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I don't see a lot of chaos daemon players around. Just wondering if only my area, or is it just not a lot of people use them. And if that's the case, i wonder why?

My girlfriend plays them. I think they're a really cool army fluff-wise, but I don't think they appeal to a lot of folks due to the lack of vehicle options. I think since 5th ed. is so vehicle-centric people have a tendency to look at them and say "what, no vehicles? they must SUCK." which I get.

Its such a shame i was looking at for a bit and they seem pretty good they have really beefed up units since they have little long range or vehicle options. I could see them doing pretty good if you plan it out right. But you have to hope for a little luck, since you only get half your army at the start and 1/3 of the time you don't get to choose which half.

Eh, I am still considering doing a list for them, could be fun.

I have a Chaos Daemon world army from back in second edition if that counts. It was in the back of the Codex and was a kind of scenario army list for a campaign etc. but it gave me an excuse to paint fantasy chaos models. I was the only person I knew with an army like it that I used for 40K. I'm not really familiar with the new list, but I don't think they're exactly the same. My army has a Lord of change, flamers, Horrors, Chaos Lord on steed, Mounted Chaos Warriors, Beastmen (with bolt pistols), Chaos hounds and a Chaos Sorcerer.

We have a daemons player around here who tends to do fairly well. I think it is a hard army for beginners to figure out, so most of them avoid it.

I could be wrong but I think Daemons are somewhat of a difficult army to handle.

Daemons were my first 40k army. Love em, and if people aren't expecting them or don't have experience against them...they're generally toast. They can be a hard army to play, but they're equally a hard army to play against. In a melta-meta world, daemons are the best survivors, and therefore, a problem for many. If I had to lose all my other armies, Daemons are the ones I'd keep.

I play Daemons of chaos, one of my favorite armys, easy to add some conversions to, customize some cool things, play with fun paint jobs, and if your skilled be a really good army to win with although expensive.

Although with Grey knights we might see a steady drop in their play. And its not cause all the bonus's grey knights get against daemons (dropping em a toughness, and putting em at I1, or rerolls, or that daemons have no psychic defense) its 100% Servo skulls and Warp quake. If i cant put models on the table, i cant beat you in a game. and if i only get half my army and most of it mishaps turn one, i probably wont do well!


Warp quake and servo skulls! the death to daemon armys


/sadpanda

QFT. Grey Knights should have kept the old rules of daemon units being able to respawn. That would have evened things out a bit. But warp quake and servo skulls...well, first time I see an opponent with tons of those in their list, I'm going to flip the bird and walk off. I've never flipped off an opponent before, but I would happily do it to somebody bringing something that is an autowin, simply because I took my favorite army (and not just because he chose a better build or played better).

I dont know about anyone else, but chaos demons seem so cliche to me. Theyre all those stereotypical demons with flaming sword, and it feels like theyd be so boring to work with.

Chaos daemons are my first army i chose to play/build/paint for 40k.
In hine sight i should have probably picked a more generic, easy-to-follow/learn-rules-army to start off with.
It was a toss up between Necrons and Daemons, Someone else chose Necrons so i just took daemons.( I started playing in a uni tourney, thats how i got into it really.)

At my local GW store, i believe there are 3 daemons players. I have the most experence(6 months playing) which is pretty gakky cause i know hardly anything about them. It sucks cause i cant really ask anyone about tactics or builds, not to mention the other 2 players are under 18.

Every time i have taken my army into any GW store to have a game, i find people linning up.

Since i have not played any other army, i cant say id take daemons over such and such, but man without power weapons/invun saves and deep strike, i think i definatly would not have lasted so long with this hobby. Just when i think i have something figured out, BAM, it falls apart.

They are tricky to play. But they are so much fun.

I love playing against Grey Knights! I know it sounds stupid, but if the other player isnt taking a generic standard list of termies, the game can get really interesting!!! Survivabilty against them is fine since deep strike is on my side.

Ultramarines, eldar and tau have to be the worst armies for me to play against. It doesnt seem fair, really.

I know they seem boring sterio-typed daemons.. but they have such a huge range of builds that really you have 4 armies into 1.

We have no vehicles.. THIS KINDA SUCKS!!!! But we have walkers and monstorious creatures.. They can take down anything if everything hits(no scatters). I always get nervous when i see and army with 2-3 tanks or whatever.. Then i just think, meh, Soulgrinder will eat em!

I think our army is a more tactic army to play. You cant really work out anything because of dice unpredictability on deep strike, and scatter rolls if you dont take icon. So learning to play with half your army and surviving until the rest shows up teaches you alot. Of course, we have some pretty over-powered things in our force though.

If nothing else, at least the models are amazing to paint!

Well, let me dive a tiny bit more into it Exiledarc, so you can see why GK's are not very friendly for us

Its not that we cannot kill their termi's or their guys, heck we can walk threw alot of them given the chance....its just that deep striking is our biggest weakness fighting them...and here is why

Warp Quake, Servo skulls. Both of these cause -any- unit deepstriking that lands within 12" of a guy in the unit who cast the power, or withing 12" of the skull to be AUTO misshap. so if you roll a 1-2 you are destroyed, 3-4 they can place you anywhere (including another warp quake/servo skull and force you to misshap again, and again, and again) or 5-6 reserve, so vs gk's you really only either die, or go back into reserve. Now if we land withing 6" of the servo skull, sure it gets destroyed, but it was 3 points. Woopie!

