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Just wondering what I'd have to use to make the following models "work" at 2500 points.

I have 0 experience with 8th edition, and even in 7th I never fought the Ogres,
so reading the Ogre Kingdoms rulebook hasn't really helped all that much.

Ogre Tyrant
BSB

Block of Bulls (advice on number...7 or 10 to make room for the Tyrant and BSB?)
Block of Ironguts (do Tyrants ride in here?)

4 Mournfangs with Ironfists

Stonehorn (with or without Hunter?)

___

I'm pretty clueless about things such as magic in 8th, but I've been trying
to read lots of posts over at the Ogre Stronghold to get an idea of what to
field. The above listed models are things I absolutely want in the army, now
I need to know how to make it work at 2500...

Well, a Tyrant I say needs some kind of ward save. He's going to be up front and if he gets cannon'd it's nice he has a chance. He also needs some kind of magic weapon IMHO in case you go against something that needs magic to be hurt. But can be pretty basic.

Ironguts can take a magic standard on their own, so they might be nice to stick the tyrant in here.

Bulls can't take a standard but a Bruiser can be the BRB (has to be) and can even make it a magic one. But then he can't take magic items and it's nice to give him some too.

Stonehorn...not sure. They are pretty solid on their own, even in a worst case scenario a cannon can't kill them in 1 shot. If you add a Hunter you can give him a Harpoon and magic items, but then you've got a really expensive unit. The Harpoon becomes move and shoot if he's riding it, which is a huge plus, and with its huge range and D3 it can actually "snipe" war machines. But this unit is so much better in melee. The Hunter costs a lot and he can be individually targetted (randomly), whereas the normal rider can't. In one sense, it makes the unit harder to kill, because the Hunter could be shot and you can give him armor/ward. But he's awful expensive and you don't get any kind of refund for ditching the normal rider. And the Hunter has to pay for the Harpoon and the normal rider doesn't. Though the trap isn't bad either.

So...not sure about making them work. Depends on what you buy in terms of upgrades and such. The Tyrant/Bruiser can be pretty expensive. Those Mournfangs are crazy expensive once you've finished upgrading them.

Give everyone a bellower a standard and often a magic standard if it can take it.

11 or 12 is an ideal unit size for bulls/guts(if you don't want a horde). I'd get 2 Battalions, 2 boxes of Mournfangs, and the Stonehorn. Do you not want to use wizards? You might want a Lvl2 Firebelly or Lvl2 Butcher with a Dispell Scroll. The list would look like this:

Tyrant
Sword of Bloodshed, Talisman of Endurance, Enchanted Shield, Heavy Armor
310 Points

Bruiser
BSB, Armor of Destiny, Great Weapon
189 Points

Butcher(Lore of the Great Maw)
Level 2, Dispell Scroll
160 Points

11xBulls
Ironfists, Full Command, Look-Out Gnoblar
387 Points

11xIronguts
Full Command, Standard of Discipline, Look-Out Gnoblar
523 Points

4xLeadbelchers
Bellower
182 Points

3xLeadbelchers
Bellower
139 Points

4xMournfangs
Full Command, Heavy Armor, Ironfists, Dragonhide Banner
360 Points

Stonehorn
Harpoon Launcher
250 Points

2500 Points total.

You can convert your characters from the Bull, Irongut, and Leadbelcher that you don't use from the Battalions.

You run the Bulls/Ironguts 4 across and just smash them into units.

Leadbelchers guard your flanks and do some pretty good shooting. Mournfangs will remove enemy units, pure and simple.

The Tyrant goes with the Ironguts because their banner makes him Ld10(which he can then pass on to other units within 12"). The Tyrant's kit out gives him lots of attacks at decent stength. Basically he has the opposite kit out to the Ironguts. They provide S6 at ASL, he has 8 S5 attacks at decent Initiative.

I included the Butcher because he helps you keep your units get wiped out by "initiative tests or die" spells.

Ooh, thanks.

I'm not anti-magic, but a lot of the Ogre Stronghold lists use
the Slaughtermaster at level 4 as the General as an efficient
magic-user/lord, and I kind of wanted a tyrant.

