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Ok so i have Harky and still working on getting his T4 list together. the problem i am looking at, its kinda disappointing. Harky lobbing off 6+ Bombards per turn really is not that effective. feat turn may be more effective but i am not so certain. the thing i find an issue with is if you want to go all out T4 35pts is not enough. BIvan, 2 jacks and weapon crews tak the bulk of your points. the standard i have seen is BIvan 2 destroyers, i decided to go with Field guns over Morter for the single target puch power over the yet more deviations. now thats a total of 9+8+8+2+2-6=23pts just to get T4 then i have MoW or WG options to choose from, as well the oddball marksman. that leaves me 12 points to play with for some kind of punch power to answer Jacks and be able to survive to make a caster kill or to complete a scenario. So in conclusion i am finding a 35pt T4 Harky list under par. i believe a 50pt list running the 3 jacks, 2 crews WG Deathstar and a full Shocktrooper to be a better option. that may even still be short so i could consider some support as well. has anyone else come accross this issue?

My heart bleeds...

Seriously, Harkovitch must be one of the easiest themes to top out at level four in the entire game. Some casters cannot make a functional 35 point tier four list.

Most theme lists are less powerful than an open ended build, the bonus rules are for fun and fluff, If you get anything more out of them it is a bonus.

my advice is to drop the theme list until you go to 50 points if you can't get it to work at 35. In my own opinion Harkevich has one of the best tier lists out there, getting to t4 is always points intensive, but at least the wolf pack theme list let's you fill up with jacks you would normally take anyway plus 4-6 points of weapon crew (and minus 3 points for getting t4). You're really paying one point for two field guns.

How do you fare with him outside of his theme list? Do you perform better with a couple of favorite mercs/unlisted units or fewer jacks? The t4 in 35 points is going to be jack heavy so you need to pick at least one that can perform the function of a missing infantry unit that you might have in an un-tiered list. If the bombards aren't working for you, you could try a spriggan and decimator and go all melee with them. The new demolisher might also be more fitting with your playstyle if you are looking for something bulky that can still make great use of your feat and broadsides spells. You could also just throw in a normal melee jack and just not take the 1 point discount on it.

Anyway, if you think that theme list is bad, stay at least two yards away from every copy of the retribution book you see. It takes Rahn 34 points, Vyros 31 points, and Ravyn 34 points minimum to reach t4, and that's with an unreleased jack to fill as few points as possible. Kaelyssa and Garryth only require 25 points each, but all five theme lists are more restrictive or awkward than most.

Tier 4 35 points
Harkovich [5]
Black Ivan 9
Destroyer x2 8@ 16
Field Gun x2 2@ 4
Widow Makers 4
Widow Maker Marksman 2
Man O War Drakhun 5

Total 40 - 5 = 35

That's a pretty tough list to get around in a 35 point game. As an alternative you can replace one or both of the Destroyers with a Demolisher for the same point cost. With Broadside and then feating you can lay down 6 4" Blast Markers and charge with 2 Critical Amputations and a Brutal Strike. And don't forget Harkovich affects himself with both broadside and his feat.

Leo, he can't take widowmakers in the theme list, only the solo.

Right you are. Then just change all of the widowmakers and the marksman for a unit of 3 Man O' War Shocktroopers. It's still a very nasty list at 35 points.

The thing is, i love Khador and i love being able to Deviate, but all the deviations in the world is not gonna drop a good player. The Deviation is great dont get me wrong and Harky will be great vs Infantry. i am just having issues figuring out wat to supplement the reamaing 12 points in a 35pt list. i thought about the WD DS, but the DS against my normal opponents get decimated. and a minimum DS is just sad. i figured the remaining 12 pts would be Drakhun W/ Dis, Dog, and Min Demo/Troopers. and Leo, your not counting the T4 Bonus of -1 point on jacks with ranged weapons. I was also considering tossing a Beserker or Kodiak in there for 35pt list.

my issue is Deviation is great and i am failing to understand how the Harkevich tactics work to be able to be competitive. Deviated Bombards dont do anything to Jacks. with Rat 4, our 'Jacks pray to hit other jack with cannons and since most other factions have higher Def jacks. So if i want to hit a jack with my cannons, which infantry will be my prime targets first, i would have to for-go broadside that turn to allocate focus so i can boost to-hit rolls.

What am i missing in this?

EDIT: I wish Harkevich had a Quad Iron xD

Have you considered Decimators? Or maybe one.

Heavy gun, beatback, etc.

This is 25 points:

Faction: Harkevich - Wolf Pack
Casters: 1/1
Points: 25/35
Tiers: 4
Kommander Harkevich, the Iron Wolf (*5pts)
* Black Ivan (9pts)
* Decimator (8pts)
* Spriggan (9pts)
Winter Guard Field Gun Crew (Leader and 2 Grunts) (2pts)
Winter Guard Field Gun Crew (Leader and 2 Grunts) (2pts)

I did consider the Decimator yes. but i would not be using a spriggan. however, the reality is. the Decimater is going to be a liability. he has the same chasis as a Destroyer, thus same stats. 4 RAT is not going to do much. his Weapon has 1 more POW and less Range. i would rather stay with

Harkevich [5]
-Black Ivan
-Destroyer
-Destroyer
Field Gun
Field Gun

the field guns are my actual answer to heavies or lights. they have one more POW and better accuracy. on top of the Crew. so they would be able to hit more frequent then the Decimator.

i would probly swap out a Destroyer occaisionally for a Demolisher, depending on the army i face. but mostly it will remain the BI and 2 Destroyers.