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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/13 20:39:21
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Giggling Nurgling
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Hey all, I've had some moderate success with my Venom spam list, but I've run into some lists that I just can't handle. Here's my list @ 1500pts.
Baron Sathonyx
5 Trueborn
3 Blaster
Venom w/ Splinter Cannons
5 Trueborn
3 Blaster
Venom w/ Splinter Cannons
5 Trueborn
3 Blaster
Venom w/ Splinter Cannons
5 Warriors
Blaster
Venom w/ Splinter Cannons
5 Warriors
Blaster
Venom w/ Splinter Cannons
5 Warriors
Blaster
Venom w/ Splinter Cannons
5 Warriors
Blaster
Venom w/ Splinter Cannons
Ravager w/ Flickerfield and Nightshield
Ravager w/ Flickerfield and Nightshield
Ravager w/ Flickerfield and Nightshield
I've ran into a major stomp-a-thon last night against my tau buddy. He was running missile pod spam, which is a huge pain in the ass for my whimpy skimmers. Also a few rails here and there. The main issue I'm having is autocannon dreadnaughts. I can't deal with them. They're always deployed in the back and in cover, and so are a pain in the ass to hit. Melta spam is also a huge pain in the ass. How do you guys run these kind of lists?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/13 20:44:47
Subject: Re:Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Sinewy Scourge
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I like Venoms, I just don't like pure Venom spam. The issues I have are:
a. You start to lost a lot of your power really fast when things start blowing up.
b. You lack ranged anti tank. Sure, Blasters have a good range but taking them out of their vehicles early is a suicide mission.
c. You have absolutely no counter assault. Since you are running a Dash clone list the next step is a Beast Master squad. To be honest, I haven't had much success with the unit nor do I like it all that much.
If you are set on this current list. Against things like Tau you need the ability to silence the major units fast. Hit the Broadsides with a Venom or two to kill any drones first. Then use the Ravagers. The rest should prioritize the missile pod Crisis Suits.
Against melta spam...don't get too close. Stay far and pop tanks. If you can focus on ranged or fast units first you can slow and kite the rest.
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2nd Place 2015 ATC--Team 48
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/13 20:54:29
Subject: Re:Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Angered Reaver Arena Champion
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I think the problem you are having is with the nature of your list. It is very one-dimensional, and has no tools to defeat an opponent who can outshoot you.
So the strength of your list is your weakness. Personally, I solve this by adding CC elements, which allow you greater flexibility at the expense of some of your shooting. That's a personal choice, however. You can gamble on not drawing specific opponents or you can weaken yourself against some opponents in order to strengthen against others.
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Sangfroid Marines 5000 pts
Wych Cult 2000
Tau 2000 |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/13 21:07:45
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought
rainbow dashing to your side
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swap the true borns venoms for raiders with lances. that should help somewhat
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/13 21:56:29
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Longtime Dakkanaut
New Zealand
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Well for starters this list makes no sense to me because the Baron has no unit to join, he is tricky enough to use with Beasts and by himself he is really a waste of points. As people have mentioned this is very similar to Dash's list, except his was a 2000pt list and this cuts out so much stuff that it stops working. For anything for than 100 or so points change you should be completely rebuilding the list from scratch.
Other than that you seem to have realised the inherent flaw of pure Venom spam lists which has been largely ignored by the Internet thus far. You are heavily relying on Blasters for anti tank (particularly since the Ravagers are an obvious first target) which leaves you extremely vulnerable to any list with plenty of long ranged anti tank (or close up anti tank if they have the durability and speed to get to you) and enough vehicles that they can negate the Venoms. Simply taking as many Venoms as you can will not give you a well rounded army, sure you shred Footdar and Horde Orks but you really don't need 7 Venoms to do that anyway. Changing things around to give you some better long ranged anti tank (Dark Lances, they are just as good as Blasters since they last longer and fire more in the long run) and some form of assault/keep away threat, even if its only a unit of Wyches (which against Tau becomes a serious offensive threat), would make this list far stronger.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/14 01:59:34
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Longtime Dakkanaut
Beaver Dam, WI
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Venoms are great in that you have a lot of firepower but one weakness is that it means your squad size is small. Not really strong with T3 AC 5 troops. Couple of ways to change it.
3 x Raiders w 10-man Kalabite with Splinter Cannon.
3 x Raiders w 10-man wych with haywire grenades.
instead of 4 x Venoms w 5 kalabites with a blaster.
