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As the title states, did GW make the Blood Angels too good, or are Space Marines at an advantage across the board? My tyranids are having a hell of a time against all these fast tanks and so on.

What's hurting the worst? What is it about the BA (notice what else their abbreviation can mean?) that's hurting so bad?

I don't find BA too good. They're a good army, no doubt about that, but not at all too good.

Also, SM's are certainly not at an "advantage across the board" as you put it, just take a look at Dark Angels and Black Templars

Lobukia wrote:What's hurting the worst? What is it about the BA (notice what else their abbreviation can mean?) that's hurting so bad?

My bs is too low to make excellent use of ranged weaponry and even then a lot of stuff is too low in strength and/or has a low AP. Fast moving vehicles in a BA army require 6's to hit in cc, and sometimes they get a 4+ cover save for moving flat out. Since BA vehicles are fast, they can still shoot.

So basically im chasing something down that is whittling down my broods and when do catch up, its almost impossible to penetrate. Hive Guard are the answer yes, but there is not too much that is a clear cut go getter either.

No. Marines are fine. Blood Angels are fine. Tyranids are a little underpowered/overcosted.

I don't think it is BA being too good, although they are very competitive. The issue I think is that 'Nids have a VERY hard time in the current mech heavy meta. They have very few ranged options for anti-mech.

My recommendation?

Spam Hive Guard. 3x units of 3 if possible. Then try again against mech BA.

Rabid Ferret wrote:I don't think it is BA being too good, although they are very competitive. The issue I think is that 'Nids have a VERY hard time in the current mech heavy meta. They have very few ranged options for anti-mech.

My recommendation?

Spam Hive Guard. 3x units of 3 if possible. Then try again against mech BA.

Ive got a 1000pt battle tomorrow vs. BA and ill field 3 broods of hive guard, 3 strong. Just fyi, I have done this before and acutally won. So wish me luck.

Also, I highly agree with a lot of your guy's comments, especially the bolded.

Boomstikk wrote:I don't find BA too good. They're a good army, no doubt about that, but not at all too good.

Also, SM's are certainly not at an "advantage across the board" as you put it, just take a look at Dark Angels and Black Templars

Actually post-faq both are pretty potent, if not quite at BA/GK BS level.

Lance proof landraiders for every squad as transports, for example...

Every Marine codex written since 4th hit has had an advantage, as GW has a thing for marines, and Ward doubly so. Vanilla marines are a little less uber than GK and BA, but they are still an order of magnitude more powerful than the new Nid codex, especially after that godawful FAQ

With plenty of MC not made into actual models, is a Nids reboot far off? Or is it wishfull thinking?

Who knows what they are planning. They are trying to reboot sisters without any actual new models, without a real codex, and with a hefty jacking up of their prices.

I think there may be a small 'nid supplement in the works, a few new models maybe. Your guess is as good as mine really. I think they need to release a Tervigon model at least.

Yes BA is too good for Tyranids, for Tyranids it's an up-hill battle most of the time against these buggers.

Garukadon wrote:With plenty of MC not made into actual models, is a Nids reboot far off? Or is it wishfull thinking?

Reboot? As in a new codex? Christ no. Another wave of models? Yeah, that could and probably will happen.

The marines are the poster boys for GW, so it makes sense that they are the best(As far as the fluff is concerned)

As for gameplay I find them to be about the same as all the others.

This is because they have to roll dice like every other army. A bad streak of luck can ruin the game for any player.

For me playing Marines is like playing a video gameon Easy Mode.

Sure, a run of bad luck can mean Game Over, even on easy, but in general you'll have an easier time of it, unless you're up against another Marine army. In that case it's even stevens, pretty much. Older marine codexes lack the new cheat codes, but are still Easy

I have played with the new Blood Angels, the Grey Knights (old and new versions) and regular marines. I have played against a heap of marine armies.

Marines have a deliberately engineered edge agaisnt Non-Marines, even accounting for points value.

They are still beatable, but the favoritism is a tad obvious.

I have to say, Blood Angels are my nightmare army, I play Space Wolves, fielding Logan, 10 wolf guard termies and a pack of grey hunters, a land raider redeemer, venerable deadnought, long fangs, and scouts, and every time get ripped apart by 10 death company and lemartes

Aside from the stupid amount of armor they can field and the Dread Blood Talons, there isn't much to complain about with the BA's really. Mephiston's a bit silly but situational. If your opponent is spamming half a dozen Fast AV13 tanks and whatnot, it's probably not that much scarier than normal Marines.

Ascalam wrote:For me playing Marines is like playing a video gameon Easy Mode.

Sure, a run of bad luck can mean Game Over, even on easy, but in general you'll have an easier time of it, unless you're up against another Marine army. In that case it's even stevens, pretty much. Older marine codexes lack the new cheat codes, but are still Easy

I have played with the new Blood Angels, the Grey Knights (old and new versions) and regular marines. I have played against a heap of marine armies.

Marines have a deliberately engineered edge agaisnt Non-Marines, even accounting for points value.

They are still beatable, but the favoritism is a tad obvious.

You sure about that? That sounds more like you're playing with a fairly poor gaming group. Marines are easy to play and forgiving of mistakes due to their durability, but they're really in a jack of all trades, master of none scenario. Marines across the board generally perform the same, with stuff like Grey Knights and Blood Angels doing very well for the months around when they come out, due to people not being used to them yet. Once you find out that Blood Angels get wrecked to battlecannon and plasma fire just as easily as any other Marines, there's nothing to be that scared of.

I did say, for me

I find playing using them to be too easy also.


They get wrecked by battlecannon and plasmafire, true, but so does everything else It also presupposes that you HAVE battlecannon and plasma weapons

They get the best armour in the game, AV 11 self repairing tank transports at trukk prices, the best basic statline in the game (all 4's, no downsides ), immunity to sweeping advance (fearless isn't a downside if you're 3+ armoured), some amazingly broken special characters etc.

Add to this that the (arguably tied) best tank in the game can drive and shoot itself even when shaken/stunned, has a hefty tropp capacity, and can be assualted out of as if open topped when it isn't (no other army i know of has 'assault' vehicles like this ) and then add in drop pods and (in the GK/BA case dropships that can carry dreadnoughts (BA ones having potentially infinite attacks) and fire while moving flat out?

I've played with marines a fair bit (borrowing a friends models mainly, as they aren't my main army) and find them underpriced /OP for their points cost.


Compare a SM dread, for example, to a non SM equivilent at similar points like a deffdredd


I'll grant you that other races have some powerful units too, and some are undercosted for their effectivness, but it feels more like the status quo to me than the exception when I've played Marines. I haven't played Space Woofs much (couple of games) but i've played against thema great deal.

Marines allow you to make a few mistakes without it hurting you that much.

This is the reason people always view them as "Too Good"

and ATSKNF is a great ability as well.