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Hi, i have a good and long evening + night of friendly & competitive 40k coming up. Looking much forward to it, and im gonna bring my old and trusted mechdar (that are treating me, generally, better and better...).

I have decided to try out a new list though - with 9 walkers for that much added shooting power.

HQ
Eldrad (210)
Autarch w/ Fusion Gun (80)

TROOPS
5 Avengers, Serpent w/ Scatter Laser (175)
5 Avengers, Serpent w/ Scatter Laser (175)
5 Avengers, Serpent w/ EML + Stones (190) [Eldrad's ride]

ELITE
5 Dragons, Serpent w/ Scatter Laser + Stones (205)
5 Dragons, Serpent w/ Scatter Laser + Stones (205)
5 Dragons, Serpent w/ Shuriken Cannon + Stones (190)

HEAVY
3 War Walkers w/ 6 x EML (210)
3 War Walkers w/ 6 x Scatter Laser (180)
3 War Walkers w/ 6 x Scatter Laser (180)

TOTAL: 2000 pts

I think this list is pretty good (though i will have to gain experience with it, have been playing for countless years with, mostly, all av12 grav tank armies, most often with jetseer council).

Im really debating getting more EMLs though, for more longrange AT (like getting 3-6 on the serpents and/or swapping a walker squad to EMLs). But
very often i dont have too much luck with my EMLs though, scatter lasers seems to do just as well or better versus most tanks i face (raiders, venoms, razorback, rhinos, chimeras), so i think im gonna initially try the above. But it really like some experience/opinions on this (the scatter vs EML load-out ratio)
I might try 1-2 games with this setup (18 scatter lasers + 6 EMLs) and then try 1-2 games with 6xEML on the serpents (for a 12 scatters + 12 EMLs total load-out).

I think Eldrad is too good to pass up with the options/ability to guide two walker squads plus doom/fortune... and the ability to fortune two flat-out dragon serpents can be SO good. And of course psychic defense, and he aint even too shabby in cc when he is fortuned.
To summarise, he can annoy people all on his own, now that im trying to take a - temporary i promise! - break from my long-standing seer-council addiction

EDIT: added stones+eml to eldrads ride, per BlueDaggers advice (and downgraded one dragon serpent to s.cannon),

Pretty cookie cutter cut and dry for min/max Eldar, so it should do fine. The only glaring flaw I see is only 3 troop choices. Personally I would drop a Dragon Serpent for a DA serpent and use the leftover points to swap Eldrad's ride to an EML + Stones since you'll want it in the deep backfield for most of the game.

Well im quite used to just 3x5 avengers in serpents for my troops, all i have used for a long time. Usually not a problem (though sometimes it is!).

I think its a great idea to give Eldrad davu serpent an EML (maybe stones too, yeah)!

I'll drop one dragon serpent scatter down to shuriken cannon, that will give points for upgrading one avenger serpent to EML + Stones

- i'll edit that

you could drop the Scatter lasers on the serpents for SC cause you WS are the ones closing tino attack and drop of troops to strike and they make a half way decent battering ram. use the points for the walkers to have EML.

Monos would then be your only problem but all the missle could do well not great odds but well enough.

Cant wait to read the battle reports

Yea list is fine.

I personally dont like spirit stones.

My Personal rule is that EVERY walker needs guide and fortune. Make cannons over scatters, drop the autarch, and a guideseer with fortune as well if you can use it.

IMO Fortune/Guide is better than an autarchs 1 melta shot.

OK i changed my list, im gonna be bringing this list - going in the taxi right now


HQ
Eldrad (210)
Farseer w/ Guide, Singing Spear (78)

TROOPS
5 Dire Avengers, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (185)
5 Dire Avengers, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (185)
5 Dire Avengers, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (185)

ELITE
5 Fire Dragons, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (205)
5 Fire Dragons, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (205)
5 Fire Dragons, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (205)

HEAVY
3 War Walkers w/ 6x Scatter Laser (180)
3 War Walkers w/ 6x Scatter Laser (180)
3 War Walkers w/ 6x Scatter Laser (180)

TOTAL: 1998


Automatically Appended Next Post:
OK, just played the first game of friday night, vs a very good player (usually almost always beats me, with different armies) with Dark Eldar. With 6 venoms and 3 ravagers, 2 reaver squads (6 each, 2 heat lances), and 15 helions, duke and baron, plus something else i think (didnt see his entire army...). He IS kinda new to dark eldar, and i think he can/will also optimize his army farther.

Was a massive victory to be honest. Im almost scared of my own firepower (!), 18 tl scatter lasers from 9 walkers is BRUTAL vs open-topped av-10-11 and vs t3 fnp

He conceded in his t3, having lost almost everything (that wasnt in reserve) and I had lost nothing....

So for the first game with this army... pretty awesome... I def. wanna play some more games with this setup. In fact im wondering why it has taking me this long (been playing eldar since 2nd ed, all mech sine beginning of 4th) to try out 9 war walkers!!!

Next game is gonna be vs a very good space wolves army+player, so maybe im gonna be less enthusiastic afterwards.
Not sure of his exact army yet...but he has something close to: 3x5 missile fangs, 3 thunderwolfs, 5 heavy bolter razorbacks as well as 3 rhinos (with 3x8 hunters i think, 1 melta + combimelta, powerfist, Wulf + standard, and 3x5 hunters, melta+combi). And 2 wolf scouts squads as well.

And 1 or 2 rune priest, aint certain yet. Ah yeah 2 land speeders w multimelta+HF as well.

After that its gonna be a Tau army (that is currently fighting the wolves). The tau army is actually scary.... But ill get back to that!

