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Hey need some help with an imperial guard army

HQ

Company command squad
Vox, auto cannon, grenade launcher, power sword, bolt pistol.
advisor???
[112]

TROOPS

Platoon command squad
Vox, auto cannon, plasma gun, bolter.
[62]

30 man infantry squad
3 auto cannons, 3 grenade launchers, vox, 3 power swords. Commissar with power sword.
[275]

Platoon command squad
Vox, auto cannon, plasma gun, bolter.
[62]

30 man infantry squad
3 auto cannons, 3 grenade launchers, vox, 3 power swords. Commissar with power sword.
[275]

10 man veteran squad
Vox, 3 melts guns, demo charge, bolt pistol, power fist.
[152]

Chimera
Heavy stubber, extra armor.
[80]

ELITE

Guardsman Marbo
[65]

10 man ratlings squad
[100]

FAST ATTACK

3 scout sentinels
3 lascannons, 3 hunter killers, camo netting
[210]

10 man rough rider squad
Power sword, melta bombs.
[120]

Bane wolf
Multi melta, heavy stubber, smoke launcher
[160]

HEAVY SUPPORT

Leman Russ battle tank
Lascannon, plasma cannons.
[200]

Please give me feed back on how this army list would go, strengths and weaknesses. Also what advisor should I go with. Was thinking master of the ordanance.

I am not sure on your goal for this list... CC or gunline.

If your goal is to go CC with heavy weapon support, I think there is a better way of doing it. But hey...congratulations on one of being the few lists I have seen using Rough Ryders though!

But for your first question, a MoO can work due to you being stationary. The drawback is that your geared up for close combat and thus your going to have units close to the enemy where you might scatter into them. Being that you have alot of static forces, a OotF might be a better choice then one random pie plate.

The other problem I see is that you have the wrong units geared up for close combat. Blobs with power weapons and rough ryders? Yes. CCS, PCSs and Vets? No. The standard IG with 3 for all of the important CC stats is just going to get crushed (specially the 5 man squads) before they even get a swing off. Your really throwing away points that could be better weapons. Your real defence to CC is blowing the heck out of them with special and heavy weapons before they get close enough to attack you. As a side note, your blobs need melta bombs for walker defence. Drop 5 points per sergeant and now if a Dread or any other walker gets in CC with you, your not totally boned. Read up the melta bomb and walker/grenade rules, but it is that or Str 3 power weapons and your entire blob either removed from the fight or outright destroyed.

You seem to want to do a Order based army, you have Platoons... why do you not have HWSs or Creed? If you do Creed and HWSs, you really want a Lord Commissar for his Aura of Discipline. Stand him within 6" of your HWSs and they now have a Ld 10 for Orders, Morale checks, and Pinning checks. You make him naked with a bolter (or if you have 10pts a Camo cloak). If your feeling cheeky, actually put him in a squad... though you risk execution on a failed leadership check, at least now the HWS is stubborn as well. Kell can work well with Creed but he costs as much as the Lord. I consider him 15pts cheaper due to the Standard, so put HWSs within 12" of the CCS with Kell. They can now re-roll morale checks and now units that are are not Commissar influenced get to use Creed's Leadership for Orders. Alot of people feel Kell is not worth it if you have a Lord, but I feel if you have the points, get both. And any army that does Orders needs Creed, specially power blob lists because of 'For Cadia!', Creed's special Order.

A second congratulations... you made a Scout Sentinal unit that almost works! But for 210pts I can have two Lascannon HWSs that I can issue 'Bring it Down!' to to make twin linked. And the HWSs are actually harder to kill if they are in Cover...and anyone who doesn't put HWSs in cover is being dumb. That is 6 LCs for the same points vs 3. The Camo netting almost makes the Sentinels survivable, but that BS 3, specially with one shot weapons means they hit 50% of the time, and that is just a waste IMO. Your better off with a second unit of Rough Ryders or Vendettas in that slot. Same thing goes with the Bane wolf. Your not attacking with it since you have very few forces that are actually moving forward... that is really a perfect spot for a Vendetta. And the Vendetta does what you want it to do in this list... sit back and shoot. As for the Rough Ryders... they are really good, specially that first chage against... well, nearly anything. But, their lances are at static levels so 'For Cadia!' (aka Furious Charge) does not adjust the Init or the Str past 5. They /will/ crush the first unit they charge (even vehicles with AV 10 rear armor) but after that they don't have much. Giving them a PW and Melta bombs is a good route, and now 'For Cadia!' can help them in CC, but now they are 'eh'. This is hard for me to say this, but this may be a better slot for a third Vendetta for 10pts more.

