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Hey there,
I am seriously tossing around the idea of starting Infinity, but I had some questions about the fluff. I have played 40k and is clear that SM, IG etc are clearly the "Good Guys" and races such as CSM, DE are bad guys. Does Infinity have that type of delineation or are all the factions one shade of grey or another?

Thanks!

Well, the factions in this game are not as clearly good or bad like in other games. It depends more in your point of view.

PanOceania, Yu Jing and Haqqislam are big nations with their own interests and business. Look at our own politics to see how they can be bad and good for the people.

ALEPH are nazis in Nomad's eyes, and Nomads are Anarchist punks in ALEPH eyes.

Ariadna are brave tough survivors, but you can see them as spiteful and out of place wildlings.

Combined Army are an alien outsider threat for the manking, but maybe they think that they are only cleaning the garbage...

YMMV however... read a bit of the fluff and make your own lecture!

Erasoketa wrote:Well, the factions in this game are not as clearly good or bad like in other games. It depends more in your point of view.

It definitely seems that way. From my take (on what little fluff I can find without investing into the game), it appears that PanOceania is the current King of the Hill while Yu Jing is trying to scheme its way to the top. Ariadna reminds me of having "sole survivor of an apocalypse" feel. I have not read or found much from the others just yet.

When you have the Infinity rulebook in your hands you realise why people buy it. More than 2/3 of the book is fluff, very well written fluff, adult background.
It is not a dark bible, not lyrism opera-style, it is like reading the internet from the future. It brings you different points of view about everything.

Is ALEPH evil? No one really knows. The information that the Human Sphere book provides shows a complex world. Some people think that ALEPH is evil, some people think that its best human creation since chocolat.

The Infinity books are a really inspiring reading, it gives you the vision that will make you want to build specific terrain and play the game like an RPG.

This is just my opinion, but games that, well, breast feed you morals and concepts of good and evil, in my opinion, fall into the catagory of childish.

Infinity doesn't concern itself with "good or bad", but deals with motivations.....what motivates a faction may be "good" to some and "bad" for others.....this is a very adult concept, especially from a fluff perspective, where players can make their own judgements on the actions their faction takes part in.

I think I will pick up the rulebook and start reading. Yu Jing models hold my interest strictly due to the oriental appearance. PanOceania is also an eye catcher for me from my love of anime. I can't decide! LOL

Yeah all the factions are rather gray and even the ones that seem to be clear has another layer of depth. Take for instance the Combined Army, they are the aliens race invading Human space, but they are controlled by the EI would is basically a Xerxes conquering planets as they go. The Morats, their most aggressive force, are actually conscientious objectors lol.

I play Nomads, we are the good guys because we see ALEPH for what it truly is and believe humanity should live free and not as sheep!


what did you say?... those black market weapons and blood sports? Sex slavery, hacking, and mercenaries? Oh pay no attention to those.

BlueDagger wrote:... Take for instance the Combined Army, they are the aliens race invading Human space, but they are controlled by the EI would is basically a Xerxes conquering planets as they go. ...

LOL
I cannot find a better way to describe using less words. One-liner skills there.

I think that once you get past the obvious 'bad guys' that are the Combined Army, it is all gray baby!

Erasoketa wrote:

Ariadna are brave tough survivors, but you can see them as spiteful and out of place wildlings.

Yet still others view Ariadna as the backwoods primitive hicks they are - those that aren't half-werewolf freaks, anyway.

There are no "good" guys (just like 40k - there are just shades of "not so evil".)

I have played 40k and is clear that SM, IG etc are clearly the "Good Guys" and races such as CSM, DE are bad guys.

I can't say that I consider that a faction that believes in the utter annihilation of billions of humans in order to preserve cultural and racial purity counts as the "Good Guys" by any definition. 40k has "Bad Guys", "Other Bad Guys", "Bad Guys for a different reason" and "Bad Guys who appear to be Good Guys but only by comparison with Other Bad Guys".

By contrast, Infinity has multiple political blocs pursuing their own agendas mostly through peaceful, diplomatic and humanist means but who occasionally rub up against each other in a limited, bloody and (most importantly) deniable fashion. By comparison to 40k, everyone in Infinity is the Good Guys, with the possible (but arguable) exception of the Combined Army.

R.

precinctomega wrote:

I have played 40k and is clear that SM, IG etc are clearly the "Good Guys" and races such as CSM, DE are bad guys.

I can't say that I consider that a faction that believes in the utter annihilation of billions of humans in order to preserve cultural and racial purity counts as the "Good Guys" by any definition. 40k has "Bad Guys", "Other Bad Guys", "Bad Guys for a different reason" and "Bad Guys who appear to be Good Guys but only by comparison with Other Bad Guys".

By contrast, Infinity has multiple political blocs pursuing their own agendas mostly through peaceful, diplomatic and humanist means but who occasionally rub up against each other in a limited, bloody and (most importantly) deniable fashion. By comparison to 40k, everyone in Infinity is the Good Guys, with the possible (but arguable) exception of the Combined Army.