So the guys with warp quake can only be the Librarian or really expensive dudes right? NOPE! its on their BASIC grey knight trooper. and they can combat squad to get it TWICE per unit. Also, did i mention it was 12" to each GUY? so spreading his line out can cover alot of area. Also its on their Intercepter squads... Warp quake has to be cast at the start of movement. So they take tests at the start, and then shunt to the four corners of the board. then rhino rush to middle, sevo skulls anywhere they dont wanna be, and on your turn......you misshap for the rest of the game!



i can deal with draigo wing. I can beat dark excummication, i can live threw rad and psycho, and psyck out and all their grenades..... Daemons can still win threw all of the rest of the codex...but if we cant even place a model on the table i cant really do anything...and pairing that the army is allready random..(which i love) it just..makes it super rough...almost impossible.



/sadpanda

I'm slowly working on building up a Slaaneshi Daemons army when I'm not working on my Sisters.

So far I've got 30 Daemonettes - 20 of which are unbuilt - and 15 Seekers - 5 of which are built and 5 other steeds are built but without riders. Only a few are painted, but the ones that are built have been primed. ^_^

I've begun work on the grand Chaos horde, a mixture of CSM/Renegade kits from Forgeworld/Daemons.

For my Daemons I plan 10 Bloodletters/10 Horrors/3 Bloodcrushers/5 Plaguebearers/5 Screamers/5 Bloodhounds, a Spawn, a Soul Grinder, and a Daemon Prince. And maybe some Furies.

I have a friend who plays Nurgle and Khorned themed armies.

I plan to run a nurgle themed army with my brothers chaos marines as a backup force. The problem with daemons is that they are all about luck in the first few turns. One effed roll can screw your entire plan. Another is with armies like vanilla saying "our librarian makes you re-roll sucessful invol saves" it kinda pisses people off. As a cron player I am eagerly awaiting their new dex but I cannot lie to myself by saying we need it mroe than daemons. Quite a few armies have "anti daemon" equipment and abilities that are fairly standard as far as a usuall setup goes. I know when I run GK's I use lots of servo skulls simply because i love their myrad of support abilities at a fair price. Daemons need to catch up with the times and not turn into "everyones enemy" like they are right now.

Nightrave wrote:Well, let me dive a tiny bit more into it Exiledarc, so you can see why GK's are not very friendly for us

Its not that we cannot kill their termi's or their guys, heck we can walk threw alot of them given the chance....its just that deep striking is our biggest weakness fighting them...and here is why

Warp Quake, Servo skulls. Both of these cause -any- unit deepstriking that lands within 12" of a guy in the unit who cast the power, or withing 12" of the skull to be AUTO misshap. so if you roll a 1-2 you are destroyed, 3-4 they can place you anywhere (including another warp quake/servo skull and force you to misshap again, and again, and again) or 5-6 reserve, so vs gk's you really only either die, or go back into reserve. Now if we land withing 6" of the servo skull, sure it gets destroyed, but it was 3 points. Woopie!

So the guys with warp quake can only be the Librarian or really expensive dudes right? NOPE! its on their BASIC grey knight trooper. and they can combat squad to get it TWICE per unit. Also, did i mention it was 12" to each GUY? so spreading his line out can cover alot of area. Also its on their Intercepter squads... Warp quake has to be cast at the start of movement. So they take tests at the start, and then shunt to the four corners of the board. then rhino rush to middle, sevo skulls anywhere they dont wanna be, and on your turn......you misshap for the rest of the game!



i can deal with draigo wing. I can beat dark excummication, i can live threw rad and psycho, and psyck out and all their grenades..... Daemons can still win threw all of the rest of the codex...but if we cant even place a model on the table i cant really do anything...and pairing that the army is allready random..(which i love) it just..makes it super rough...almost impossible.



/sadpanda

That is where the fun part comes in..
To be honest, i have only played 1 game with the 12"scatter thing came into play.. I can tell it would be annoying with a close combat army list, but unless your playing a full khorne army, it shouldnt harm you to much...Besides what the hell do we need anything within 12" on the DS turn?? Apart from breath of chaos, nearly everything shoots at 24" max range(warpfire etc) and we cant assault on the DS turn. 6" movement/Run dice movement/6"assault movement.. thats a min of 13"-18"max range to close combat attack anything after we DS, providing nothing has moved closer towards that unit. Or am i looking at that wrong?

I like GK's because i actually have to play tactics with them.. I can scout around the table, move everywhere, its a more challenging game. Faceroll easy games are stupid. For me its not about winning, its more about having a decent game that see's 5(+)turns and i get to use everything i bring. I play more to survive than anything else. Plus im really stupid and play cautious for DS and dont spend the points on the icon (everytime i have that unit has died and not been able to give me non-scatter).

The skulls dont sound like a problem.

