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Buzzsaws on Deffkoptas go last in close combat. A giant buzzsaw on the front of jetcopter spinning into a mess of enemies will hit them after they hit it...this seems strange. (Yes I always take the upgrade I mean in actuality.)
Buzzsaws double strength and go at normal Initiative order. Won't make the koptas OP, won't make 25 points to little because Orks Initiative isn't very high, and it makes sense as far as what the thing is.

Also, a Runtherd; by killing grots can retake a leadership test. That somehow means that even though you used his leadership to take the test he isn't scared as long as he's killing the little guys around him but that still might make him run? He kills D3 grots to retake a leadership test? I think he should it should be a pass not a retake. (This one is funny so it doesn't bother me.)

There is a KMB on a Deffkopta but no Big Mek or Meks in Deffkoptas...what? Why not exactly, they afraid to fly what they built? Bet not, bet you should give them the option to upgrade a kopta to MekKoppta just giving it the mek rules nothing else. Maybe even allow a Big Mek to take a Deffkopta as an upgrade for +50pnts. Everyone would like a BIGMEK on a Kopta with a KFF. Even my opponents, until you know, they had to face it.(I support this upgrade to the codex, even if it slightly OP it's cool.)

DeffDreds as troop choices so I can feild five of them instead of 3...? Deff Dredds are so great...yes, five of them...yeah, whoopie, BS2, 6 inch walk mayb 6 inch run, no fleet, gonna take out tanks...oh no.. whats that...a skimmer with lance? A skimmer with mela? A jumping unit on an outdated codex that can melta than leap behind cover? A monstrous creature!!!?? A Space Marine Dreadnought!!?? A tank that can shoot me from 48" away and blow me up...? 48"" pshh, I don't care, I've got five dreds...four dreds...two...f*ck your army. I'm just gonna run Kan Wall since there isn't a huge difference in your chances and I'll have more targets. (I apended this to state what I think someone who posted would have said.)
(What would I change it to...? I'd keep it, fielding five dreds would be kinda fun, I was just venting how relatively useless it is .)

I knew a man that once said Warpheads were overpowered, F*** that man. I love warpheads, and I misplayed them by using the MobRule with gretchin for 5 games before catching myself...now not so much with the love. But they're fun... whoops, deepstriked...ha ha ha ha...emmm, why do they scatter when they do that exactly? it's a warp power.
NO SCATTER ON A WARPHEAD/WEIRDBOY deepstrike psyker role. none. That makes sense, if it is so and I've been mislead, you must tell me. Just deepstrike them anywhere and let them land safely. They can't charge anyways and thus have no use so the power won't be OP it will just get rid of that scattered into units or debris crap and make it somewhat nicer for the player who was brave enough to field a weirdboy.

As I generally play orks I won't post my gripes with other codexes. Please only post gripes about codices you play, or my spelling. Your free to gripe about it. And my awkward post, you can gripe about that, because I can't stop you...

Why are Flash Gitz awesome and I don't gripe about them...because with the gits, rolling onez is goooooooooooooooood

I am very sorry but I have little idea what you just said. It sounds like ramblings

Why do meks.

Come modelled with bosspoles.

When they can't take bosspoles.

I...don't see what you're talking about here.
Also, Russ, is that Warboss Aang in your avatar?

What I take away from this: OP is rambling.

Buzzsaws go on I1 for game balance, just like all the other 25 point upgrades that double strength. A double strength on initiative (or even just I2) weapon would be pretty OP by comparison.

The Runtherd is a Ork, not a grot, right? Thus Mobrule exists. It's how they do things. Makes more sense that way than two editions from now you whining about how because there's some (hypthetical) fluke in the rules allowing for the Runtherd to get consolidated into another squad, his not having the special rule removes it from the rest of the squad.

KMB on a Deffkopta... yeah, well, I want powerfists on my infantry sergeants. People in hell want icewater. That's just how it goes.