Eldar usually have a very strong advantage against DE, especially with a ton of S6 shooting, it's pretty rare for my friend's DE to beat my Eldar simply for that fact. War Walkers are probably one of the best anti DE units out there lol so I am sure you had a field day with them =).

Yeah you are right, it does seem to me that mech eldar are a VERY tough match up for Dark Eldar! I think i can honestly say that against no other army does my mechdar seem so strong.

I did beat him as throughly last time with my eldar (without walkers, but with 6 scatter serpents, 3 prisms and 9 man jetcouncil).

What experiences do my fellow dakkaites have on mechdar vs deldar?

Mech eldar has a strong advantage. Eldar are fast enough to mitigate De's speed advantage and easy access to high RoF s6 shooting is brutal.

I played space wolves afterwards and got a second - rather crushing - victory. It was annihilation, the space wolves player going first. He conceded, i think in his turn 3, me being ahead 7-2 in killpoints, and having like 3 or so sure kill points in my turn 3. I have never beat his space wolves before. So i sure think im in the right direction with my new list

I found out just HOW good 9 guided scatter walkers are in taking out long fangs... Plus they raped his razor backs and rhinos (well supported by the 7 str6 shot serpents). At least in this game i needed to disembark two dragon units

Even though i had super success in the first two battles with my all str6 spam mechdar (see list a few posts above), im gonna change my list to be more versatile, especially to have more long range threats also vs armour 12-13. So im gonna add some EMLS. Just a few is my plan, as the str6 as been so super awesome

So i think the following list should be very good, and i hope to playtest it this weekend, maybe versus horde Orks and Mech IG, maybe other armies though (i never know what they are gonna bring, which is great)

HQ
Eldrad (210)
Farseer w/ Guide (75)

TROOPS
5 Dire Avengers, Serpent w/ TL EML + Shuriken Cannon (190)
5 Dire Avengers, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (185)
5 Dire Avengers, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (185)

ELITE
5 Fire Dragons, Serpent w/ TL Scatter Laser + Shuriken Cannon (205)
5 Fire Dragons, Serpent w/ TL Shuriken Cannon + Shuriken Cannon (190)
5 Fire Dragons, Serpent w/ TL Shuriken Cannon + Shuriken Cannon (190)

HEAVY
3 War Walkers w/ 6x EML (210)
3 War Walkers w/ 6x Scatter Laser (180)
3 War Walkers w/ 6x Scatter Laser (180)

TOTAL: 2000

If you are going second, are you reserving anything in your army or set up and try to mitigate what damage you sustain refine the first round of shooting.

I ask as I run a very similar list except I run Autarchs and have found War Walkers are ok, but not stellar without Guide.

You'll have a lot of luck against most things but your true test will be another eldar player, jump pack/FNP spam BA, or 2+/3++ FNP termies. 60pts invested in chin cannons makes me cringe, that's Stones + Doom or Fortune and RoWit for your Seer.

There was talk in another Eldar thread- a list featuring max Vypers and Max War Walkers, of upgrading at least some of your troop and elite Serpents to Star Cannons.

The reason being is that this helps alleviate the inherent difficulty of dealing with DOA BA, Plague Marines, and other obnoxious 3+ or 2+ FNP models that Blue Dagger just mentioned.

With 3 squadrons of War Walkers- you've already got oodles and oodles of s6 fire, it may help your list be more versatile by giving some of those Wave Serpents Star Cannons. Coincidentally scatter + extra cannon is the same number of points.

Never never never do I condone Starcannons. The proliferation of coversaves will always out weigh the potential usefulness of starcannons.

Personally to solve high armor/FNP problem I have turned to Nightspinner and am currently test lists with 2.

Is that because of the dangerous terrain tests?

It's a str 6 large blast so it naturally causes a lot of wounds, it's rending, with doom you can reroll all those non-6s for another shot at rends, and it's pinning with no place being safe from the barrage. The fact that you opponent guys slowed and kills his own guys is just a big perk

Are they doing well the 2 nightspinners? Do you think they do better than prisms with their str9 ap2 blasts (because that + dragons have been my usual answer to 2+ saves).

I dont think ill bring starcannons in a allcomers list, feel they there are too few situations where i wouldnt much rather have the cheaper (and most often still better) scatter laser

I'm still testing it. While the nightspinners make a mess for things the 3rd choice is trowing me for a loop. I'm not a overhuge fan of the falcon due to needing to move 6" to fire all it's shots and the only other choice I consider is another Nightspinner or a prism.

In all reality the Str9 AP2 blast is really overrated. First off it's a small blast and smart opponents will be spreading out their models and worse yet if it's 40mm bases you'll probably be hitting one on average. Second, the vast majority of the time your opponent will have cover. 3rd it requires guide which mean you have to preplan you movement accordingly to babysit it for the power.

Now don't get me wrong, I have plenty of games under my belt with 2 Prisms + Nightspinner and can speak columes to how well it works in conjuction with eldrad. Which the nightspinners however I'm finding more versatility, death, and mind-fricking of my opponent.

Last match vs DE: Nights spinners kill a raider and a venom, stunned 2 ravagers, immobilized 2 more vehicles, and killed countless infantry (only 2 DT kills that match lol).

Match before vs Nids: Piles and piles and piles of bugs killed with an average of 10+ models killed via DT test per round and several wounds on big bugs.

Match before that IG mech: Coutnsless infantry killed, several guns ripped off vehicles, 2-3 immobilizations, and I think 2 Chimera destroyed.

Match before that at 'Ardboyz: Doom + Nightspinner = 8 out of 10 FNP BA from a squad killed with a single blast.

I could go one and on.

What about using 2 spinners and one squad of suicide outflanking warwalkers?