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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 09:14:03
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Frater Militia
Germany
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Recently I ebayed a copy of the old "Forces of the Imperial Inquisition Collector's Guide" of GW. On page 9 the six main orders militant are listed (Bloody Rose, Ebon Chalice, Sacred Rose, Martyred Lady, Valorous Heart and Argent Shroud).
In addition, there is a Canoness of the Silver Shroud pictured, wearing white armour and red clothing. This is exactly the paint scheme I am using since years and I searched the internet for more information about this order but it seems either my google-fu is weak these days or there is nothing to be found. The paint scheme was also pictured several times in the old witchhunters codex (especially in the army setup examples) but as I found no further information (until know) I thought the ladies in white and red must be a nameless minor order.
The second order I came across via the collector's guide was the Order of the Virgin Rose (A Sisters of Battle army by Jon Carter, pictured on page 62/63) which also matches my white armour, red clothing paint scheme. I presume this is "just" a made up order by a GW employee but if anyone can proof me wrong, I would be happy.
From reading through lots and lots of posts on Dakka I know that there are some people around who know really a lot about the Sisters' fluff. If you have any further information on these orders or know an alternative order with the same colour-coding I would be very pleased to hear from you
Cheers,
fabius
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6000 pts Sisters of Battle
2500 pts Imperial Guard
2500 pts Chaos Space Marines
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 09:54:32
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba
The Great State of New Jersey
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I wouldn't think much of it personally, given that the majority of official SoB schemes include the color red (mixed w/ black or white usually) I would say that its possible for multiple orders to have the same heraldry, etc.
Personally, I'm disappointed that my own personal order (Order of the Barbed Tampon) was not selected for inclusion... :(
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 10:35:24
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Mighty Vampire Count
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Very very little info on the minor orders of the Sisters - Melissa or Lynata may know more..........
I'll have a look in my codexes when I get five to see if anything to help.
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I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page
A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 15:07:50
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Consigned to the Grim Darkness
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I would be very surprised if anyone, let alone Lynata, had information about minor orders (considering Lynata complained recently that there was no such information).
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The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 18:14:35
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Mighty Vampire Count
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I think it is likely that Minor Orders take at least some lement of their colours from their parent Major Order:
So the Silver Shroud would likely have come from the Argent Shroud whohave silver armour , white cloaks with red lining.
Vrigin Rose from the Sacred Rose who have white armour with black cloaks and red linnings.
(info from Codex Sisters of Battle 1997)
It changes somewhat in the last Witchhunters codex where the Sisters in white and red are just described as "Sisters"
The present White Dwarf is unhelpful
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I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page
A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 18:21:43
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Consigned to the Grim Darkness
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The Order of the Virgin Rose could also have been from the Order of the Bloody Rose, unless you have a quote that specifically links them to the other one. Red armor, black cloth, gold trim, black weapon.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/08/15 18:22:29
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 19:31:46
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Hallowed Canoness
Ireland
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chaos0xomega wrote:I wouldn't think much of it personally, given that the majority of official SoB schemes include the color red (mixed w/ black or white usually) I would say that its possible for multiple orders to have the same heraldry, etc.
Indeed.
"The uniforms of the Adepta Sororitas are based upon the original garments worn by the Daughters of the Emperor. The Orders of the Ebon Chalice and Valorous Heart display the colours of the original Convents, unchanged for 4.000 years. The other Orders continue this principle with only minor modifications to distinguish them on the battlefield. The Orders Militant make use of three main colours in the design of their uniforms; black, white and red."
I'm actually using a white/red combo myself (it just looks very crusader'ish) - but experimented with things like adding stripes to the robes and other such ideas. I think the minor Orders might have to adopt such additions to their livery as well in order to prevent mix-ups. On the other hand, this threat only exists when the Orders operate next to each other, so it could well be that there are multiple minor Orders with a similar colour scheme, condoned by the Prioress due to the distance between them. Or such similarities are actually intended as a sign of several minor Orders sharing a relationship in that they have all been spawned from the same Order Maioris, the only difference being their iconography. There are many ways on how one could interpret all this, I'm just listing a few potential options here.
As for the Order of the Silver Shroud: In my continueing quest into the rare and arcane details of Sororitas lore, I've recently stumbled over three other Orders Minoris Militant - the Wounded Heart, the Bleeding Heart and the Ermine Mantle - but I have yet to see anything about a Silver Shroud. Sorry if this isn't very helpful. I will keep an eye out, of course, but the minor Orders really do not feature prominently in the studio material (which is somewhat realistic, given their far more limited scope in comparison to the major Orders) and I'd be surprised to see the same one get mentioned twice. That said, it's not impossible either, and maybe someone else has spotted something.
Keep the faith!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 20:03:59
Subject: Re:Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Frater Militia
Germany
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Thanks for all your replies!
Seems like I have all opportunities to develop my very own fluff for my little sisters  The main reason for my search was the interest in banners and signs I could use to pimp my sisters' tanks and banner bearers (perhaps the army list next month gives us a reason to use banner bearers?!). Back in the days, I bought some sticker banners (I think they are all printed in the 2nd edition SoB codex) but if I remember it correctly, every banner represents one of the main orders, right?
Mr Morden is probably right that the Silver Shroud is somehow related to the Argent Shroud, so it would make sense to look for some inspiration within their heraldry.
@Lynata: May I ask where you stumbled over the other three Orders Minoris Militant? Are they covered in the novels (e.g. Faith & Fire) or are they mentioned in another context? I'd love to read more fluff about the sisters to get some inspiration for my own order.