Deff Dredds are great as a bit of extra support in a Kan Wall. Sounds like maybe you're not doing it right.

True, warpheads aren't amazing, but they have their moments, and they're fun and chaotic, which is at the core exactly what Orks do. I'm confused. If you want a competitive HQ selection, take a Big Mek with KFF or Warboss (or Ghaz if points permitting).

Orks is one of the most fun and competitive 'dexes I've seen. I wished that I had picked them up instead of IG for my first army.

Here's my gripe: The 'nid codex. "Let's make everything bad except the things for which no model exists, which will be mediocre!"

I'm going to move this from 40k proposed rules to 40k general.. and we'll see how it goes.

To the OP : Please take a moment or two to think whether or not you are posting in the correct board, and also please make a bit more of an effort to compose your posts so that they are a bit clearer and easier to understand. Ta.

I think the mek "bosspole" is suppolsed to be one of its tools... but yea it looks liek a bosspole and its annoying that when you buy a loota and burna box you have to get a mek model 4 burnas or 4 lootas and an obligatory mek ... nobody uses the mek upgrade unless it's with burnas in a wagon and even then its a sometimes take 1 deal.. make the loota/burna box come with 5 real burnas or 5 real loota options... mek kit inclused as a replacment or mek as a stand alone model. nobody needs that many meks

You are using the buzzsaw on vehicles for the most part so what's the big deal if I1.

reds8n wrote: I'm going to move this from 40k proposed rules to 40k general.. and we'll see how it goes.

To the OP : Please take a moment or two to think whether or not you are posting in the correct board, and also please make a bit more of an effort to compose your posts so that they are a bit clearer and easier to understand. Ta.

Yeah sorry it was one in the morning and I was rambling, no proposed rules, somebody spotted what I was doing.

The Buzzsaw thing is 'kind of a joke' because they still won't ever go first. I meant fluff wise not 'really' balance wise. Its not that the ork codex doesn't work, I win most of my games as long as I play orks. But if SM can get ridiculous pyschic powers and armor because it's in their fluff, why does a buzzsaw get littled down because it's unbalanced going faster than I1? I would gather an explanation comes from having to pull a lever to make the thing spin, and that lever being really heavy. I1, no more gripe, I get it.

The Warphead thing also just griping because I kept warping Zogwarts when I proxied him. The KFF on a deffkopta would be OP I hinted at that after reading what I wrote. Still cool though. T
he Runtherd is one of my favorite guys, I said that after I finished making my gripe. I know he has mobrule because he's an ork..but still, killing grots=passing leadership. I think that would be nice.

Agree with the why not 5 lootas or burnas in a box but GW is pretty clever at getting people to buy more. ON my third box of Lootas, now cutting up boys to make Kustom Lootas so I can have fifteen.

And you know, once you've posted it, it's kind of like, whoops, there it is.

Orks Rule!!!



Automatically Appended Next Post:
I edited it a little, its pretty convulxed so I'll keep back. Also, yeah, Dreds for Kan wall, I forgot because I don't play lists that other people play. I always enjoy the making your own list not following a pattern form of the game. Maybe one day I'll give a BW list a try though.
I did say I wouldn't change them anyways. I don't want a powerfist on your sergeant anymore than you want a BigMek on my deffkopta...want to come to an agreement??

Runna wrote:
I did say I wouldn't change them anyways. I don't want a powerfist on your sergeant anymore than you want a BigMek on my deffkopta...want to come to an agreement??

I think that's something I could agree to.

For me personally, the idea of a Mek taking a Deff Kopta to battle doesn't seem that far fetched.

It'd certainly add something to the unit, get him in there with a burner and a KFF, allow for some wacky Konversions.

I agree regarding Deffkoptas and the Buzzsaw, though. Killer Kanz don't have to strike last/at I1. Because they're SUPER STRONG. Re: Deffkoptas, I don't know, aren't the buzzsaws attached to the Kopta? Or even the blades? Why should it be slow? An Ork isn't swinging it.

