Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

While I normally see Vindi Assassins at Tournaments I got to see my first Callidus at work today. The tactic was interesting but I am wondering if it is legal....

A Callidus Assassin comes in from reserves...choosing a unit embarked in a transport, causing D6 Str 4 AP2 hits...can this be done, or does this effect only hit the transport the unit is in?

He got a TO to agree it hits the unit inside, while it didn't effect me since no transports, still wondering.

I personally would say no. Goes to the Whole can't Hood a Psychic power in a transport case as you can't actually measure range to the embarked models.

JD - page 66 says youre wrong, you can measure to the model inside. Plus, every tournament i've ever been to allows you to do this (to get a RAP on it)

Yes you can - the unit is within X" because you measure to the hull.

You cannot fire anything at a unit if it is currently embarked in a transport.

This goes for anything akin to shooting, psychic shooting, for all intents and purposes, the transport is what you can see/engage, until it is dead, the unit inside is untouchable.

Only part of what you said was rules.

Got me on that one nos; but what about these?

Either way it opens up the ole can of worms again; as to what will happen when your guys take 25% casualties and fall back.

That's why I'd say no, not to mention in (forget which FAQ) they said that embarked passengers essentially couldnt be "shot" at

Considering this has a shooting-esque profile.
as CC attacks wouldnt have an AP

This isn't a matter of firing or LOS.

RAW states:
"When the Callidus Assassin arrives from reserve, choose an enemy unit. The chosen unit immediatley takes D6 Strength 4 AP 2 hits. The Callidus Assassin is then placed anywhere within 3" of that unit using the Deep Strike rules, but does not scatter."

There is no measuring distance to shoot, or checking LOS.
They simply take the hits.

I'm inclined to agree with the TO that the units inside are a viable target, because of the fluff that goes along with that rule:
"Polymorphine allows the Callidus to impersonate any being she chooses, revealing herself only when it is time to strike."

It makes sense to believe that the assassin could have previously gone undercover inside the unit and embarked with them into the transport. I would also have no problem with the model being placed within 3" of an access point on the transport, indicating that the model revealed itself, killed some bad guys, and disembarked to avoid combat.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And no, you can't measure to the model inside. The paragraph you're referring to on p.66 is measuring to the fire point (ie. the lasguns on the back of the chimera).

Nocturn wrote:And no, you can't measure to the model inside. The paragraph you're referring to on p.66 is measuring to the fire point (ie. the lasguns on the back of the chimera).

"If the players need to measure a range involving the embarked unit (except for shooting), this range is measured to or from the vehicle's hull" P66

You can measure to embarked models.

I'm more inclined to say no to this now. It has a Str/AP Value which you don't see in anything other than shooting I believe.

measure range (except for shooting)

Kinda like how you can't doom guys in a transport, at least how I feel about it

Scott-S6 wrote:

Nocturn wrote:And no, you can't measure to the model inside. The paragraph you're referring to on p.66 is measuring to the fire point (ie. the lasguns on the back of the chimera).

"If the players need to measure a range involving the embarked unit (except for shooting), this range is measured to or from the vehicle's hull" P66

You can measure to embarked models.

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I meant for shooting.

Nocturn wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:

Nocturn wrote:And no, you can't measure to the model inside. The paragraph you're referring to on p.66 is measuring to the fire point (ie. the lasguns on the back of the chimera).

"If the players need to measure a range involving the embarked unit (except for shooting), this range is measured to or from the vehicle's hull" P66

You can measure to embarked models.

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I meant for shooting.

You can measure to them for shooting but you may not select them as a target.

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:I'm more inclined to say no to this now. It has a Str/AP Value which you don't see in anything other than shooting I believe.

Mawlocs rule. You're mistaken.

They are a legal target for this ability.

Well it isn't a shooting attack as it happens in the movement phase. I agree on the measure 3" from the embarked unit's transport, but not too terribly sure on if it works to choice the unit.

you get cover saves from the Mawloc though.

In effect it's worked out more like shooting, than anything else.

If in a transport, do you get them also?

Wasnt there an FAQ or something say you couldnt target units in vehicles because they are not, technically, on the board?

I cant remember where I read/heard that...

You're not targetting the unit in the vehicle, you are choosing them. Entirely different process, even if it looks the same, as "target" has a specific meaning in 40k

This is the entire Doom of Malan'tai argument, all over again, nearly word-for-word.

The tragedy? GW will probably FAQ that the callidus CAN target a unit inside a transport, even though DoM CAN'T. Imperium always wins vs xenos.

tetrisphreak wrote:This is the entire Doom of Malan'tai argument, all over again, nearly word-for-word.

The tragedy? GW will probably FAQ that the callidus CAN target a unit inside a transport, even though DoM CAN'T. Imperium always wins vs xenos.

100% agreed, basically the reverse Tyranid Theory.

Anything FAQ'd No to Nids is a Yes to any other Codex

Lunchb0x wrote:Wasnt there an FAQ or something say you couldnt target units in vehicles because they are not, technically, on the board?

I cant remember where I read/heard that...

Per the WH40K Rulebook Errata/FAQ version 1.4:

Q. Can an embarked unit ever be the target of enemy shooting?
A. No. Only the transport vehicle can be hit.

I think the question ultimately comes down to whether or not it is a shooting attack. If the argument is no, because it doesn't happen in your shooting phase, than technically DoM's Spirit Leech is only a shooting attack half the time. Nor would the Mawloc's Terror from the Deep.

It isnt a shooting attack. DoM was specifically FAQd to say it doesnt work on embarked units.