiar to the assassian synthskin suit. I would give the 4+ armor save, and instead of the 6++ invuln use the 6+ FnP.

So 4+ armor 6+ FnP
Armor grants 3+ armor 5+invuln.

As an aside, do we need 4 modes? I mean, they simplified the modes because it just makes sense, not so much because the suits are different. The difference between speed and strength in the first game was silly... if you are strong enough to jump that high you are strong enough to run faster. If you are enhanced to run faster then your melee attacks will do signifigantly more damage.

Not sure about a toughness increase... The armor was useful versus things like terrain (falling damage) right? That is why I bumped up the invuln save, as Invuln saves are useful versus dangerous terrain.

Power mode should not be +1 bs, it should be relentless. After all, it reduced recoil and allowed you to fire on the move.

As a compromise on the KP issue, I suggest a team approach. Have each nanosuit team be a 4 man unit, and you can buy 3 such units for 1 elite slot if you like. 1 member of each squad can carry a heavy weapon, 1 member is the sarge.

In crysis 1, the nanoteams operated individually partially because their aerial assault got jacked up... you start hunting for the rest of your team after all, and (spoiler) everyone is dead or stuck on the other side of the island so the FPS can do the tried and true 1 man army deal.

As for weapons... the Scar is pretty much the defination of a small caliber rapid fire weapon. So s3 ap- rapidfire 24 inches. Shotguns are of course s3 r12 ap-- assault 2. An IG heavy stubber is more or less a pintle mounted .50 cal, and that is s4 ap6. The scar is nowhere near .50 cal in power, so I would stay at s3.

So in the end, my Nanosuit team would look like:

WS3 BS4 S3 T3 W1 I3 A2 LD8 Armor 4+
Infiltrate, Deepstrike

Squad Composition: 3 Nanosuit Veterans and 1 Nanosuit Veteran Sargent for 50 points. 1-3 Squads may be taken for 1 elite slot in an imperial guard army.

Synthskin: Nanosuit teams wear a bonded suit that acts as a second skin. This also provides additional toughness, represented by a special Feel no Pain, but on a 6+ instead of 4+.

Nanosuit Modes: While not as extensive as the modifications that Imperial Assassians recieve, Nanosuit teams can focus their suits energy to provide near assassian combat abilities in a limited field. All suits are deployed in the mode of the players choice, and at the start of the players turn they can switch to another mode. This new mode stays in effect until the player changes it at the start of one of their subsequent turns.

Armor: The suit hardens, providing a 5+ invuln save, and a 3+ armor save.

Power: With extra power to the augmented muscles, the suit add +1 strenght, +1 init, fleet, and relentless.

Stealth: The suit appears to become translucent, being almost invisible. Enemies must roll using the nightfighting rules to spot the unit. If nightfighting is in effect, half the distance rolled. The unit gains stealth if in cover, or a 5+ cover save in the open. When launching an assault with stealth active, the units close combat attacks are rending.

Weapons: All models come with special issue slug throwing pistols and rifles. These count as las pistols and lasguns. Any model may trade either weapon for a shotgun for no cost, or a sniper rifle for 5 points.
1 Nanosuit veteran may replace one of their weapons with either a Meltagun for 10 points or a Gauss Rifle for 10 points. The Gauss Rifle is s6 ap3 pinning, range 36, heavy 1.
The nanosuit sargant may be equiped with a power weapon for 10 points and a plasma pistol for 10 points, both replacing one of their normal weapons.

So, you took everything from my idea and made it yours? I'm a little upset about that.

No, I don't want the entire list to be just as powerful as a lasgun.

In fact, they should have S3 AP4 at the very least, given the SABOT round is supposed to be good at armour penetration

The sabot rounds fired by the SCAR family are smaller and lighter than the 5.56mm firing solution used by many NATO countries; consequently, the SCAR offers increased ammunition storage per-magazine with zero impact on combat effectiveness. Likewise, the sabot round offers higher muzzle velocity and greater armor penetration than conventional ammunition, being a fin-stabilized hypersonic dart rather than a slug. Field tests confirm that the 4mm sabot exceeds its predecessor in almost every area, from muzzle velocity through flight stability to terminal ballistics.

From http://crysis.wikia.com/wiki/Superior_Combat_Assault_Rifle

Now, the reason why I've given two kinds of armour modes sets is because it might be cheaper to use the weaker armour, points wise.

The nano suit 2 has the ability to maintain core functions until it can be repaired, however, this is gonna mean squad if they start ripping it apart in close assault

I suppose, I could make it a 5+ FNP that doesn't discount should he be T'd out.

Your upset that I solicited feedback on the items you requested feedback on? You dont have to use my ideas, they are just my ideas about improving your concept, which I though was a cool concept.

As for your dislike of the lasgun... you do realize how unbelievably good a lasgun is compared to modern firearms right? You initially posted the scar, a 4mm AP round, to have the same str in 40k as a .50 cal round equiv. A 4mm AP round will have almost no stopping power.

I really like these rules, maybe if they could be streamlined a bit more then it would be awesome not over or under costed at all.