I havnt played any asshat GK players who scout to the edge then tank the middle and well.. be an asshat...But man thats a awesome strat for killing us I also have not played against any GK player who uses the "from any guy" rule for the 12" warpquake, they have all said its just from 1 guy in the middle of the unit... Do GK players know they are doing it wrong?

well, ill get to what i play then. I generally run alot of pink horrors (btw, only bolt of tzeentch and daemonic gaze is 24" range. Warpfire is 18")
hell! il just give you my "ard boys list!
Kirios
Skulltaker on Juggy
Tzeentch Herald on Chariot with DG, Breath, Soul Dev, and Master of sorc
6x Pink horrors w/ bolt
2x Bloodcrushers, one 5 man with Music (skull goes with that) and a 6 man with Fury of khorne
1x Flamers of Tzeentch unit with 7 Flamers 1 Bolt
2 Soulgrinds with Phlem/vomit
1 DP of Tzeentch with Bolt, breath and mark of Tzeentch



Not really a khorny army


Edit: also you cant MOVE from a deepstrike, you go from Deepstrike (in the movement phase) to Run or shoot, and you cannot assualt out of deepstrike, so most people get one turn to try to deal with us as we landed

And Warpquake is off the models in the unit, not just the justicar, as they can still combat squad and cast it (thats right, one unit can do it for two!!) and 12" from models (or their vehicle!) is pretty large range. it definitly can cover alot of board if they have 3-5 units that can use it, they can still cover a majority of the board.

Also dont forget that our deep strikes do scatter! (so even if you didnt place within the original 12, if you Drift into one, its a misshap!)


Its really really rough

Nightrave wrote:well, ill get to what i play then. I generally run alot of pink horrors (btw, only bolt of tzeentch and daemonic gaze is 24" range. Warpfire is 18")

Edit: also you cant MOVE from a deepstrike, you go from Deepstrike (in the movement phase) to Run or shoot, and you cannot assualt out of deepstrike, so most people get one turn to try to deal with us as we landed

And Warpquake is off the models in the unit, not just the justicar, as they can still combat squad and cast it (thats right, one unit can do it for two!!) and 12" from models (or their vehicle!) is pretty large range. it definitly can cover alot of board if they have 3-5 units that can use it, they can still cover a majority of the board.

Also dont forget that our deep strikes do scatter! (so even if you didnt place within the original 12, if you Drift into one, its a misshap!)


Its really really rough

My bad about 18"..

I know DS is your movement, i was meaning the turn after you DS.. but even then you can still run in the DS turn so that adds an extra D6 to the above number you can drop in far out.

Actually servo-skulls do nothing to stop enemy deep-strikes, they only stop scout moves/infiltrating within 12". In fact, they go away if you pop down next to them!

I recently took the plunge on Chaos Daemons as a second army. When first looking at starting 40k it was a toss up between SoB, CD and IG which eventually ended with IG because of its ease of play for a beginner. Now that I've got some experience under my belt Daemons seem like a fun challenge to play on the side, and it's just fun to be the only one playing something. The look on my FLGS owner's face as someone actually bought Daemons units immediately made the army worth it.

I play daemons, but by no means are they my competitive army. I play them more for fun, feeling like a GM when I do, creating a narrative and an adversary for the opposing force. For when I want to play more competitively, I have my Guard army.

By no way am i saying Daemons are not fun, i own alot of stuff (from eldar titans to all the forgeworld space wolves) Daemons are by far one of the more fun armys for me to play. I enjoy the random, i enjoy the variety, i love the deepstrikes. I enjoy when people engage my Blood crushers. Or when Kirios (or anything with boon mind you) makes mephistion/sang/njal/logan/draigo/abbadon/insert character here a Spawn of my glorious army (i actually made a bird spawn from the kit cause my buddy played shrike against me so many times and every game i would boon him into it!)

The army is a downright blast to play. People FEAR the bloodletters/crushers/thirster

I do play them competativly, and until the GK codex they are still IMO (if you play em good) a top tier army! cool models, cool army, good conversions available, good paint choices. Everything is...chaotic which is a blast!




as for the GK thing above. Im not saying Daemons cant beat em. im just saying a game vs a good GK player is going to be a notch below impossible on the level of killin if you want my reasons why, or how, ill be more then happy to share that via Pm! i dont wanna derail how awesome Daemons are in this thread no more

Shhh dont tell everyone our army is awesome.. then more will play them and we wont be so rare!

But they are awesome EVERYONE! DAEMONS ROCK! Play em alot so people can have fun interesting games!~!

I converted my 3.5 Chaos Marine army into Chaos Daemons. I have seen one other Chaos Daemon player in one of the two stores I frequent, the other store no one had ever seen a Chaos Daemon army until I played in a tournament there.

As for why low power gaming appeal, the random nature makes it hard to predict even in the Fate Crusher kind of lists. For all the risks of deployment the reward is not there considering how deep strike is so safe for Blood Angels or drop pods.

Daemons always give me the most boring games. I like it when an army has different armor values, and you have to pick your targets and use the right weapons against them accordingly. Daemons? No, you just fire whatever at them and hope they fail invuln saves. The Soul Grinder is a nice change of pace, but it's like one unit in the entire army.