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Then again, SnP is a devastating speed nerf, and fearless isn't as wonderful as most people consider in many situations.

The Claws might be a bit much, perhaps if they traded their Gauss guns for the Claws that'd be alright, a sort of either/or choice- range, or CC.

fearless is fantastic as it prevents sweeping, which is one of the most reliable necron killers, it effectivley doubles the effectivness of each warrior

Crons will still fail to combat resolution even with fearless. Sure it prevents sweeping but that's more wounds they have to take and will probably fail at least a couple and lose more guys. At which point it's probably going to be something stupid like 8 no retreat wounds that have to be taken by two guys...I stand by stubborn.

what does stubborn do again?

Stubborn means that they suffer no leadership penalty when they take a morale test for losing a combat.

As for the Necron Warriors.. agreed. The points cost of the standard Warrior has long been discussed by myself and others. But where do you draw the line? Twenty points? Twenty-two points? Twenty-five points?

An unusual alternative game balancer might be.. dare I say it.. to lower their weapon ranges. That'd make their devastating frepower come at a cost - they have to get up close and personal to use it.

All Necrons should be T5 or higher.
They are ALL machine and have not a single fleshy bit. Why should space marine flesh or human flesh or Ork hide be as tough as solid metal?

It should not. All necron should have a Invulnerable save as well as no more than 2 wounds and a 5+ toughness for basic troops.

Make sense that they should be made out of really hard stuff right?

The Toughness does make a lot of sense... except that, if they're machines in the classic sense, they have wires and servoes and stuff that, if knocked out, could possibly incapacitate them. Machines generally don't have as much redundancy as fleshy bodies do. The 5+ or maybe a 6+ Invuln could make sense as well, but again, would necessitate a hike in the cost.

Field Gen wrote:All Necrons should be T5 or higher.
They are ALL machine and have not a single fleshy bit. Why should space marine flesh or human flesh or Ork hide be as tough as solid metal?

It should not. All necron should have a Invulnerable save as well as no more than 2 wounds and a 5+ toughness for basic troops.

Make sense that they should be made out of really hard stuff right?

Do you have no concept of game balancing? And since when was a Necron as tough as a Space Marine? More or less as resilient, but tough is a different word altogether.

Also, you say "why should.. human flesh.. be as tough as solid metal" - first off, depends on the metal, and second off, the fact that normal human Toughness is three and Necrons are four already makes that part of your argument invalid.

As for "no more than 2 wounds", I'm assuming you think they should have two wounds.. um.. no. Just no.

An Invulnerable save? Really? They can self-repair, not deflect lasers with force fields (that they DON'T HAVE).

T4 is really hard stuff.

Most necrons right now are already T5. The only ones that aren't are wraiths, warriors and flayed ones. But wraiths have that great invul save and flayed ones get sidelined constantly. So even as it is with the current dex most armies will spam more t5 than t4 (points depending obviously).

I don't suppose anyone has any comments on the actual changes then..

(commentary from a necron player)
The Idea of having tiered lords is weird, and seems unnecessary. Sure it gives more options, but they are necrons, Why can't there be a single Lord with additional upgrade choices instead.

The giving them fearless and SnP makes sense, but I Think giving all guass weapons rending a bit OP. Sure they have to get into range to use their guns, but they can now rip apart just about anything that crosses their path if you have enough of them.

It's no different than having squads and squads of guys that all have power weapons. It's just at range instead of in CC. And at range you can still get cover saves or be in transports to protect your fleshy bits.


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Darkvoidof40k wrote:I don't suppose anyone has any comments on the actual changes then..

Whoa, your wording of "self repair" would allow any weapon with an AP high enough (or low enough, depending how you look at it) to ignore it. Meaning if there is someone with a 4+ save then an AP 4 weapon would negate self repair.


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Also, in the first monstrous creature profile you listed the Gauss Pulsar as a weapon but then later referred to it as a Gauss Pulser.

Then nightbringer rules - Immune to Natural Law - did you really mean that he can't end within 1" of "any" terrain he passes through? This would be very detrimental, especially since he technically should be able to stop/be placed on impassable terrain, he just can't be "in" impassable terrain as to be avoiding getting shot at. (I.E. by hiding inside a wall of a garrisoned building).

@Your Self Repair comment - that would be why Resurrection Orbs and Tomb Spyders are the way to go!

