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So i am trying to build a highly competitive and tournament worthy Nid list, so i can get some practice with it, and next year try bringing it to the tournament circuit...

A little background, i am brand new to Tyranids, i have the cash to collect all if not most of this army, specifically as a tournament competition army.

I have the codex, a Hive Tyrant, a box of gargoyles and a broodlord (that my shop gave me for free when i picked up the rest). That is what i have SO FAR... I have read the codex in full, in fact studied it for the most part, and have trolled many a Tyranid forum... This list is the culmination of my efforts, and i am hoping some pros with a lot of table experience with the bugs can drop me some advice.

I am just looking for opinions, criticism, or whatever in regards to the list, trying to make it as competitive as possible without being total cheese.

I am greatly appreciative of any and all feed back! Thank You in advance!

so here we go... 2500pts even

HQ
Hive Tyrant
Wings
Adrenal Glands
Old Adversary
265pts

Hive Tyrant
Wings
Adrenal Glands
Old Adversary
265pts

Elite
Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Zoanthrope Brood x3
Mycetic Spore
220

Troops
Genestealer Brood x8
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
160

Genestealer Brood x8
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
160

Termagaunt Brood x10
50

Termagaunt Brood x10
50

Tervigon
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
Catalyst
195

Tervigon
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
Catalyst
195

Fast Attack
Gargoyle Brood x10
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
80

Gargoyle Brood x10
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
80

Spore Mine Cluster x6
60

Heavy Support
Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

Hey, just taking a look at the list here it runs similarly to a competitive list I run, though you could use some tweaking.

fallynnknivez wrote:
HQ
Hive Tyrant
Wings
Adrenal Glands
Old Adversary
265pts

Hive Tyrant
Wings
Adrenal Glands
Old Adversary
265pts

I love my winged Tyrant. Sadly a CC Flyrant....or even any flyrant.....just isn't that good for how gods awful expensive they are. Missiles, lascannons, psycannons, autocannons, dark lances, blasters, poisoned weapons, et al will just chew through them. That being said I'd suggest taking x2 TL-Devourers as weapons so you can actually do some damage before you die.

Honestly if you want a walking Tyrant I'd do something like: x2 TL-Devourers, Old Adversary or Hive Commander, and a tyrant guard or two. That or just take the swarmlord. I wouldn't bother with two of them, either.

Elite
Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Zoanthrope Brood x3
Mycetic Spore
220

Looks good.

Troops
Genestealer Brood x8
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
160

Genestealer Brood x8
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
160

I don't think you're really going to need two broods. Adrenal Glands really aren't needed, they already have a high enough initiative and S5 would only be good for the Toxin re-rolls against T5 which there really isn't that much of in the game.

Termagaunt Brood x10
50

Termagaunt Brood x10
50

Tervigon
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
Catalyst
195

Tervigon
Toxin Sacs[
Adrenal Glands
Catalyst
195

Good setup for scoring MCs. I'd drop the Toxin and Adrenal Glands honestly. They're only really useful when you have multiple Termagant broods of 20+ models. Grab cluster spines for these guys, it's free.

Fast Attack
Gargoyle Brood x10
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
80

Gargoyle Brood x10
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
80

The broods are too small. Take 15 minimum. Preferably 20 strong and keep catalyst on them so they can live through bolter fire. Preferred enemy from having an Old Adversary tyrant around is very nice (too bad only a flying Tyrant can keep up with them and flyrants just die too easily).

Spore Mine Cluster x6
60

Can screw with enemy deployment a bit, but mech armies will just drive through them while laughing and horde armies will just feed you a suicide unit to get rid of them. At 1500-2000 they can be useful. At 2500 they're not even annoying except for taking up space in the deployment zone. Also a group this big has a huge chance of blowing itself up if one sporemine goes the wrong direction (this is a pretty big chance even with only a group of 3).

Heavy Support
Trygon
Toxin Sacs
210

Trygon
Toxin Sacs
210

No Toxin Sacs!!!! Toxin makes them worse in close-combat (4+ w/ rerolls gives you a 75% chance to wound, 2+ gives you a 83.33% chance to wound). Adrenal Glands might be more useful so you can strike before marines on the charge (useful if there are power weapons floating around). Upgrading one of them to a Prime might be a good choice.

Hey, thanks for the awesome reply...

As far as your comments on the Tyrants, you kinda lost me there, i will have to go back with my dex in hand when i get it and try to decipher and digest all of that...

but your saying only take one hive Tyrant?

Now, the way its setup is that the gargoyles will actually fly in front of the Tyrants to provide cover if needed and more then likely attack with the tyrant. Thats why they are not SO big of a squad.

