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Tried a search on this subject and came up with nothing so if there is an answer feel free to point me in the right direction and lock the thread.

For Victory Points it states that a unit that has lost half or more of its models gives up half of its Victory Points. Ok simple enough right?

What about a Thunderwolf Lord with 2 Fenrisian Wolves? The Wolves are wargear but they interact with other models, can be used to determine assault range to the Lord, are used to determine Majority Toughness and majority cover for the Lord, and can have wounds allocated to them like they are part of a unit. So if the two Fenrisian Wolves are dead at the end of the game does the TWL give up half his VPs? I wrote a more in depth article about this on C&C so if you want a bit more background go here. The basic question is outlined here though so you don't need to read what I wrote elsewhere. Our TO ruled that the TWL does indeed give up half VPs, which I agree with, but I wanted to know if there was any true ruling or what the RAW would be.

Models in a unit bought as wargear are still models of the unit. So the TO was perfectly within RAW there.

Jidmah wrote:Models in a unit bought as wargear are still models of the unit. So the TO was perfectly within RAW there.

Is there a reference for that? I agree but couldn't find a reference for this.

Any miniature with a stat line is a model. Any model must be part of a unit(BRB pg. 3). Fenrisian Wolves are always part of the character's unit.

As fenrisian wolves do not state to be an exception to this rule, they are no different than additional marines bought for a marine unit or additional crew for an artillery unit. There are no special rules for models bought as wargear, so they don't get any special treatment other than the rules in their codex entry/the FAQ.

Thanks! I didn't think to look in the basic unit rules on pg. 3. I knew what the TO decided was right but wanted to make sure.

Mods, feel free to lock if you want, I have my answer.

ok, but if you kill the lord you lose the wargear.. ie the puppies....
i do not agree with the TO.
if the lord dies and the puppies live i would agree, but since they are wargear and the are removed if he dies then no they should not count as VP

Nothing you have said is based in rules.

nosferatu1001 wrote:Nothing you have said is based in rules.

Exactly. I have since looked at the rules on pg 3 and now agree even more. Just because the Wolves are bought as Wargear and have a special rule removing them from play in a certain circumstance does not circumvent the rule that they are indeed models in a unit.

There's a fair bit about this kind of thing in the Tau book, as all those Drones are Wargear models. not sure if you can reverse apply this to non-Tau units though.

Bounty wrote:There's a fair bit about this kind of thing in the Tau book, as all those Drones are Wargear models. not sure if you can reverse apply this to non-Tau units though.

Actually, gun drone rules are identical to those of fenrisian wolves, including being removed when the owner dies.