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HQ:
Coteaz
[100]

Librarian
Shrouding, Warp Rift, Stave
[195]

Elites:
Techmarine
Rad, Psychotroke, Blind, Stave
[145]

Techmarine
Rad, Psychotroke, Blind, Stave
[145]

Techmarine
Rad, Psychotroke, Blind, Stave
[145]

Troops:
(12) Henchmen Warband (Librarian, Tech)
6x DCA
5x Crusaders
1x Banisher w/ Eviscerator
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt
[245]

(12) Henchmen Warband (Coteaz, Tech)
6x DCA
5x Crusaders
1x Banisher w/ Eviscerator
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt
[245]

(12) Henchmen Warband (Tech)
6x DCA
5x Crusaders
1x Banisher w/ Eviscerator
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt
[245]

(5) Henchmen Warband
Meltagun
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt
[80]

(5) Henchmen Warband
Meltagun
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt
[80]

(5) Henchmen Warband
Meltagun
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt
[80]

Heavy:
Land Raider Crusader
Multimelta
[265]

Land Raider Crusader
Multimelta
[265]

Land Raider Crusader
Multimelta
[265]

[2500]

So, the Razorbacks form a wall to cover the Land Raiders - using the Shrouding to help make the saves better and Sanctuary to help forestall assaults. Each assault-oriented squad goes into a Land Raider, letting its empty Razorback screen and pump out S6 HB shots into light armor. The Techmarines join and give the squad all the nasty grenades as well as Hammerhand.

The small Henchmen squads in Razorbacks just park in the backfield and hope nothing too bad happens. Thankfully, the deathstar units are scoring and should be able to chew through the enemy pretty well. The Banishers should multi-assault into tanks, while the rest of the squad spreads out to maximize its damage. A 1/3 chance to steal the first turn is nice, as going first really helps - pop smoke and Shrouding for 3+ cover saves on the Razorbacks / Land Raiders.

The biggest glaring weakness is long-range anti-tank. The HBs will only do so much, but if the Land Raiders get there, its going to be brutal. S8 Eviscerators will help with enemy tanks and having a ~20" threat range out of the Land Raiders, I should be able to catch some of the quicker threats.

Thoughts?

Hmmm... by my calculations... It is not a 1/3 chance to seize the initiative, its roughly a 3/10 chance to seize the initiative. remember, that 4 that you roll first isn't "gone" from the options to choose now, it is placed back in the hat with its fellow numbers to make 1-6

yay for pick 1 two times... 5/6 chance to not pick * 5/6 chance to not pick = 69.4444444 percent chance to get what you wanted. not 66.6666666666 percent

What? If I have a 1/6 chance two times, that is a 1/3 chance overall, isn't it? Simply calculating the chance to steal - nothing else.

No, that's not how probabilities work. Otherwise, if you had seven rerolls, you'd have a 7/6 chance, which doesn't make any sense.

You will win the seize 1/6th of the time naturally, Thus you will fail it 5/6 times. When you fail it, you have another 1/6 chace to seize. Now we add together these chances:

1/6 + 5/6*1/6 = 11/36

Note that this is 1/36 less than 1/3. Not a major difference, roughly 3%, but it's significant.

Math is not my forte. Still, that is a handy tool for an HQ I was already taking anyhow.

I like your list. I made a similar one just today. 3 LR and a henchy assault unit in each. Instead of TMs elites(great fit of course and on many existing list here), I have 3 Callidus assassins. I inserted chimeras, but think PlazorBacks would be better after looking at your list. Even TL assault cannons and psybolts maybe.

@Byte You can't have 3 of the same assassin because they are unique

frogii_the_blue_horror wrote:@Byte You can't have 3 of the same assassin because they are unique

Ahhh, Indeed. Thank you.

I would have been a bit embarrassed showing up at 'ard boys or anywhere else. Guess I'm use to the 0-1 thing and got happy when I didn't see it. Unique is same thing of course.

I think that you do not need 2 different character with your assault unit. I think one is enough.


COTEAZ should go with a shooting unit in a chimera. (jokaero and meltaguns, maybe plasma servitors). He is a shooting support character, not a combat one. He could help against drop pods with combi-meltas or other deep strikers that could ruin your day by taking out the LR's.

the LIBRARIAN should go with an Arco-Flaggelent Henchmen sqaud. you can pay 30 pts for an evicerator, or just cast Might and have every arco hitting at S6 with 2D6 armor penetration AND 5 attacks each. I would recommend maybe 7 arcos and 5 crusaders.

TECHMARINES are with the DCA units. You should only have 2 of those units.

S6 w/ 2d6 or S8 w/ 2d6. I opt for the latter, so I can kill Land Raiders. Also, no Drop Pods will get close enough - I am boxing in the Raiders with Razorbacks, which pairs well with shrouding. Coteaz is good for that, but I am using him for Sanctuary and Hammerhand for the Raider squads. If in testing I find it needed, I could stick him in a Chimera with some MM servitors and a pair of Jokaero just for Reserve elements, buy I am not sure how often that will matter - especially in my meta.

em_en_oh_pee wrote:S6 w/ 2d6 with 5 attacks or S8 w/ 2d6. with 2 attacks

let us look at some math hammer here for a bit.