If you could, could you elaborate on the reason i want to drop the adrenal glands and toxins on the Tervigo setups?

The cluster mines i am going for center of their deployment, hoping the place any foot slogging troops to the flanks and their vehicles to the center to run them over... Then some genestealers outflank those crazy footsloggers. I mean for 60 points why not, but i see what you mean about them destroying themselves.

As for the trygons, they will be changed to Adrenal Glands, thank you for saving me there

fallynnknivez wrote:
As far as your comments on the Tyrants, you kinda lost me there, i will have to go back with my dex in hand when i get it and try to decipher and digest all of that...
but your saying only take one hive Tyrant?

Now, the way its setup is that the gargoyles will actually fly in front of the Tyrants to provide cover if needed and more then likely attack with the tyrant. Thats why they are not SO big of a squad.

Well it is still hard to cover 50% of the Tyrants with the gargoyles. Even if you do it doesn't take much to kill off enough gargoyles to lose the cover save so the more gargoyles you have, the better. At 2500 you will see a ton of missile launchers (SW and IG), Lascannons (SW, IG, BA, SM), psycannons and autocannons (GK, IG), dark lances and blasters (DE), or shot a ton of shots (Orks, IG, GK, Eldar, SM, DE), or lots of poisoned shots (DE).

Even at 4W and 3+ at T6 doesn't survive that well. My winged Tyrants are usually dead turn 1 or turn 2 even if I give them catalyst. If you want a winged Tyrant, only take one, give him the guns (12 TL S6 shots are mean) and Old Adversary (will make a 20-man strong unit of upgraded gargoyles very deadly).

If you could, could you elaborate on the reason i want to drop the adrenal glands and toxins on the Tervigo setups?

Because Tervigons shouldn't be in CC and 10-man gant squads aren't going to do a thing even with Toxin and Adrenal. Your Tyrant, Gargoyles (Adrenal, Toxin, Rerolls to hit, and the special posion rule is nuts), and Trygons are going to be doing the major CC hitting. The gants are there to capture objectives, tarpit, and harass. You can build a list around it, but you'd loose a lot of your "Hit fast, hit hard" theme.

And honestly, I've never had a situation where the Tervigons were close enough to the gants to actually give them the bonus. The gants usually end up too far ahead of them to benefit (unless you have a very large squad (20 - 30) that you can string some models back. But in your list, you really don't need that.

Drop a Tyrant, drop the spores, and the Tervigon upgrades may be enough free points to bump up the size on your gargoyles and even get a third Trygon.

Okay... Sound advice my friend, thank you... Let me play with the list a little and i will repost something shortly.

What about the Catalyst upgrade on the tervigon?

And since the tervigon is an HQ, but becomes a troop choice, can the tervigon itself hold objectives?

Here's what I currently run at 2500 as an example.

HQ
Swarmlord - xxx
x2 Tyrant Guard - Lash whips - 130

(Sometimes I'll swap these for a winged Tyrant with TL-Devourers, Old Adversary, and Hive Commander. Hopefully he stays alive long enough to help out with the reserve rolls, but I don't expect him to live long....which sucks considering how expensive he is).

Elites
x3 Hive Guard - 150
x3 Hive Guard - 150
x3 Zoanthropes - Mycetic Spore - 220

Troops
Tervigon - Catalyst, Cluster Spines - 175
Tervigon - Catalyst, Cluster Spines - 175
x10 Termagants - 50
x10 Termagants - 50

Fast Attack
x20 Gargoyles - Adrenal, Toxin - 160
x20 Gargoyles - Adrenal, Toxin - 160
Harpy - TL-Venom Cannon - 170 (I think)

Heavy Support
Trygon - Adrenal Glands - 210
Trygon - Adrenal Glands - 210
Trygon - Adrenal Glands - 210

Total: 2000

I may be wrong on the price of the Harpy. If I am, just drop a gargoyle from one of the broods.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

fallynnknivez wrote:What about the Catalyst upgrade on the tervigon?

And since the tervigon is an HQ, but becomes a troop choice, can the tervigon itself hold objectives?

Always take catalyst. It's too good to pass up. And yup, the Tervigon is a troop choice so it can now score. Moving a 6W T6 monster off an objective is hard to do.

One more quick question, the Devourers with brainleech upgrade for scything talons can choose to fire either the devourer or the brainleech... my choice?

...and should i keep the wings?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Okay, tooled around and came up with, i am still over my pts limit... This list sits at 2579, not sure what to drop.

