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do you think huron black heart with all of his increasing power can take faildons place in near future?
overtaking the black legions place as the dominant chaos warband

Oh God I hope not.

I really am not sure why, but I really dislike Huron Blackheart.

I guess I just find him boring.

But I also doubt it, Abaddon is one of the few individuals that have the respect of the Chaos Marines as a faction.

yeah but 13 black crusades have gotten them no closer to destroying the imperium i think the respect is starting to fade for him

I could be wrong, but as of the permanent date set by GW hasn't the last Black Crusade actually succeded in getting beyond the Cadian gates making Abaddon essentially successful?

I realize he's trapped on the planet, but wasn't this his goal?

See http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/392010.page where the Eye of Terror campaign results are given

The 13th Crusade succeeded and his last known location as per GW sources place him in the Thesus Sector

Chaos is about competition so Abby vs blackheart isn't unlikely.
The old dogs vs the new guys.
Will one replace the other?
In 5th ed, the majority of fluff was given to huron.
So abby may be the "past" and huron the "future".

I don't believe so, as Huron's chapter is a 'lesser' entity than the original legions in their point of view; read Blood Reaver to see what I mean. The Night Lords tenth company at first demand respect from their lesser brothers as an original Legion. In that respect, Huron could never earn the loyalty of the Chaos Legions.

Scorpionov wrote:yeah but 13 black crusades have gotten them no closer to destroying the imperium i think the respect is starting to fade for him

You're not going to destroy the Imperium in one fell swoop.

Abaddon knows this, 13 Black Crusades with 13 separate agendas with varying degrees of success. He's recovered Drach'nyen, slaughtered Blood Angels, invaded a Founding Chapters home world, sown terror and destruction, captured Blackstones and now has a foothold on Cadia. When the skies over Cadia are claimed he has a base of operation in material space and a constant supply line back to the Eye. He's in it for the long game and has vision.

Huron is little more than a pirate and doesn't appear to have any grand dream other than increasing his own infamy.

Why would the Chaos Gods want Abbadon to even succeed? Doing so would cost them large portions of their food in the process and could weaken them, the Chaos Gods don't want there to be a massive great crusade of evil that will destroy every enemy of Chaos they just want eternal war. The Black Crusades don't need to be tactically successful, they just need to kill and burn anything within reach. While Hurons successful I don't believe he would replace Abbadon so easily, he's a pirate not a Champion.

Isnt the battle Report in Codex Apocalypse canon? it advanced the story a tiny bit. This means Abbaddon has suffered a critical defeat at the hands of creed and BC stern (neither of which die IIRC).

I suppose it might be what GW is going for but we will never find out as Lufgt's rise to power would take us into the *DUM DUM DUM* 42nd millenium.

It's a shame that the way the studio's background has been written has watered Abaddon down as a threat. Though one could think of them as tests of the Imperium's defences or (largely successful) operations with more limited objectives (as the Gothic War certainly could be seen), 12 unsuccessful attempts at conquering the galaxy can easily make him look like a bit of a chump.

Hopefully 6th edition's background will enshrine the new warmaster's success in bypassing Cadia and ravaging more and more sectors ever closer to Terra, making him a more plausible (and less laughable) bogeyman.

You're certainly correct that Huron has been pushed forward in the story of late, but I'd be most surprised were the studio to make him a replacement for Abaddon. More likely, he'll become the figurehead for the purported 'Renegades' faction, as Abaddon is for the Traitors. (That's presuming, of course, that the promise of two distinct Chaos codices isn't the load of hogwash it might well be.)

English Assassin wrote:
You're certainly correct that Huron has been pushed forward in the story of late, but I'd be most surprised were the studio to make him a replacement for Abaddon. More likely, he'll become the figurehead for the purported 'Renegades' faction, as Abaddon is for the Traitors.

That would make little sense as Huron has actual daemonic powers, and Abaddon is just an employee.

DarknessEternal wrote:

English Assassin wrote:
You're certainly correct that Huron has been pushed forward in the story of late, but I'd be most surprised were the studio to make him a replacement for Abaddon. More likely, he'll become the figurehead for the purported 'Renegades' faction, as Abaddon is for the Traitors.

That would make little sense as Huron has actual daemonic powers, and Abaddon is just an employee.

So being the favoured champion of Chaos and bearing the mark of all Chaos powers makes Abaddon a mere Employee?

And what Daemonic powers does Huron have, as far as I can tell it's none. His Hamadrya gives him certain psychic abilities, but without it Huron is just your normal, if not powerful, Renegade Astartes.

No, If Abbadon and Huron met.... I would pity Huron, and GW is not likly to replace Abby any time soon either

Huron's a pirate, and whilst he's probably more tactically adept (see Soul Hunter and Blood Reaver for comparison between the two), he doesn't command the respect of the Traitor Legions. The Night Lords certainly look down on him and his renegades for being simple pirates, apparently avoiding the front lines of the Long War.

Huron probably isn't looking at Abbaddon's place, yet.


at the moment, he is content to raid the Imperium from his own base of operations. He probably likes Abbaddon where he is, over there keeping the full force of the Imperium off his back so he is free to run rampant in his area.

of course, if Huron becomes more powerful and higher in favor with a particular Warp Patron he could pose a threat to Abbaddon. but this is probably a long way off from the present and requires several big Ifs to happen.

Huron is a new upstart Pirate. He lacks the connection to the Daemonic or ruthlessness necessary to unite the forces in the Eye of Terror has Abaddon (somewhat) has many times over.

Imperial forces around the Maelstrom are nothing compared to the Cadian Gate. He'd probably fair even worse in a Black Crusade.

DarknessEternal wrote:

English Assassin wrote:
You're certainly correct that Huron has been pushed forward in the story of late, but I'd be most surprised were the studio to make him a replacement for Abaddon. More likely, he'll become the figurehead for the purported 'Renegades' faction, as Abaddon is for the Traitors.

That would make little sense as Huron has actual daemonic powers, and Abaddon is just an employee.

I really don't follow your logic, given that Abaddon has five demonic gifts (six if you count his sword) to Huron's one (two if you follow the suggestion in Imperial Armour IX that the Tyrant's Claw is tainted). Regardless, fail to see the relevance: Abaddon is the inheritor of Horus and (however nominally) warmaster of the traitor legions, Huron is the most prominent non-Horusian renegade active in M41. If the rumours of two codices themed respectively around 'Traitor Marines' and 'Chaos Renegades' are correct (and I make no claims as to their veracity) such a division seem perfectly logical.