1 arco with Might vs. Land Raider [stationary]
.69 Glances
1.39 Pens

1 arco with Might and Hammerhand vs. Land Raider [stationary]
.83 Glances
2.08 Pens

1 Banisher with Hammerhand vs. Land Raider [stationary]
.27 Glances
1.16 Pens


Then take in the fact that the Arcos are only 15 points as compared to 30.

Arcos+Librarian=DEATH TO TANKS

in non-librarian units, having a Banisher might be a decent choice, but I am not a big fan of it. It is your call.

HQ:
Coteaz
[100]

Librarian
Warp Rift, Shrouding, Might
[165]

Elites:
Techmarine
Rad, Psychotroke, Blind, Stave
[145]

Techmarine
Rad, Psychotroke, Blind, Stave
[145]

Techmarine
Rad, Psychotroke, Blind, Stave
[145]

Troops:
(9) Henchmen Warband (Tech, Librarian)
5x Death-Cult Assassins
4x Crusaders
[135]

(11) Henchmen Warband (Tech)
6x Death-Cult Assassins
5x Crusaders
[165]

(11) Henchmen Warband (Tech)
6x Death-Cult Assassins
5x Crusaders
[165]

(5) Henchmen Warband (Coteaz)
3x Multimelta Servitors
2x Jokaero
Chimera
Heavy Flamer, Multi-Laser
[155]

(5) Henchmen Warband
Warriors, 1x Meltagun
Razorback w/ TL HB, Psybolt Ammo
[80]

(5) Henchmen Warband
Warriors, 1x Meltagun
Razorback w/ TL HB, Psybolt Ammo
[80]

Fast Attack:
Stormraven
TL Multimelta, TL Assault Cannon
[205]

Stormraven
TL Multimelta, TL Assault Cannon
[205]

Stormraven
TL Multimelta, TL Assault Cannon
[205]

Heavy:
Dreadnought
2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammo
[135]

Dreadnought
2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammo
[135]

Dreadnought
2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammo
[135]

[2500]

Revised list to take advantage of Stormravens, instead of Land Raiders, and adding in some Psyflemen for long-range firepower.

Thoughts?

Solid, give it a go.

I have been toying with similar lists. The big changes would be Ven dreads instead of tech marines and 3 meltas in each squad of assualt based units. One of the units with Acros instead of DCA.

When the Acros are in cover they survive well 4+/4+.

I however do miss the rad and psychotropic grenades. I figure it is a trade off for having the dreads.

all i can say after playing against these silly henchy lists those pysker squads are over the top powerfull... I would run 3 stormies full of goodies, 3 pysker squads in rhinos and 3 dreads... fill in the points after that...

Remember that Henchman do not have assault grenades, so against a smart opponent that deploys in cover your assault Henchman will be hitting last (or at the same time with lucky psychotropic) resulting in them not being able to use their greatest asset I6.

DutchSage wrote:Remember that Henchman do not have assault grenades, so against a smart opponent that deploys in cover your assault Henchman will be hitting last (or at the same time with lucky psychotropic) resulting in them not being able to use their greatest asset I6.

Well, against GK and Daemons, I strike first too. That being said, I am fine with taking some casualties. I still hit like a ton of bricks even if I go last. A lot of invuln saves across the board - 5+ and 3+. The Techmarine will go at Initiative, though, as will the Librarian. That helps some, even if not a lot.

Also, for those of you worried I will wipe out opponents - I think that may be a good thing, especially if its before they swing. Though somewhat durable due to Storm Shields, enough casualties and I am stuck on Ld8, aside from the Librarian's squad. That isn't too great, especially with modifiers. So, if I wipe them out, it might be better to get shot up a bit than to get cut down if I lose combat by not having enough umph.

That being said, I am also considering some of the ideas on this thread:

HQ:
Coteaz
[100]

Librarian
Shrouding, Warp Rift, Might
[165]

Elites:
Techmarine
Stave, Rad, Psychotroke, Blind
[145]

Techmarine
Stave, Rad, Psychotroke, Blind
[145]

Techmarine
Stave, Rad, Psychotroke, Blind
[145]

Troops:
(11) Henchmen Warband (Techmarine)
4x Death-Cult Assassins
4x Crusaders
3x Warriors w/ Meltaguns
[162]

(11) Henchmen Warband (Techmarine)
4x Death-Cult Assassins
4x Crusaders
3x Warriors w/ Meltaguns
[162]

(9) Henchmen Warband (Librarian, Techmarine)
3x Death-Cult Assassins
3x Crusaders
3x Warriors w/ Meltaguns
[132]

(5) Henchmen Warband (Coteaz)
3x Multimelta Servitors
2x Jokaero
Chimera
Heavy Flamer, Multi-Laser, Searchlight
[156]

(5) Strike Squad
Psycannon
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt, Searchlight
[161]

(5) Strike Squad
Psycannon
Razorback
TL HB, Psybolt, Searchlight
[161]

Fast Attack:
Stormraven
TL Multimelta, TL Assault Cannon
[205]

Stormraven
TL Multimelta, TL Assault Cannon
[205]

Stormraven
TL Multimelta, TL Assault Cannon
[205]

Heavy:
Dreadnought
2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammo
[135]

Dreadnought
2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammo
[135]

Dreadnought
2x TL Autocannons, Psybolt Ammo
[135]

[2499]

That is one list I want to test up - sadly, if I get to, it will be for Semi-Finals if at all.

Thoughts?