Better synergy on the 10-man with SC. I dislike it when 4 men are picking their nose while one fires a blaster.
Wych squads offer less firepower but offer some staying power in HTH and hopefully you can keep the enemy PITA units off your back for a turn or two by sucking them into a combat. Though it looks like you are trying to kill them with firepower.
With kalabites, you are trading
48 poison shots with 4 blasters for 3 darklance shots and 12 poison shots at range or 64 poison shots at 12".
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/14 04:07:37
Subject: Re:Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Charing Cold One Knight
Lafayette, IN
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I think the biggest problem with this list is that it is the core of a much larger list. One that has counter assault units, some actual dark lances (so you can shoot first turn without disembarking, and avoid all the lances in the ravagers issue), or possibly units you could offensively deploy. 1500 isn't 2k, so don't run the same core as a 2k list. Run a list that is balanced at its points level, don't just chop off units and call it a 1500 point list.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/14 04:12:55
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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the key to your list is getting an alpha strike, and using cover and range to negate ur opponents firepower.
If your opponent is shooting at you first, your doing it wrong. If your opponent is always in range, your doing it wrong. If your opponent always has a clear shot then your doing it wrong.
are you doing those 3 things?
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5000+ pts. Eldar 2500pts
"The only thing that match's the Eldar's firepower, is their arrogance".
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Maintained a 75% Win Ratio As Eldar in 5th Edition GT's.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/14 11:10:03
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Numberless Necron Warrior
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I have a lot of success with dakka venoms. I fill em with Trueborn with two cannons and three carbines. That is 20 shots at 36" and 29 at 18" after moving 6". I have had lots of success with that. As well as a lot of annoyed looks and cries of "unfair."
But, you have to balance out your list with some close combat or you will get banged up soon. Tau (and any very shooty army) will kill DE fast. So expect to lose there unless you can get their more shooty units either in close combat or dead. So, my advice? Get some boots on the ground to take out other units.
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Life Sucks Press On.
In order of collection:
Space Marines
Necrons
Renegade Guardsmen
Dark Eldar |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/14 13:18:30
Subject: Re:Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Dark Angels Librarian with Book of Secrets
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It's simple: Overspecialize, and you breed in weakness. It's slow death.
-- Major Motoko Kusanagi
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/14 14:29:51
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Unshakeable Grey Knight Land Raider Pilot
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I ran into much the same problem, at this point level, I wouldn't recommend the baron as it is essential a 105 +1 to go first, not a great use of points, A single unit of wyches instead of a unit of kalabites , give them a raider and change your hq to a heamy, and he starts with them for the pain token.
This works out very well, as a counter assault, tar pit unit, if you give haywire grenades to the wyches the first turn vehicle assaults they can pull off are great. If you can get close enough you can also deal with dreads this way. as a 4++ and FNP makes them very survivable.
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http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/399175.page |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/15 06:29:17
Subject: Re:Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Giggling Nurgling
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All right, thanks for all the comments guys. What I'm getting here is that my list is too hyperfocused and isn't balanced enough to take out threats. What about something like this:
Haemonculus 60
Liquifier
haemonculus 60
Liquifier
7 Wyches 184
Hekatrix w/ agonizer
Haywire grenades
Raider w/ flicker
7 Wyches 184
Hekatrix w/ agonizer
Haywire grenades
Raider w/ flicker
5 Warriors 125
Blaster
Venom w/ splinter cannons
5 Warriors 125
Blaster
Venom w/ splinter cannons
5 Warriors 125
Blaster
Venom w/ splinter cannons
3 Trueborn 146
3 Blaster
Venom w/ splinter cannons
3 Trueborn 146
3 Blaster
Venom w/ splinter cannons
Ravager w/ flicker 115
Ravager w/ flicker 115
Ravager w/ flicker 115
I realise this should be going into army lists but whatever, I'm already here.
This new list takes advantage of some of the advice that you guys have given me, namely adding in a close combat element that can also take down vehicles. It's still vehicle spam, which is what I wanted, but it has more answers I think.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/07/16 17:32:00
Subject: Playing Dark Eldar Venom Spam, having issues with certain armies
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Fixture of Dakka
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The new list looks good, adding h2h. In the first list, I was wondering why you had 5 Trueborn, when only 3 had blasters?
Anyway, this is much improved.
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"You can bring any cheesy unit you want. If you lose. Casey taught me that." -Tim S.
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