Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I was wondering, does anyone know why the Black Templar chain their bolters to their arms?
As far as I can see they are the only ones who do this, and its not really mentioned anywhere. Yet all of their models have chained bolters.
The codex implies that they are rare and sacred, but I somehow doubt that is the reason. Bolters are definitely not rare, nor are they divine in anyway.

It's to make sure they don't lost the bolter if they need to use both hands for close combat, or so I've been told. Losing your gun is also very shameful for a soldier, any soldier. In addition the BT crusades are well over the Codex limit on numbers... they might have some supply problems if they're not willing to leave evidence of having too many marines.

And yes, many marines do regard the bolter as a sacred tool of sorts. "Each shot a prayer to the Emperor" and so on.

Spetulhu wrote:It's to make sure they don't lost the bolter if they need to use both hands for close combat, or so I've been told. Losing your gun is also very shameful for a soldier, any soldier. Tell that to American G.I who swapped M-16 for AK-47 in Vietnam. In addition the BT crusades are well over the Codex limit on numbers... they might have some supply problems if they're not willing to leave evidence of having too many marines.

And yes, many marines do regard the bolter as a sacred tool of sorts. "Each shot a prayer to the Emperor" and so on.

Basically what the man said - you don't want to lose your rifle in a middle of battle.

Brother Coa wrote:
Basically what the man said - you don't want to lose your rifle in a middle of battle.

Fair enough, but no other chapter does this. It is not just for close combat either because the blood angels don't chain their bolters to their arms. They are possibly the most close combat orientated chapter in existence. (although it could be argued they don't have the same issue, after all when was the last time you saw a blood angel tactical marine?)

The supply issue might be true though, given their numbers. Also I wouldn't be surprised if they go through a far higher number of neophytes than other chapters go through scouts. This probably accounts for far more lost armaments than normal and thus resupply is a problem. The only argument I can think of against supply being a problem is how many chapter fortresses they have which undoubtedly produce their armaments. They leave a fortress on every world the re-capture, to recruit and manufacture supplies.

SylvanaSekNadin wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:
Basically what the man said - you don't want to lose your rifle in a middle of battle.

Fair enough, but no other chapter does this. It is not just for close combat either because the blood angels don't chain their bolters to their arms. They are possibly the most close combat orientated chapter in existence. (although it could be argued they don't have the same issue,

What the man said and the rest would be tradition. And when was the last time you saw Blood Angel with Bolter? ( not bolt pistol )

after all when was the last time you saw a blood angel tactical marine?)

The guys on the right and left of Terminator fits that description.

That pic is probably the Blood Angels Bolter refresher training course. No enemies in sight

Brother Coa wrote:
What the man said and the rest would be tradition. And when was the last time you saw Blood Angel with Bolter? ( not bolt pistol )

The guys on the right and left of Terminator fits that description.

There you go, answered own question.

If it is tradition that causes them to chain their bolters to their arms, the question is why? How did that tradition start?
Most things in the 40K universe have some kind of beginning or reason behind them, like the dark angels and their robes. You can see they wear it because they are trying to look repentant. However I just cant figure out the chained bolter thing.

Perhaps during the crusades on earth the knights used to chain their swords to their arms so as to no loose them in the fights, and GW is just using that imagery. I can see them doing something like that, but I don't know enough about the history of the crusades to figure out of that may be the case.

My money is on tradition as well. Chains = Grimdark. It's like adding skulls to the armour in that it reinforces the "medieval" theme of the army.

I doubt there is a real world example that could have inspired this (beyond the "chains =medieval!!1"), though it may still not be too hard to come up with a suitable excuse for this. For example, you could simply say that the chain symbolises the link between Marine and bolter - perhaps the BT value this weapon more than your regular Chapter. Or they actually do this with every weapon and it's a symbol of their service and being "bound" to it (in that they see themselves as weapons of the Emperor, the gun in their hands being a mere extension of this philosophy), just that GW/FW don't yet produce the necessary bits for that. Just off the top of my head.

After reading Helsreach, I think I agree with Lynata: they are "bound" to their weapons by oaths, and therefore the chains are to prevent him losing his Bolter, which would bring shame down upon him.

The only real world example I can come up with is with having your pistol secured to your body with a lanyard. In the British Army it was supposed to be worn around the neck but it was more commonly worn attached to the belt so as an opponent couldn't throttle you with it during hand-to-hand faighting.

I know they occasionaly use the chains to strangle people.

I can't remember where I heard it, and I'll try and find out, but I was led to beleive it was so they cannot put their weapon down until the Campain/war is done

For a chapter that seems to thrive on killing everyone who isn't Imperial in nature it makes some sense. At the start of battle the servitors/neophytes chain the weapons to the Battle Brothers, then once all is complete then the weapons are unchained.

It's symbolic. They chain their weapons to their hands and swear not to stop fighting until either they or their enemy is dead.
That's what it said in the designer notes at least...

They don't even seem to replace or swap out their ranged weapons even if they don't have ammunition for them anymore. Grimaldus still carried his Plasma Pistol till the end even when he ran out ammo for it somewhere halfway through the campaign in the novel helsreach as did the other marines in his retinue.

Storm Lord wrote:I can't remember where I heard it, and I'll try and find out, but I was led to beleive it was so they cannot put their weapon down until the Campain/war is done.

I think this makes a lot of sense. Added to what Valkyrie said about them being bound to their weapons by oaths, it fits the thinking and history of the Black Templars quite well. They tend to be on the crazy side when it comes to taking unreasonable oaths, so something like this makes sense.

SylvanaSekNadin wrote:

Storm Lord wrote:I can't remember where I heard it, and I'll try and find out, but I was led to beleive it was so they cannot put their weapon down until the Campain/war is done.

I think this makes a lot of sense. Added to what Valkyrie said about them being bound to their weapons by oaths, it fits the thinking and history of the Black Templars quite well. They tend to be on the crazy side when it comes to taking unreasonable oaths, so something like this makes sense.

It's also written in the designer notes...

Its for several reasons.

1) Black Templars are based upon European Crusading Orders of Knights, specifically the Teutonic Knights. in the middle ages it was common practice for a knight on horseback to chain his weapons to himself. This was to avoid losing his weapon if he dropped it as a Knight couldn't get on or off a horse unaided and a dropped weapon would be gone for the duration of the battle.

2) it looks cool.

3) a weapon on a length of chain can be swung and give you some extra reach. a Bolter on a chain would be 15 pounds of solid metal on a chain, an impromtu flail.

They are dummy cords. More proof that BTs are just a bunch of irresponsible Joes. Counciling Statement and a penitent crusade with dummy corded Bolter for the marines who leave thier weapon out of arms reach to get a smoke or chow.