R.

From a human point of view (and I'm going out on a limb here and assuming we're all humans...), the Combined Army are most certainly Bad Guys.

Eh the EI is a bad guy, the Combined Army as a whole are just along for the ride. Even the EI is just in search of knowledge by any means possible...

Tyranids aren't bad guys either, they just have a SERIOUS case of the munchies.

Since it is all relative, there is no doubt from Humanity's viewpoint, the CA and the Tyranids are very much the Bad Guys!

Evil and bad are as much from action as intent.

Thus CA, Nids, Orks, and all that jazz can be considered thus.

But, that doesn't mean they can't be fun to play in a fictional universe. Just don't try to justify their actions philosophically.

All this talk of "bad" and "good" is little more than childish banter. Is a Hyena "bad" when it hunts down lion cubs? or is the pest control guy "good" when he eradicates a nest of ants for a paying home-owner?

Good and Bad are stupid concepts of morality, created by those who feel life has dealt them a poor hand....the universe is not moved by our human morality, and outside the confines of our collective social concepts there is no such thing as good and evil.....what happens simply happens.

Aww... look at that cute new age philosophy. Read that in a book did you?

I suppose you'll be thinking that when the Orks, or say an African warlord, or just some plain robber kills your family or other loved ones for their stuff. Yep, it just happens.

And sure, stuff does just happen. Doesn't mean it doesn't have meaning to us, to humans, to any sentient life. The universe has no meaning, sure, but that doesn't mean you go on random killing sprees, or do you? I mean, if there was no good or bad you would just do anything, conscience be damned.

So no, don't try to justify the actions of non-existent entities by a bit of philosophy 101. Have fun playing them and knowing that they're fiction, when if this was the real world they're destroying people like us.

We are Nomads and you all are just sheep. ALEPH puppets humanity and the Combined army is puppets of the EI.

Vertrucio wrote:Aww... look at that cute new age philosophy. Read that in a book did you?

I suppose you'll be thinking that when the Orks, or say an African warlord, or just some plain robber kills your family or other loved ones for their stuff. Yep, it just happens.

And sure, stuff does just happen. Doesn't mean it doesn't have meaning to us, to humans, to any sentient life. The universe has no meaning, sure, but that doesn't mean you go on random killing sprees, or do you? I mean, if there was no good or bad you would just do anything, conscience be damned.

So no, don't try to justify the actions of non-existent entities by a bit of philosophy 101. Have fun playing them and knowing that they're fiction, when if this was the real world they're destroying people like us.

Yep, I read it in a book, like most borrowed knowledge.....but, intelligence and life experience demand that the concept of duality be taken seriously. Concepts like good and evil allow us to burn "witches" at the stake, or suicide bomb communities. If you think that going beyond the concepts of "good and evil" mean you can go on killing spree's says alot about your ingnorance about the "philosophy". People kill through fear, when you go beyond good and evil, you also go beyond fear.....you do the math

My original point, however, was not to try to educate you in any kind of philosophical thinking, but to say that I don't believe that Corvus Belli intend for any of their factions to be labled in such black and white terms. I get the impression that they intentionally created their fluff so that you as a player wouldn't need to demand that you are "Chaos" and hate all living things blah blah blah, but that you simply that the player simply aligns to that factions political endeavours.

Delephont wrote:
My original point, however, was not to try to educate you in any kind of philosophical thinking, but to say that I don't believe that Corvus Belli intend for any of their factions to be labled in such black and white terms. I get the impression that they intentionally created their fluff so that you as a player wouldn't need to demand that you are "Chaos" and hate all living things blah blah blah, but that you simply that the player simply aligns to that factions political endeavours.

Well said and certainly true... when you're talking about all the 'human' factions.

The Combined Army are certainly the Bad Guys though, but that doesn't make them any less fun to play!

The CA are the enemy. A professional soldier knows that whilst the enemy may be in front of him (or her), the bad guys are often behind him.

The same applies in Infinity. Whilst the human factions may stand united (ish) against the CA, it's suspected by more than one that the real bad guy is already in their midst in the form of ALEPH.

R.

For those looking for more free fluff we have started tossing some up on the official wiki.

http://infinitythegame.wikispot.org/Chronology

http://infinitythegame.wikispot.org/Infinity_Armies

Firstly, I just want to apologise for my terrible spelling and punctuation in my last post here....that's what happens when you try to type and feed yourself at the same time

Secondly, if you guys don't know it yet, the Battlefoam Infinity bags are up for sale on the Battlefoam website....remember the Alpha Bag comes with the limited edition Yuan Yuan miniature, and there's only 750 available.

Bags arn't cheap, in the UK, its £73 for the Alpha and £31 for the Beta.....so that might be a sticking point for most people. I've gone and bought an Alpha, as I need a large bag for my millions of Infinity figures anyway....and hell, I wanted the LE Mini as well