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Hello! Due to some interest with a few members of my local gaming club (and it's a big thing in Cardiff, or so it seems), I've decided to take the plunge into Flames of War.

Liking small, mounted armies, I chose the Gepanzerte SS Panzergrenadierkompanie from the Earth and Steel book. Initially I've bought and made up the required HQ (no added AT) and 2 Platoons (full strength), and a platoon of Panzer IVs, which gets me to about 1140 points. I've heard that 1750 is the size for a normal late war game, as was wondering on how I should expand the force?

I'm already leaning heavily towards adding some 8.8cm Flak36s, and possibly some form of artillery support to bring it up to 1750.

You'll definatley want some artillary. Most people use 105's but I spend the pointd on hummles. Neblewerfers are a cheap option but to many drawbacks for my liking. 88's are good as they can double as anti-aircraft weapons if needed and for a few extra points they get 3 shots instead of two. With a mechanized company you'll usually be the attacker so stationary weapons may not fit in well except to hold objectives.

Thanks, I'll definatley look into the Hummels. The 88's are more of a "I love them" thing though, so effectiveness (or lack of) in their regard is fine.

8.8's with the extra crew for RoF 3 are indead deadly, and powerful enough to knock out almost any armor you will face. If nothing else they are great for area denial.

I would also suggest some medium mortars so you can have some cheap smoke. Smoke is a really awesome tool that you will want to have in your kit.

You won't regret the 88's. One thing though even though you'll rarely use them. Have transports for the 88's. In missions where they come on in reserve if they have no transport thry are stuck on the edge they come in on.

Harsh. I'll do that.

Ya real harsh. That's why Hummels are nice because they're self propelled. Plus they are just beasts lol. Keep this in mind to. 88's are way cool but are static. A tiger tank is an 88 that moves and has armor.

MrJody wrote:Ya real harsh. That's why Hummels are nice because they're self propelled. Plus they are just beasts lol. Keep this in mind to. 88's are way cool but are static. A tiger tank is an 88 that moves and has armor.

True, but you can get 2 88's for each Tiger. Also an 88 always gets at least a 5+ save.

True and a fire power test must be passed because the 88 has a gun shield. I love 88's and use them often but only if I am playing defensively. For an offensive strategy A Tiger is more useful not to mention front armor of 10, side 9, and top 2 and a Tiger ace skill. I'll take that over a 5+ save any day. But to each thier own.

Tiger has crap ROF compare to an 88 with extra crew. It's all dependant on the Tiger Ace skills.

I wouldnt go as far as to say CRAP.

RoF 2 vs. RoF 3

thats hardly CRAP...

Makes a big difference, 3 per gun vs 2 per gun. So 2 of each equals 6 shots to 4 shots per round. Both 88mm.

So for every round you are effectively getting another tiger (without applying Ace skills).

Plus if a tiger moves ROF 1. Once an 88mm is in situ, you won't move it will you? So unless you want to use a Tiger as a static crap 88, you will be at ROF 1.

88mm's dug in are absolutely brilliant IMHO, and are nicely complimented with Nebs and 120mm Mortars.

Well thats how I see it.

88s are not concealed by being dug in. So if they're in the open and dug in, they're hit with a basic roll. This also makes them easier to smoke.

The only other benefit for being dug in was to force a firepower save, but the 88 has a gun shield, meaning that's a firepower test anyway, and the 88 has a turntable, meaning it can't be flanked in assaults either, although I think you can still simply shoot behind the gun shield.

Sure, that Tiger is down to RoF1 when it moves and shoots, but at least it can move out of a smoke cloud, or move to be hidden in terrain. Also, 88s have a range of 40", and most tank guns have 32" in late war. Only an 8 range distance, more than enough for a tank to start out of range, then move into range to fire.

The only good thing about them is that they're relatively cheap for the gun they have, but they aren't actually that survivable when being shot at directly by weapons with a decent firepower, of which there are a lot.

Use them to block off attack lanes, and always try to deploy them farther back where their long range can hit the enemy and use that higher RoF to offset the long range penalty.

But if you're on the attack, or don't know if you'll be attacking or defending, then you'll want to pay for that expensive Tiger to be sure you have what you need.

Vertrucio wrote:The only other benefit for being dug in was to force a firepower save, but the 88 has a gun shield, meaning that's a firepower test anyway, and the 88 has a turntable, meaning it can't be flanked in assaults either, although I think you can still simply shoot behind the gun shield.

Don't forget that gun shields won't protect against bombardments. So being dug in still helps.


One more point in favor of the 88 that sometimes slips past people...

They're Heavy AA, so they have a very low rate of fire against aircraft (and are therefore not all that useful against air support), but the 40" range on the gun can sometimes catch players off guard when they position their AOP.