Against normal anti-infantry guns (lasguns, boltguns etc) and normal CCWs they are seriously tough to take down, with essentially another save. However, I felt that, with the strength of the new 'dex as a whole, Self Repair needed to be easier to get around. But the inclusion of Resurrection Orb platforms (lords, spyders) in an army creates a certain structure that your opponent will need to overcome in order to destroy your normal squads with any real ease.

The Nightbringer is very much a WIP, and rest assured I'll go back to him at a later date. But as far as special characters go, I think we'll be seeing the return of a few friends from older iterations..

Well I finally got around to play testing your dex and I would have to say that giving all gauss weapons rending is a little powerful. A recommendation from the guys at my LGS would be to make it akin to the tyranid gargoyles and instead have them just wound infantry on a "to hit" roll of 6 and just reserve the rending hits for the vehicles. That would at least reserve their strength to destroying vehicles with out mowing through squads like they were nothing.

The rest of this is just a personal preference so ignore it if you wish. If it were up to me I'd say ditch the Bronze and Gold level lords since with Silver and Platinum you can manage both cheap and powerhouse HQ options and still have decent variety. The Tomb Stalker I would almost place in the Fast Attack category given it's rapid assault capabilities and the Overlord I would say make it a 13 12 12 venerable walker, call it a Crypt Guardian and make it a Heavy support choice.

Oh, during the game I also found I missed having the old living metal rules and the indestructible particle whip. (Bright lances, they were every where...) while I'm thinking about it having something to protect against things like Haywire Grenades would be nice, after all the Monolith isn't the most annoying thing to kill for nothing...

I reckon it's a fair trade-off with living metal - a 4++ is very hard to get by most of the time, and that's if the enemy have even managed to beat its 14 armour.

Where are my manners? Thanks for testing it! But I must ask, did you test the FnP version or the most recent version with Self Repair?

Edit: I will also take into concideration your other points when I next update the 'dex.

For one game I used FnP but after that I used the Self-Repair. The FnP, while effective at keeping my guys up it almost seemed a little too much at times. Personally I liked the Self-Repair more since I never had a problem WBB in the first place and I just felt it was a bit more fluffy than FnP.

Yeah, FnP is far too strong, especially with resurrection orbs and Spyders everywhere. Hence the change to Self Repair. So what are your thoughts on SR?

I think it's good. It works well to keep Necrons doing what they do best. The fact that Warriors only have +4 saves rather than the +3 helps to balance out both the lower point cost as well as the slightly reduced effectiveness of the Self Repair. The only thing I would really change is the wording of the Resurrection Orb so that it possible extends to Psyker abilities, special rules, etc.. We all have rules lawyers in our groups and the one in mine beat that one into the ground.

I like Self Repair, mostly due to its similarity to WBB (which i feel is integral to the Necrons).

I have to go along with the notion of SR being denied by any weapon with AP4 or better. if you're going with this i would go back to a 3+ armour save. Along with a slight points increase (maybe 1 or 2 points)

imho i would agree with praxiss however i still think the basic dudes are still to cheap


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just as a little footnote, i personally think they should either drop rending or become more expensive, or at the very least make their rending less effective, sure your going to have to rewrite an existing usr but i think its worth it for game balance

Well, Rending has been a fundamental part of my fandex since the beginning.. in fact it's the only part of the codex that remains unchanged!

I think I'd rather keep it as-is, but what would you all think about a point increase of +2 for Necron Warriors? To little?

i would think at their current state the necrons need to be at least the same cost as a plauge marine which is 25 ppm, although they should be more

Tyranic Marta wrote:i would think at their current state the necrons need to be at least the same cost as a plauge marine which is 25 ppm, although they should be more

Why? They have -1 Toughness, -1 Sv, -1 Initiative, no grenades, no Bolt Pistol, Boltgun, Close-Combat weapon and special weapon options. All they have is their one gun, which is powerful, however they crumble in assault.

To be honest, that's the only point of the Warriors: Walk forward, shooting continuously until they reach an objective/die. Pulling them back via a Monolith is still also a very viable tactic.

the point is you can make them nigh invulnerable in cc by simply adding a res orb, if your looking at it that way make them the same cost as thousand sons whicha re also snp and have a worse equivalent to sr, (4++) also anti infantry shooting, and also fail in close combat


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(23 ppm) rending also means that they can kill somehting that a plague marine or a thousand son never could, a land raider

While a Resurrection Orb makes them much more resilient, it is optional. There's nothing to say that Necron players will take them (though they'd be mad not to!).. but if they do, then they have to pay significant points for their Necron Lord or Tomb Spyder, the former of which will usually end up rather expensive and be the target of many attacks, and the latter of which can die fairly easily.