Truth is that Buzzsaws just aren't that great. The S is just really low even when doubled. Improving the I value would help out I think and make more sense. I want to take Buzzsaws for my Koptas. It is a cool idea. But I never have because a PK on a Nob is just plain better.

Lysander has a BS of 5.

He has no ranged weapons.

Seriously, Matt wtf.

Just because they have no ranged weapon doesn't mean they have no ballistic skill.

Begel Dverl wrote:Lysander has a BS of 5.

He has no ranged weapons.

Seriously, Matt wtf.

This isn't a WTF at all. Just because he can't shoot out of the box doesn't mean that he'll never need a BS. Back in third edition in the Chaos Codex, Daemon Princes (iirc) had a 0 BS, which caused some problems because their armory access actually let take one or two things that required a BS to use.

Since he gives his unit the Bolter Drill, shouldn't the guy have a BS of 6 or 7?

Lysander is really good at... throwing rocks?

For Tau, it's that drones destructions causing flee tests. The fluff says they're expendable, but apparently a greater daemon or genestealers in CC is nothing compared to the scariness of somebody fragging Wall-E.

As a tau player (aside from hating drones cause morale checks) I don't understand why groups of gun drones are not fearless.....its a drone, i don't think it would be too upset if another gun drone died right next to it.

Why wouldn't they?

Flee/panic/morale tests aren't simply "Oh noes! It's something scaries!". It can be anything from "Oh noes! It's something scaries!" to "Oh crap, our plan is falling apart. Tactical withdrawl!".

Begel Dverl wrote:Lysander has a BS of 5.

He has no ranged weapons.

Seriously, Matt wtf.

I think we can go in a lot of codexes and find a unit without ranged weapons that has a BS, geeze. Get over the Ward hate.

True, but it still seems like saying your toaster broke, and as a result breakfast is ruined and you'll have to go hungry. Seems like that's a pretty gakky plan for breakfast then, if it relies on a single toaster...

unless you only eat toast

Tau shoot, and don't do anything else. A single drone < a single FW in terms of shooting (and they both suck compared to a crisis suit). It's more of an annoyance at the fluffy aspect, and how adding drones is the only viable way to attempt to shield the suits from ID attacks (of which there are many...)

Whats really funny is that drones are I4. They are faster and react better than their organic counterparts.

Nothing like building a machine that can do everything you can do but better.

Except a drone looks like the incarnation of Mont'au to battle-hardened Shas'vre when it gets shot. My broadsides grow wings on such a regular damn basis I'm tempted to model it onto them...

- Dark Angels: I can't turbo boost my Ravenwing bikers in the scout move because? Because the codex wrote in a reminder to 4th edition rules that became RAW in the codex in the edition change. And then they update via PDF and still don't fix it...

- Tau/Grey Knights: Why do my Burst Cannons and Pulse Rifles count as Plasma Weapons versus the Plasma Siphon? I've honestly never encountered a siphon, but this ruling just sucks regardless.

- Tau: I agree that gun drones should be fearless. I'm glad they fixed it so the vehicle drones don't count as KPs anymore.

- Eldar: My army is faster, so my SHOOTING army can now run in the shooting phase and then ASSAULT. I know it's just an old codex thing, but I would be really nice if the Eldar got a speed boost on their infantry that wasn't virtually useless for many of their models.

That is not just rambling....that is incoherent rambling! He is possessed by Chaos! Cleanse him with fire!

The rule that allows people to shoot at my army...
Yeah i dislike that rule.

purplefood wrote:The rule that allows people to shoot at my army...
Yeah i dislike that rule.

Also, the rule that allows people to look at my army before deploying

purplefood wrote:The rule that allows people to shoot at my army...
Yeah i dislike that rule.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

daedalus wrote:

Runna wrote:
I did say I wouldn't change them anyways. I don't want a powerfist on your sergeant anymore than you want a BigMek on my deffkopta...want to come to an agreement??

I think that's something I could agree to.

enter the handshake