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Hey all,

Just been thinking about the transport vehicles in my forces and realize that with the occasional exception of units coming on in reserve I almost *never* use these things at all. They end up being more of a liability than a help. In battles where I am the defender I find them even more useless since I will likely stay mostly in my side of the table anyway do I need to have my units come on the table in vehicles.

Since I never use them I now have to ask myself why I keep spending the points for the darn things. Also I findmyself less and less drawn to more mechanized infantry lists in favor of foot sloggers and armored vehicles for that reason. Put an infantry stand on the table and he has a 3+ save and can move 6" no matter what the terrain he is in. Put him in a vehicle and he could move faster than 6" or less than 6" and his ability to survive a hit on his transport is less impressive than his own basic save value.

Anyone have any examples of where they have used transport vehicles throughout a game for more than just initial deployment of reserves?

Skriker

Due to the way the transport rules work, transports are pretty much useless unless you're playing on an absolutely gigantic table.

About the only thing you want to take transports for, and only if you have extra points, is for Immobile guns like the 17 pounder AT gun. Having a transport at least allows you to reposition it after deployment.

Armored transports (halftracks, etc...) are useful in a low AT environment. You can use them to run the troops up close, and also to provide suppression fire against potential assault targets.

Soft-skinned transports are another matter entirely, and imo in a regular game they should really only be used when you're pretty much forced to use them (i.e. units like the US Tank Destroyer platoon where you need them to transport the platoon leader so that your tank destroyers can move around the battlefield). If you're playing on a larger table (say, a Total War battle), then they can be useful in getting troops to the front lines.

And really, that matches up with the way things worked in the real world. Trucks were ideally never anywhere near the shooting. They were simply too vulnerable. They were almost always used to get troops near to the fighting, and not right up into the thick of it. In Flames of War, this means that you'll want to use them only when troops are coming on from reserve and the enemy isn't directly threatening your entry area. Use them to run troops up behind a convenient piece of terrain (roads help, of course, if they're available - and you should try and include one or two of them in a lot of games since crossroads were popular things to fight over), unload the men, and send the vehicles to the rear.

And conversely, if you ever get the opportunity to shoot up loaded transports, then you should probably take it. The transports will probably be easy kills, the contents of the transports will be vulnerable, and getting both the transports and the troops being carried will do wonders toward moving you to the magic platoon break point.

This was actually something I was wondering about myself.

It just seemed like transports are more of a hassle to use than they're actually worth outside of hooking up towable guns that are otherwise immovable or unable to move enough to be worthwhile. It might be a bit different if loading a transport didn't count as a move for the transport itself(if I was reading the rules correctly), but as it is the only forces that I would even think of taking transports with on a semi-regular basis would be the Germans because they've got special rules regarding their use that make them a little bit more appealing.

The only transports I've ever used are half-tracks, and that's only on the rare occassion. I have trucks painted for my Pioneer Kompanie and AT guns, but these are really for show. Only reason they ever come out of the case is when my 3 year-old wants to play with Daddy's brown trucks.

I run a Lehr Panzer Grenadier Co. and I use the half tracks quite a lot. They have their uses, you simply have to play the to their strengths. I have used them on first turn to get into a mounted assault and actually pull it off more times than not. I also use them as a mobile reserve to get Grenadiers into the fight. They do have their faults but as long as you remember the they can work out quite well.

Half tracks that come with panzer grenadiers are a different matter. They are armored, and come with a hull MG that's not passenger fired, have the mounted assault rule, and you can dismount in a storm trooper move.

Also, in the latest book, they definitely decreased the point costs for them.

What he's talking about is any other sort of transport team, even armed ones.

The US Half-tracks for example, only have a passenger fired MG, so are pointless to keep around once they drop off the infantry, about the only purpose for them is maybe to dismount the .50 cal MG on it when you drop the infantry off, before sending them to the rear.

dreager96 wrote:I run a Lehr Panzer Grenadier Co. and I use the half tracks quite a lot. They have their uses, you simply have to play the to their strengths. I have used them on first turn to get into a mounted assault and actually pull it off more times than not. I also use them as a mobile reserve to get Grenadiers into the fight. They do have their faults but as long as you remember the they can work out quite well.

Not even really comparable. I am talking unarmored trucks and jeeps, not armored vehicles with hull mounted weapons that don't requrie passengers to fire and that don't have special mobile assault rules that actually make them useful.

If my british transports were comparable to german half tracks I would be quite happy to pay for and use them on a regular basis.

Skriker

Vertrucio wrote:The US Half-tracks for example, only have a passenger fired MG, so are pointless to keep around once they drop off the infantry, about the only purpose for them is maybe to dismount the .50 cal MG on it when you drop the infantry off, before sending them to the rear.

Er... no.

If you're using your US half-tracks, then that means that there's no enemy armor around to threaten them. And if there's no enemy armor around to threaten them, then you don't need your bazooka teams. And if you don't need your bazooka teams, then you can leave them in the half-tracks to fire the MG.

Rarely ever will there not be tanks, or some kind of gun, around to threaten them, and keeping a bazooka team inside the half-track means it can't defensive fire should any vehicle assault you.

At the very least you can stick them in a forest so they can't be shot at from a distance, but sometimes you just can't get the objectives to allow it, and it limits its range.

Not sure if US Half-tracks are included in the price of their infantry for their mechanized companies, but it's more making due with what you have.

Admittedly its realistic, but the majority of the time the half-tracks for anything but PGs stay off the table or get sent to the rear in the 1st or second turn.

It'd be a bit more usable if you could call them back to the table in some way, like the LRDG can in raids.

Vertrucio wrote:Not sure if US Half-tracks are included in the price of their infantry for their mechanized companies, but it's more making due with what you have.

Half-tracks are included in the cost of the US Armored Rifle Platoon.

I run a single platoon of Armored Rifles in my US Armored Company, and I've had instances in which I left the bazookas inside. It's something that you need to be careful about, but it's something that definitely comes up. And those instances when you wouldn't - i.e. when there's enemy armor that's in a position to directly threaten them - are the same instances in which you'd send half-tracks to the rear anyway regardless of which nationality they are. So the fact that the MG on the US half-tracks is passenger fired is pretty much a non-issue imo. Either your opponent can't directly threaten them, in which case you leave them on the table with the bazookas inside, or your opponent can directly threaten them, in which case you send the half-tracks to the rear regardless of which nation you're playing as.

All transports have there uses people are turned off by the fact that they count against you and not for you when on the table. I have yet to maneuver around "Transports" without support or with out a reason. Weather passenger fired or hull. I have moved them into position to attack and then rushed in tanks or Light tanks to give the defender the choice of which one too attack. If the terrain on the table doesn't support them then I will just send them out on foot from the get go.