Ah, there's a good point. A Tomb Spyder with a Scarab Swarm essentially has 6 wounds! This is because you use the highest toughness as there is no average toughness in the unit. Fun stuff . Otherwise you can opt for a 9 wound Tomb Spyder, however it then becomes T3 . Or you could just have 3 Spyders in one unit as a 300pt point sink. They're actually worth it, though - not only do they keep your units alive longer, they can have 5 S6 MC attacks on the charge, or have 6 S5 AP3 shots at 24" range. Now when you add that up, that's 15 CC attacks or 18 Ranged shots. To top it all off, they're troops and can capture objectives!

Tomb Spyders are awesome, so don't underestimate them..



..because they will find you and eat you..


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Tyranic Marta wrote:the point is you can make them nigh invulnerable in cc by simply adding a res orb, if your looking at it that way make them the same cost as thousand sons whicha re also snp and have a worse equivalent to sr, (4++) also anti infantry shooting, and also fail in close combat


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(23 ppm) rending also means that they can kill somehting that a plague marine or a thousand son never could, a land raider

Hm, I think I might make Resurrection Orbs and Tomb Spyders slightly more expensive now..

But it's just the same (well, almost) as BA Sanguinary Priests - they're combination units.

Just a comment on the nightbringer, he's too powerful when causing instant death. Ignoring invulnerable and armour saves is all you need for that points cost. Also I personally feel parihas should be similar to the assasins in the daemon hunter codex. But then they would have to be expensive, so I guess their good.

How about a Deceiver profile? He could be less powerful than the nightbringer but with his own special rules so lesss expensive which makes him more practical in smaller game use.
I dislike feel no pain so I'm glad you changed it to self repair, which is just more necron-ish.
For the tiered lords I think it's a great idea, but keep the platinum at his original profile but more expesive, instead of giving him a worse profile for less points. They're supposed to be greatest necrons!
Great work though, but I do think all units should be T5 but 20 points.

There was a time that they were T5, but it is overpowered and stupid.

Also, I'm trying to come up with a Necron "Pharaoh".. some uber Lord or something.. help anyone?

An uber lord? As in a c'tan powerful necron or just crazy powerful normal? If normal just give him a higher stat line, and maybe auto phylactery. Although i'm pretty sure this would be the equivalent of a platinum lord fluff wise. Maybe something like this:
Necron Pharoah
225 pts
Ws. Bs. S. T. W. I. A. Ld. S.
6. 6. 6. 7. 3. 4. 3. 10. 3+\4++
Greater necrodermis: the pharoah has been given more dense and powerful necrodermis. A model will always strike with their regular strength value (so powerfists and otherwargear are ineffective) and any weapon with a set to wound roll only wounds on a six.
Necron
warstaff:
these ancient weapons are surrounded by deadly fields of powerful energie. It counts as a warscythe in all respects except if when rolling to wound, the Pharoah rolls a 6, it causes instant death.
Just some ideas, point value is probably too low, but it was more just for ideas than anything.

The Spyder makes his triumphant return!

The Spyder of Damnos
Statline: WS: 5 BS: 4 S: 7 T: 6 W: 4 I: 4 A: 4 LD: 10 Sv: 2+
Points cost: 175
Unit Type: Monstrous Creature
Number/unit: 1 (unique)
Special Rules – Fearless, Field Repairs, Furious Charge, Hit and Run

Wargear: Two close combat weapons, The Spyder's web: This weapon can be fired in the shooting phase with the following profile:
Range: 12” Strength – AP – Assault 1, Large blast, Pinning. This weapon does not roll to wound, and any models under the template must take a Strength test – if any of these models fail their test then the whole unit is treated as though it had just failed a pinning test. This weapon can still be used to pin Fearless units, as they are not actually taking a pinning test.

very nice DV and on the whole i think this codex has done very well, im liking the idea of that tomb pharoh, but deffs needs more points cost,

personally DV im getting the impression that this entire army is slightly to cheap, like you said b4 it is a combination unit army, the problem is that if you use the right combination then the army becomes seriously overpowered and you still have points to spare