Cheers,
fabius
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2011/08/15 20:07:09
6000 pts Sisters of Battle
2500 pts Imperial Guard
2500 pts Chaos Space Marines
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 20:24:50
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Mighty Vampire Count
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Just found another reference - Imperial Armour Vol 2: Space Marines and the Forces of the Inquisition.
There is an Exorcist depicted (in full colour*) which is described as follows:
Exorcist of the Order of the Blue Robe, a Militant Order Minoris under the auspices of the Convent Sanctorum of Terra. The order aided Inquisitor Halen Jentz during the Second Abonian Genocide.
* Blue and gold vehicle with impressive sigil and a robed silhouette of a nun like figure as I assume a symbol of the order.
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I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page
A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/15 20:43:26
Subject: Re:Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Hallowed Canoness
Ireland
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fabiusgallus wrote:perhaps the army list next month gives us a reason to use banner bearers?!
As much as I'd like that - given that the banner bearer has been out of production for years and I did not find an options reference in the first half of the codex, I doubt we'll get any rules for them in the second part. But you never know, it depends on how the wargear section is designed - and in any case, I think it would still be perfectly viable to use a banner bearer to represent a Simulacrum Imperialis Celestian in the Command Squad.
From how I understand it, every Order - regardless of whether major or minor - has its own singular sacred banner that only gets busted out for extremely important campaigns, so I think you'd be good to go!
fabiusgallus wrote:May I ask where you stumbled over the other three Orders Minoris Militant? Are they covered in the novels (e.g. Faith & Fire) or are they mentioned in another context? I'd love to read more fluff about the sisters to get some inspiration for my own order.
The small Order of the Bleeding Heart gets featured in a short story in WD 269, where its purpose was to guard a small shrine on the world of Emeline's Hope in the Yerena system that came under attack by an Ork Waaagh: A young Celestian by the name of Martika is the sole survivor of a convoy that was tasked with transporting the bones of one Saint Emeline from the convent to the starport for evacuation, but a bunch of Ork Kommandos jumped them as they had stopped by the roadside for morning prayers. Martika recovers consciousness amidst her dead Sisters, then proceeds to sneak into the Ork encampment at night, tosses a few grenades around and makes off with the Rhino containing the Saint's bones. A wild chase ensues, but despite heavy damage the Rhino safely delivers Martika and the Saint's remains to the starport where she is greeted by her Canoness. The Rhino was repaired and became Martika's personal transport, carrying her into battle until the day of her death.
A beautiful story that accompanied that WD's feature article on the background of Rhinos, their history and variants and how they work etc. The kind of stuff I'd really wish to see in current WD issues again.
The Orders of the Ermine Mantle and the Wounded Heart were mentioned on the army composition chart detailing the Imperial Forces participating in the defense against the 13th Black Crusade, where the Ermine Mantle dispatched three Missions and the Wounded Heart one Commandery to join the war.
As an interesting sidenote concerning that very same chart, the 13th Black Crusade saw between 200.000 and 250.000 Space Marines in action against the forces of Chaos. The Sisters of Battle contributed a total of ~15.000 Sororitas, including minor Orders.
This echoes the force composition from the Third War of Armageddon, where you had ~150.000 Space Marines and 1.000 Sisters, in that the Orders Militant don't seem to have such a vast presence in the Imperium as some may assume. Fits to the numbers we got from the 2E 'dex, though.
As far as novels are concerned - I actually recall someone having mentioned that he saw a minor Order in one of the Black Library books, but I'm not entirely sure where that was (it was not Faith & Fire). That said, novels are a somewhat difficult source either way, in that they are unable to establish canon by themselves. This doesn't prevent me from taking inspiration and certain ideas from there, mind you, but I always have to remember that this may not be what GW had intended and that I cannot use these books as "proof". Depending on your personal stance on the subject of "canonicity" (see this thread), you may want to keep that in mind during your research.
[edit]See the post above.
But yeah ... blue colour, sound somewhat fishy to me. You'd have to make your own call on that one.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/08/15 20:44:16
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/16 16:58:38
Subject: Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Mighty Vampire Count
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Lynata may wish to look away but another posisble reference
According to "Duty Calls" - Black Library, so as canon as you want it to be.
The Order of the White Rose has a substatial presence on Periremunda with its own virtual fiefdom on the plateau of Gavarrone. The Convent there is commanded by Canoness Eglantine which suggests i might be the only outpost of that order - comprising as it does several hundred sisters. The local pdf unit on the plataeu is nominally independant but is devoted to them.
Inqusitor Killian of the Ordo Hereticus notes they "have been a loyal ally in our purges and wars of faith for millennia."
They wear bright silver armour with black surplices broken upby the image of a single silver rose.
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I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page
A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/17 05:16:22
Subject: Re:Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Frater Militia
Germany
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Thanks a lot for the further references @ Lynata and Mr Morden! The hint to the story of Martika in WD 269 is very appreciated - gotta look through my friend's WD collection; he has almost all of them. Let's hope we get tons of new fluff when a new codex book is released (hopefully sooner than later) but until then it seems as a sisters player you gotta do some detective work to find fluff information
Cheers,
fabius
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6000 pts Sisters of Battle
2500 pts Imperial Guard
2500 pts Chaos Space Marines
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/08/20 03:59:00
Subject: Re:Sister of Battle: Information about Orders Militant "Silver Shroud" and "Virgin Rose"?
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Imperial Agent Provocateur
Bethlehem, PA
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Excellent sister lore and info. Did not know about the Emperor's daughters.
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