LRBTs that don't move are dead LRBTs. Sponsons are not worth it as it is hard to get both to fire on the same target, and if you move you can only fire one weapon besides the turret weapon. Oh yeah... BS 3. Your really better off with a medusa (or two) or a manticore (or two), specially in a Gunline list.

I like Marbro... he is the same mentality as the Rough Ryders... you hope they kill more points than what they are worth before they die. The Ratlings I am not sold on, specially a 10 man squad. I think either two 5 man squads or a single 5 man squad will do you fine. The problem with sniper weapons is that everything gets their armor save against it. Yeah, you have Rending and all of that, but that doesn't make you feel any better when 90% of your shots bounce off marines or you roll 1s to wound. To me, Snipers are great against MCs with huge Toughness, and not much else. There are several lists that jump through hoops to make the pinning the focus, with PBS and Primus Psykers and the like. I am sure they work, but when you need 3 units to actually work together to pull off an effect that is 'meh', I don't feel it is worth it.

Now... take a long hard look at Grenade Launchers. Look at the Krak and look at the Frag. Tell me you honestly feel this is a good weapon. The general rule of thumb for IG is this... if your BS 4, Plasma and Melta. If your BS 3, Melta and Flamers. You can't go wrong with meltas because they are assault, they are Str 8 AP 1, and have the added benifit of +2d6 armor penitration if a vehicle is within 6". No one wants anything to get within 6"-12" of a melta gun, even if it is BS 3. Flamers, well they don't roll to hit, so BS is unimportant. They ignore cover as a added plus, but against real front line troops (like power armor), they are meh. Your really hoping they fail on armor saves then you actually wound. For BS 4 troops, if your camping them, Plasma gets the edge over melta. Assaulting gets melta. Now you can really go both ways, as a melta on defence, even though it has short range gives you something if they Drop pod a Walker into your rear (or a Land Raider...damn BA). Same goes for assault. You can just stop moving to Rapid Fire your plasma guns...but then your not charging the unit due to the Rapid fire rules, which you should read since you have lasguns and seem to want to do CC.

The Voxs are eh, IMO, because you want to do Orders, but they are taking up valuable Special weapon slots in the CCS and PCS. I mean, that is 30pts in Voxs...that is 3 melta guns, or 6 GLs turned into Melta guns!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
A suggested list...

CCS - 240pts
Creed, LC, 2x Plasma guns, Camo Cloaks, OotF

Lord Commissar - 85pts (in HWS)
Bolter, Camo Cloak, melta bomb

Platoon 1

PCS - 50pts (in Vendetta)
4x Flamers

PIS - 130pts (blob 1)
Commissar, 2x Power weapons, Melta gun, Melta Bomb, AC

PIS - 85pts (blob 1)
PW, Melta gun, Melta Bomb, AC

PIS - 85pts (blob 1)
PW, Melta gun, Melta Bomb, AC

Platoon 2

PCS - 50pts (in Vendetta)
4x Flamers

PIS - 120pts (blob 2)
Commissar, 2x Power weapons, Melta gun, Melta Bomb

PIS - 75pts (blob 2)
PW, Melta gun, Melta Bomb

PIS - 120pts (blob 3)
Commissar, 2x Power weapons, Melta gun, Melta Bomb

PIS - 75pts (blob 3)
PW, Melta gun, Melta Bomb

HWS - 75pts
3x ACs

HWS - 75pts
3x ACs

HWS - 105pts (Lord Commissar's)
3x LCs

Vets - 210pts
Harker, AC, 3x Plasma guns, Demolitions

Vendetta - 130pts

Vendetta - 130pts

Manticore - 160pts

2000

Use the 30 man blob to bubble wrap the Manticore, protecting it from assault and DSing/DPed melta attacks. Use Harker to be 18" away in cover from enemy long range weapons (devistators and the like) Remember Harker gives them Scout, so they have 3+ cover saves. March both 20 man blobs 12" from the outside edges up. Put Creed and the HWSs towards the front to give Creed the best possible range for his Orders. The HWS just needs to be within 24" of Creed, but 6" of the Lord and both the HWS and Creed need to see the target for 'Bring it Down!'. Do not be afraid to have Creed issue 'Move! Move! Move!' to the two 20 man blobs. Use the Vendettas to sit back and shoot, and then late game (turn 4-5) zoom out to capture cleared objectives or drop out the PCS to burn out weak, cover based troops holding a objective. The PCS means the Vendettas are now scoring units. Keep the Manticore from shooting to close to the blobs to avoid scatter into them. This list gives you 10 ACs, 10 LCs, 5 plasma guns (at BS 4), 7 Melta guns and 8 flamers to go with the Manticore. This goes with 9 scoring units... 3 power blobs and Harker's vets.