I mean. Tyrant. Come on!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tzeentchling9 wrote:11 or 12 is an ideal unit size for bulls/guts(if you don't want a horde). I'd get 2 Battalions, 2 boxes of Mournfangs, and the Stonehorn. Do you not want to use wizards? You might want a Lvl2 Firebelly or Lvl2 Butcher with a Dispell Scroll. The list would look like this:

Tyrant
Sword of Bloodshed, Talisman of Endurance, Enchanted Shield, Heavy Armor
310 Points

Bruiser
BSB, Armor of Destiny, Great Weapon
189 Points

Butcher(Lore of the Great Maw)
Level 2, Dispell Scroll
160 Points

11xBulls
Ironfists, Full Command, Look-Out Gnoblar
387 Points

11xIronguts
Full Command, Standard of Discipline, Look-Out Gnoblar
523 Points

4xLeadbelchers
Bellower
182 Points

3xLeadbelchers
Bellower
139 Points

4xMournfangs
Full Command, Heavy Armor, Ironfists, Dragonhide Banner
360 Points

Stonehorn
Harpoon Launcher
250 Points

2500 Points total.

You can convert your characters from the Bull, Irongut, and Leadbelcher that you don't use from the Battalions.

You run the Bulls/Ironguts 4 across and just smash them into units.

Leadbelchers guard your flanks and do some pretty good shooting. Mournfangs will remove enemy units, pure and simple.

The Tyrant goes with the Ironguts because their banner makes him Ld10(which he can then pass on to other units within 12"). The Tyrant's kit out gives him lots of attacks at decent stength. Basically he has the opposite kit out to the Ironguts. They provide S6 at ASL, he has 8 S5 attacks at decent Initiative.

I included the Butcher because he helps you keep your units get wiped out by "initiative tests or die" spells.

I really like the "look" of this army. I haven't played with my Ogres yet, but
this is a pretty good picture in my head of what I want. Only issue I have is
modeling the Tyrant with a shield, though I know wysiwyg is looser in
Fantasy for characters.

Once I get this together I think my next step is to figure out an army that
utilizes Maneaters. They're really cool models, but I wanted a "core" army
to build around. Maybe I'll even include the Slaughtermaster and other
things in that list.

Is it ever useful to have multiple bull units with an anvil Ironfist + Weapon
followed by flanker unitsof Bulls with two hand weapons? Or is it simply a
better idea to run Ironguts in those roles?

for "Shields" on ogre characters, I either say its an Enchanted Ironfist(because IFs are now Shields in all respects except they Parry while mounted) or Gutplate.

Grey Templar wrote:for "Shields" on ogre characters, I either say its an Enchanted Ironfist(because IFs are now Shields in all respects except they Parry while mounted) or Gutplate.

Ah, makes sense.

It'll be a while before I actually play with this. Should be interesting.

(I miss my Wood Elves)

I was going to mention the gutplate as well. Being wysiwyg with a shield on an ogre character should be no problem... if anything, it'd be hard to justify him Not having something that worked as one on there somewhere . (And you're right, wysiwyg with characters in fantasy is a Lot looser)

I like the list Tzeentchling posted. The only real addition to what you posted are the 2 units of leadbelchers and the wizard. You Definitely want a wizard! And the leadbelchers are nice to let you compete in all 3 phases. It's a solid list, imo- more on the balanced side than overpowering in any one phase. That also means it's slightly weaker in every phase to achieve that balance, so you might need to finesse things a bit. Squeezing in another wizard (firebelly, maybe?) would've been nice, but you can always try that out later (basically swap out one unit of leadbelchers for whatever you like, character or otherwise).

I like the size of the blocks, though! They need to be big at 2500 to compete.

RiTides wrote:I was going to mention the gutplate as well. Being wysiwyg with a shield on an ogre character should be no problem... if anything, it'd be hard to justify him Not having something that worked as one on there somewhere . (And you're right, wysiwyg with characters in fantasy is a Lot looser)

I like the list Tzeentchling posted. The only real addition to what you posted are the 2 units of leadbelchers and the wizard. You Definitely want a wizard! And the leadbelchers are nice to let you compete in all 3 phases. It's a solid list, imo- more on the balanced side than overpowering in any one phase. That also means it's slightly weaker in every phase to achieve that balance, so you might need to finesse things a bit. Squeezing in another wizard (firebelly, maybe?) would've been nice, but you can always try that out later (basically swap out one unit of leadbelchers for whatever you like, character or otherwise).

I like the size of the blocks, though! They need to be big at 2500 to compete.

Thanks for confirmation on the equipment. That'll help me get this
project done (I don't have the patience to convert stuff).

Are there any suggestions for either:

a) a lightly different list that features Maneaters?
b) an increase to 3000?