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Hey guys,
I recently decided to start up a coven list after seeing a French man by the name of Henry, walk into our local gaming club for a day just for fun, he doesn't even live here he came on holiday, yeah he carried his DE army don't ask me why, and just completely demolish veteran after veteran racking up eight wins in a couple of hours against lists that I found impossible to beat with my everyday Kabal. Im not shocked as much by the fact that he tabled everyone in our club, excluding me cause we didn't get around to playing against eachother, as much as that he did it with a list that looked soo much fun! Not to mention that fact that he haid amazingly painted figures in colours that I would never be able to use with my Kabals. So, after much debating, i've decided to start up a coven "The Bleeding Soul" that is highly revolvant around fluff, his was and he gamed everyone with a list that he didn't even deem as competetive. Please read the reasoning section beneath each army list to understand why I chose what I did and so you can give critisism in light of it.

1000 pts

HQ

Haemonculus - HexRifle, FleshGauntlet, Animus Vitae 90 pts
1x Haemonculus - WWP, Liquifier 95 pts


Troops

8x Wracks - Liquifier, 1x Acothsyt - HexRifle 125 pts Raider w/ Flicker 70 pts

8x Wracks - Liquifier, 1x Acothsyt - HexRifle 125 pts Raider w/ Flicker 70 pts

9x Wyches - 2x Razor Flails, All w/ Haywire Grenades 1x Hekatrix - Agonizer, Blast Pistol 185 pts

Heavy Support

Talos - Chain Flails, TL-HL 120 pts

Talos - Ichor Injector, TL-HL 115 pts

Total - 995 pts

Something I was playing about with was the possibility of a wych alliance so that I could add them in where I felt they would be useful, don't know how likely that would be but whatever. Basically with my leading haemonculus I aimed for as much insta kill capability as I could without leaving too much to chance at the low point cost. Leading haemy is something i'll be reluctant to change. WWP haemy was originally without any further upgrades but I had 10 pts to spare at the end and decided on giving him a liquifier. Troops, wracks, obviously, every coven needs it. A liquifier per squad, hexrifle on the acothysts just because I love the look on peoples faces when they're expensive IC gets insta killed (provided they don't make their saves or have eternal warrior, which is unlikely) I don't really need the rifles and if I don't get those then i'd probably drop the acothysts. Wyches, come out the portal, be a nuisance, combo charge with wracks try and pop a vehicle, hence the blast pistol and haywire grenades, this is cause I don't have much anti-tank with this list imo, I just find them to be amazing. Wych weapons could be switched, or does anyone have a valid reason for me dropping these all together? 2x Talos with Chain flails and TL-HLs one with an Ichor Injector to hopefully pick of slightly more elite things?, again they pop out the portal, could pop a vehicle with the HL then charge cause, as I mentioned, I don't see enough DLs in this list but I don't want to give up my Taloi for one seeing as their such CC beasts. So theres the reasoning for list number 1. On to list number 2.

1500 pts

HQ

Haemonculus ancient - Huskblade, soul trap, animus vitae 130 pts
2x Haemonculus - WWP 85 pts a piece

Elites

6x Grots - 1x Liquifier 220 pts Raider w/ Flicker 70 pts

Troops

6x Wracks - Liquifier, 1x Acothsyt - FleshGauntlet 110 pts Raider w/ Flicker 70 pts

6x Wracks - Liquifier, 1x Acothsyt - FleshGauntlet 110 pts Raider w/ Flicker 70 pts

Fast Attack

2x Beastmasters w/ 10 Khymerae, 1 Clawed Fiend, 3x Razor flocks 229 pts

Heavy Support

Talos - Chain Flails 110 pts

Talos - Ichor Injector 105 pts

Ravager - 3X DLs 105 pts

Total - 1499 pts

Here is where I expect most people with disagree with the list. The ancient homey in particular. Ancient homey is more a fluff orientated choice to be honest but when paired with the grots they can prove to be very effective. I'll explain. This squad at the very start of the game has 2 pain tokens, meaning furious charge now by the time this time bomb explodes in CC its more than likely going to demolish anything in its way in two turns, tops. Furious charge takes care of any initiative problems, makes sure you hit more so on so forth. If you attack a squad that an IC is attached to, make the grots tackle the retinue and the ancient hit the IC, with so many attacks it's pretty likely the squad will be whiped out and if you're lucky you kill the IC and trap its soul. Now the units got 4 tokens due to Animus Vitae and the haemy can split whenever necessary to drop off tokens anywhere needed, not to mention that the haemy is now absolutely monstrous in CC and will likely slice up anything that steps in its way. To me it comes very close to an archons standards if it not matches them. The wracks now have a haemy each meaning they too start of with two pain tokens, however, as is obvious, there are now less of them which is strange considering I have a higher point allowance. My thinking was that now I had the opportunity to get harder hitting units so maybe the troops had to lose out a little. Also, i've got Gauntlets now cause I don't get in as many attacks as before so the gauntlet should be more helpful now, right? Beastmasters, Henry had a few, and they were unstoppable, but he probably geared them out perfectly and I have no previous experience and just basically guessed when I threw this together, advice please! Taloi are the same as before except without the HLs cause this time I brought a ravager. It's going to have to be fluffy because at this level no list can do without them. So what are you thoughts? Please take into account i'll be reluctant to change unit types completely i.e. Exchanging wracks for Warriors cause this is meant to be fluffy. However, with the item set-ups i'm open to all ideas, less so with my haemies but hey if you can argue your case effectively enough, i'll take it on board.

Thanks in advance.

I'm having a hard time considering your lists because you have a couple non-legal loadouts. For starters - you'd need at least 5 Beastmasters to field the Beasts you have with that unit. Also, your Grotesques can't even fit in their Raider, even if the Haem doesn't join them, much less if he does. Please go over the lists and make sure they're legal, then I'll be willing to work them over.

I will also at least note that the chance of a Hexrifle actually working is...slim. They are basically less good sniper rifles, let's take a look at their odds here for a second;

Hexrifle shot at Space Marine Librarian;

100% chance you'll use the weapon.
66% chance to hit
33% chance to wound
11% chance to get a wound past his armor save.
5% chance he'll fail his Wound check

So...a 5% chance it will work each shot - on a wimpy Space Marine Librarian who is one of the easier things to have it work on.

So, basically - if you're fighting a Space Marine list and fire 10 shots with Hexrifles at the Librarian, you have a 50% chance to kill him with the effect.

You know what would kill him faster and cheaper? Just shooting them with splinter weapons, because it's a lot easier and more affordable to hit someone with 20+ splinter weapon shots.