HQ
Hive Tyrant
Wings
Twin-linked Devourers w/ brainleech worms (So he can still keep his lash and bonesword)
Old Adversary
Hive Commander
295pts

Elite
Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Zoanthrope Brood x3
Mycetic Spore
220

Troops
Genestealer Brood x8
Broodlord
Toxin Sacs
182

Genestealer Brood x8
Broodlord
Toxin Sacs
182

Termagaunt Brood x10
50

Termagaunt Brood x10
50

Tervigon
Cluster Spines
Catalyst
175

Tervigon
Cluster Spines
Catalyst
175

Fast Attack
Gargoyle Brood x20
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
80

Gargoyle Brood x20
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
80

Heavy Support
Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

fallynnknivez wrote:One more quick question, the Devourers with brainleech upgrade for scything talons can choose to fire either the devourer or the brainleech... my choice?

You only fire the Brainleech, there is no choice.

...and should i keep the wings?

If you want him for the Old Adversary and Hive Commander support, go ahead. Just don't expect him to live very long. It's just the nature of things unfortunately. It would be nice if he could take a 4+ invulnerable save....but nope.

HQ
Hive Tyrant
Wings
Twin-linked Devourers w/ brainleech worms (So he can still keep his lash and bonesword)
Old Adversary
Hive Commander
295pts

In all honesty you probably shouldn't be charging stuff that you need the ID against and you already hit before most things. If you want it, though, keep it. What powers are you taking on him?


To get the points down you probably have to drop one genestealer squad (and bulk up the other one, maybe a max of 10 models). Or just lose the broodlords. They are a very nice upgrade, but not required.

Second list is solid. Only thing I might change was the broodlord for more bodies as 8 stealers is not a huge brood for 2,500 point games and pushing the numbers up to 10-11 will help possibly more than a single broodlord.

So the current list i am looking at is sitting at 2500

I have been looking at a Doom lately, but i dont think it would fit the synergy of the list... I have been tooling around with taking out a hive guard brood and putting in the Doom of Malan'Tai w/ Mycetic Spore... Is it worth it, or should i just leave in the Hive Guard?

HQ
Hive Tyrant
Paroxysm
Leech Essence
Wings
Twin-linked Devourers w/ brainleech worms (So he can still keep his lash and bonesword)
Old Adversary
Hive Commander
295pts

Elite
Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Hive Guard Brood x3
150

Zoanthrope Brood x2
Mycetic Spore
160

Troops
Genestealer Brood x10
Toxin Sacs
170

Genestealer Brood x10
Toxin Sacs
170

Termagaunt Brood x11
55

Termagaunt Brood x10
50

Tervigon
Cluster Spines
Catalyst
175

Tervigon
Cluster Spines
Catalyst
175

Fast Attack
Gargoyle Brood x20
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
160

Gargoyle Brood x20
Toxin Sacs
Adrenal Glands
160

Heavy Support
Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

Trygon
Adrenal Glands
210

Add another termie and it looks fine.

Agreed. Add a termagant and swap Psychic Scream for Leech Essence.

Okay done... Now, do you believe that this would be a highly competitive list? I am trying to get into the tournament scene and decided i was going to do it with nids, and when the new cron dex drops maybe them as well... Basically the entire goal of this list is just competitive... thats all its about

I have been tooling around with taking out a hive guard brood and putting in the Doom of Malan'Tai w/ Mycetic Spore... Is it worth it, or should i just leave in the Hive Guard?

I think it'd be interesting at least. If you don't have all the models, proxy them for a few games against friends to see if it works.

Well, Tyranids are hard to play at the very high end of competitive tournaments no matter how good your army is. A decent trick is to bring an army that is strong and has some unexpected elements to it. At high level tournys, opponents will probably be expecting mass tervigons supported by tyrannofexes/hive guard. That kind of army plays by slowly overwhelming the opponent with shear numbers while being stupidly survivable, but doesn't hit that hard.

Your list on the other hand moves very fast hits like a brick train in CC while being supported with ranged shooting but is much more fragile. You're going to have to adjust your tactics accordingly as this list relies on near-perfect synergy for your fast units. You pretty much depend on the hive tyrant living long enough to boost your gargoyles with Old Adversary, but the hive guard and zoans need to bust up transports before you hit with the assaulters. It is a very high-risk/high-reward type of army, but play it well and you will scare an opponent into making mistakes.

Mech lists are going to be a challenge, but then again, they always will be no matter what type of build you make. I'm interested to see how the stealers work for you. Personally I'd prefer more guns, but there really isn't any space on the FOC for you to add them.

I see, so Tyranids where not the BEST choice for a tournament army... I understand. Okay

fallynnknivez wrote:I see, so Tyranids where not the BEST choice for a tournament army... I understand. Okay

They can do well....it's just a lot harder than with other armies. There is no 'easy' button with Tyranids on the tournament scene. Forces you to be a better player and tactician.