Hope this gives you some food for thought!

Oh wow that's alota info

I was going for a orders stand and shoot army with some counter attack units. I tried to build and army that could deal with anything, by blasting the outa everything then claiming what's left.

Melta bombs is good Will do that for sure. Also the lord commissar I love. I'm not used to using special characters, and hate the model for creed, but I'll look into his rules.

thanks for the congrats on the rough riders, these are what got me back into 40k, I started making guard on scout bikes for some fun and a few small games using mates minis and bam I'm back

As I am usually stationary for the first and usually second (damn BA) I usually get 2 or 3 shots for MoO. But stoping an army from out flanking or arriving all at once might be a better benefit.

The power weapons are in the blobs to do a bit of damage in the combat, 30 wounds is a lot to go through even for marines! my pcs and ccs are purely for orders and popping transports.

I have one HWS

Thanks again for the congrats, allbeit slightly backhanded yes it's more points than HWS but 2 HWSs can't move as a scout into cover to get LOS to hiding vehicles first turn! 3 means I should hit with at least one! Than s9

I've never used vendettas, or any flyer for that matter. What's the benefits and drawbacks, how do they work?

I wanted a LRBT that could deal with anything BC for troops, lascannon for AT and PCs for MEQ. Keeps me versatile

Marbo is my psychological weapon, demo charge that can pop up any where at any time

Ratlings are a cheap unit to harass non fearless cc squads let my other units wipe them out before they can hack and slash, like my insurance policy if I have to many targets to deal with.

GL are versatile although I might just forget them and have lasguns, FRF, SRF makes them better anyway

Orders are my thing, need voxes to do orders.

I like your army list but not enough officers for units to give orders?? I think need to have a look at the codex again

But a masive thanks for the feedback, gives me some ideas.

Blocka wrote:I'm not used to using special characters, and hate the model for creed, but I'll look into his rules.

Alot of people don't use the fig, but use the character. You can call your commander whatever you want, just let your opponent know your using "Creed" and there shouldn't be an issue (except for WYSIWYG only Tournys).

Blocka wrote:I have one HWS

I strongly suggest you look at getting more. ;-)

Blocka wrote:I've never used vendettas, or any flyer for that matter. What's the benefits and drawbacks, how do they work?

I honestly suggest you read the skimmer rules in the base rule book. You can also read the Fast vehicle and Scout vehicle rules. But at the end of the day it is a AV 12 transport with 3 twin linked Lascannons that can move 6" and fire everything. Troops can not fire out of it, but there are special rules for grav chut insertion. The models are not cheap, but well worth it. Read the FAQ stuff on the GW wsite as well.

Blocka wrote:GL are versatile although I might just forget them and have lasguns, FRF, SRF makes them better anyway

Special weapons are the backbone of IG, it is a crying shame to not fill every slot. I have fired 50+ lasgun shots at marines using 'FRF, SRF!' and killed 3 Marines in a 10 man squad. I think 20 hit, but only like 8 caused wounds. It was really sad. End of the day it is a Str 3 weapon that is AP -. Some foes that may be an option, but don't bank on it.

Blocka wrote:Orders are my thing, need voxes to do orders.

No, you don't. If both the Order giver and receiver have voxs you can re-roll a failed Order. Otherwise the standard is you issue a Order and the unit getting it makes a Leadership check. Kell allows you to use the Commander's Leadership instead due to his 'Listen up Maggots!' special rule.

Blocka wrote:I like your army list but not enough officers for units to give orders?? I think need to have a look at the codex again

Creed can issue 4 Orders per turn at 24" range.

Blocka wrote:But a masive thanks for the feedback, gives me some ideas.

NP...good luck.

What BlkTom said. Not a fan of the Harker vet squad on foot myself, but I can see its use in a mostly foot list.

I'd be a little worried about a single manticore, but the list is solid and different. Having only three vehicles at 2000pts is a little iffy seeing as the opponent will likely have enough anti-tank firepower to take on twice that many vehicles at that point level.

I can see how hybrid lists can work, but I'm personally not sold on them. I go all mech or all foot myself, but the idea is definitely there in BlkTom's list.

Just my thoughts on the matter, but you can't go wrong with his advice.

I also prefer Straken over Creed, but I play super assault foot guard of doom.

Thanks Black...

The Manticore is firing indirectly so is behind cover, or at least that is the idea.

The Vendettas are starting behind cover if you lose turn 1 or scout moving 24" or, worse comes to worse, Outflanking. So all of their anti-vehicle weapontry (specially the long range ones) are negated because they have nothing to shoot.