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I finally managed to post this up on my blog, where it is explained in detail, but for the sake of discussion I'll summarize here.

In brief: The warp is a realm of true, absolute chaos by the ancient Greek definition of the idea, and thus devoid of life and any other kind of coherent mass. Psychic powers are simply the ability to draw matter and energy from the warp and sculpt them into meaningful effects and objects. The Chaos Gods, daemons, angels, and all other mythological entities are, in fact, fictitious, existing only in Imperial scripture-- sometimes being fabricated into real forms by psykers, who like just about everyone else are utterly ignorant that these were not "summoned" from beyond, but have only just come into existence by the psyker's power, perhaps even having false memories of centuries of existence. Many of the bizarre unexplained phenomena within the Imperium are caused by the Emperor's restless, senile dreaming by the same powers.

Even briefer: psykers turn chaotic matter into useful stuff, and for the most part believe that it's all coming from gods and divine providence rather than their own powers manifesting their thoughts directly.

Thoughts and opinions on this variation? Just assume anything this version of things purges from canon or otherwise interferes with is a feature, not a bug.

How is it that Daemons can invade a planet/system then?
How do daemon princes come about?

purplefood wrote:How is it that Daemons can invade a planet/system then?
How do daemon princes come about?

Daemons wouldn't be nearly numerous enough to stage an invasion of their own; they'd be more like really big attack dogs as part of a Chaos force. And the whole concept of daemon princes is invalidated by my concept, if it's correct that those are Chaos lords elevated to regal status by their Chaos God. Without gods to exalt them, the closest you could get would be a psyker transmuting his own body to become like a daemon himself.

Ixion wrote:

purplefood wrote:How is it that Daemons can invade a planet/system then?
How do daemon princes come about?

Daemons wouldn't be nearly numerous enough to stage an invasion of their own; they'd be more like really big attack dogs as part of a Chaos force. And the whole concept of daemon princes is invalidated by my concept, if it's correct that those are Chaos lords elevated to regal status by their Chaos God. Without gods to exalt them, the closest you could get would be a psyker transmuting his own body to become like a daemon himself.

Daemons are numerous enough to start invasions on their own...
That's why the GK exist.
Is this a replacement idea or simply a different take on the warp?

purplefood wrote:

Ixion wrote:

purplefood wrote:How is it that Daemons can invade a planet/system then?
How do daemon princes come about?

Daemons wouldn't be nearly numerous enough to stage an invasion of their own; they'd be more like really big attack dogs as part of a Chaos force. And the whole concept of daemon princes is invalidated by my concept, if it's correct that those are Chaos lords elevated to regal status by their Chaos God. Without gods to exalt them, the closest you could get would be a psyker transmuting his own body to become like a daemon himself.

Daemons are numerous enough to start invasions on their own...
That's why the GK exist.
Is this a replacement idea or simply a different take on the warp?

I'd call it a replacement, with the clause that everything that can no longer exist as a result doesn't. As such, daemons are very rare (perhaps numbering in the thousands across all Chaos cults), and the Grey Knights, if they do still exist, are superfluous, and any "blessed" weapons they have won't be any more effective against a daemon than anything else, despite what they might believe.

Ixion wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Ixion wrote:

purplefood wrote:How is it that Daemons can invade a planet/system then?
How do daemon princes come about?

Daemons wouldn't be nearly numerous enough to stage an invasion of their own; they'd be more like really big attack dogs as part of a Chaos force. And the whole concept of daemon princes is invalidated by my concept, if it's correct that those are Chaos lords elevated to regal status by their Chaos God. Without gods to exalt them, the closest you could get would be a psyker transmuting his own body to become like a daemon himself.

Daemons are numerous enough to start invasions on their own...
That's why the GK exist.
Is this a replacement idea or simply a different take on the warp?

I'd call it a replacement, with the clause that everything that can no longer exist as a result doesn't. As such, daemons are very rare (perhaps numbering in the thousands across all Chaos cults), and the Grey Knights, if they do still exist, are superfluous, and any "blessed" weapons they have won't be any more effective against a daemon than anything else, despite what they might believe.

But if daemons are created by a psykers belief surely weapons that other psykers believe to work against them will also work?
The idea is okay but it's not quite as grimdakr as the ucrrent idea.

purplefood wrote:

Ixion wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Ixion wrote:

purplefood wrote:How is it that Daemons can invade a planet/system then?
How do daemon princes come about?

Daemons wouldn't be nearly numerous enough to stage an invasion of their own; they'd be more like really big attack dogs as part of a Chaos force. And the whole concept of daemon princes is invalidated by my concept, if it's correct that those are Chaos lords elevated to regal status by their Chaos God. Without gods to exalt them, the closest you could get would be a psyker transmuting his own body to become like a daemon himself.

Daemons are numerous enough to start invasions on their own...
That's why the GK exist.
Is this a replacement idea or simply a different take on the warp?

I'd call it a replacement, with the clause that everything that can no longer exist as a result doesn't. As such, daemons are very rare (perhaps numbering in the thousands across all Chaos cults), and the Grey Knights, if they do still exist, are superfluous, and any "blessed" weapons they have won't be any more effective against a daemon than anything else, despite what they might believe.

But if daemons are created by a psykers belief surely weapons that other psykers believe to work against them will also work?
The idea is okay but it's not quite as grimdakr as the ucrrent idea.

None of this operates on belief beyond the point of creation. There is no actual magic involved, only physics, so there's no way to make a weapon more effective against a particular opponent than any other. Everything now operates within the same bounds.

And yes, it does make things less grimdark; this is largely by design. Consider that it also releases the Emperor from fighting against the Chaos Gods in the warp, makes what would be Slaanesh nothing but a really big daemon of relatively benign if lascivious disposition and makes the entire Horus Heresy impossible by eliminating the chief cause of Horus's initial betrayal and whatever extra power he might have had in his battle with the Emperor.

I get the sinking feeling this isn't going to get discussed at all, just pelted with more reasons why it's canonically impossible or simply not grimdark enough.

Probably so. Sorry :( It's an interesting idea, it just doesn't work within the context of the universe.

Cromat wrote:Probably so. Sorry :( It's an interesting idea, it just doesn't work within the context of the universe.

I appreciate that you think so, but I have to agree that these ideas clash rather badly with things as they are in modern 40K.

I think I might have more success trying to get into one of the RPGs using only the fluff from classic Rogue Trader.