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Alright so I'm still a light Warmachine player (more of a tau BA player), and as such I have a minimum of models. I got into Warmachine for the jacks, I love the jacks, I love heavy armor, I love the thought of dudes in far too much metal marching forward 300 style. Thus I choose Khador. Started with a battle box, bought a Spriggan and a Decimator (the chainsaw one...) bringing my Jack total to 4 and having a gakky warcaster for an all Jack Army. So I bought the Butcher (regular not epic) figuring full throttle would really be useful. In keeping with this sort of slow heavy armor force I've run into a snag though. After searching through the articles and such, I still can't make up my mind, so I've come to the world of Dakka to help me out. Namely:
what do I buy next?
I'm put off from buying most of the units by their monetary cost (as much as a squad of terminators for a box of iron fangs) but have been able to find ok deals on Ebay, so really I just want to make sure I don't buy a unit that isn't going to add something to my army. So far the top three choices are:
Iron Fangs with UA
Man O War Shocktroopers
Winter guard (in that order).

I've heard good strategies for using winter guard with Butcher, but I hesitate because I've heard to really make them effective you need Jezof, and that you need a lot of cannon fodder bodies (very russian, very cool but again..money...)

So yea, what does dakka think would most help my army grow?

Well Butcher has Iron flesh so either Iron Fangs w/UA or WGI w/UA and Joe would be the best bet for you. WGI don't need joe but for the extra points he takes a good unit and makes them amazing. MoW aren't a bad option if you want to go tiered, but your list then lacks anything with a decent movement - which really hurts in a senario game.

Think of it this way, any of those units will add something good to your force. The MoW are tough but slow, which since you already have a lot of our slow warjacks will hurt. The Iron fangs are really good especially if you also have their UA, but one f the most feared infantry formations in warmachine is the winter guard deathstar. A Full unit of winter guard, with 3 rocketeers and the UA, as well as Joe is 13 points, it can kill infantry with high numbers of boosted to hit shotguns and rockets, it can make combined ranged attacks to kill warjacks, and everyone in the unit can become tough with high defense to survive attacks. The full deathstar comes out to about $70 on amazon (Not including shipping) so think of a unit of Space marines and their accompanying rhino.

However really whatever you pick to expand you will use. Warmachine is not like 40k in that only a few units from a given army are really competitive. If anything there are only a few models/units that really are not super useful. For khador as long as you avoid kossite woodsmen, and maybe assault kommandos anything you pick up will see play.

Another option to consider if you want to run a Jack heavy list would be to look at utilizing Harkovich as your warcaster. His Escort upkeep spell will give all your jacks +2 movement, he gives your jacks pathfinder, Bombard gives you an extra shot with each jack (that doesn't count against ROF), and he can give rerolls for ranged attacks with another upkeep spell.

Add in a couple of Field Rifles or Mortars and Black Ivan, and you can be running his Tier 4 list. Black Ivan is an upgrade to the Destroyer kit, so you could add all of these for less than $60 USD.

Tier 4 List
Harkevich (+5)
- Black Ivan (9)
- Spriggan (9)
- Decimator (8)
- Juggernaught (7)

Mortar (3)
Mortar (3)

Total - 34

Toss in a Wardog for the last point, and you'll be set for 35 point games. Alternatively, you could upgrade the Juggy to a Destroyer, Decimator, or other 9pt warjack with a ranged attack, as the T4 bonus will give you a 1 point cost reduction.

I'm unfamiliar with harkevich and black ivan? is ivan bonded to him or something? what's the benefit?

Thanks for explaining the Winter Guard deathstar...everyone just always calls it that they never say how you make one...I've seen it used at my FLGS several times but no one ever paints theirs (naughty people!) so it's hard to tell who's whom.

Harkevich is the new warcaster in Wrath. He's more focused on running jacks where all our other casters tend to like only 1-2 jacks at most.

Black Ivan is his character jack, in the same way that Beast-09 is Sorcha's jack. He's a souped up Destroyer, and gains an additional die on ranged attack rolls with Harkevich.

I will warn you that Harkevich is generally considered one of Khador's weaker casters.

k why? is he less focus? lower arm?

He's got respectable focus, and is even more efficient with it if you are concentrating on warjacks with ranged attacks. The reason he is considered less competitive is the nature of his abilities: he supports ranged warjacks. Khador certainly has good warjacks, but overall infantry tends to be better. Harkevich's only interaction with Khador's excellent infantry is Fortune. It's a fantastic spell, but others can do much more. Further, by relying on ranged warjacks it means he doesn't have the "nail in the coffin" actions like increasing the speed of Beast09 into someone's face. He can give something like that Pathfinder, which certainly helps, but it's not as good as Vlad's feat or Sorcha's extra charge distance since you can usually grab Pathfinder elsewhere.

While he has a good focus stat, he will be spending nearly all of it every turn so he can't camp for armor. He does not have a high enough Defense to rely on it against attempted assassination runs either. This can be mitigated a bit by a War Dog, but it still doesn't replace defenses other casters have.

Now, all this being said I think he's a very fun caster that is capable of running 3 Heavies with ease. His theme list is full of everything you would want to bring with him anyway, and he gets pretty decent bonuses for it too so it's usually worth running over non-theme unless you want things like Eiryss.

Harkevich buffs ranged warjacks, which is not a strong suit of Khador. The fact that our non-character warjacks only have a RAT of 4 means they need to be boosted to hit most targets. He's got 6 focus, and if you're using his extra shot spell, that's half of it for an additional ranged attack from each jack. You'll want to be using Escort at all times (+2 movement for jacks and Harky, and +2 arm if he's in B2B with a jack). Fortune is another upkeep spell that allows rerolls of missed ranged attack rolls, so now you're using 5 of his 6 focus, and only have 1 for boosting one of your 6 shots. This means half of your shots (Black Ivan is auto-boosted ranged attack with Harky) are firing at only RAT 4.

I'm working up the jacks and mortars to run him at 35 points with his t4 list, 4 jacks, 2 mortars, wardog, and Harky will be tough for alot of lists to deal with.

mmm yea i'm not a big Rat player...my destroyer I rely on for the fact that it WILL scatter lol...I'm more of a bum rush player, but sorcha's a bit too squishy for me and her skills are better (unless you have beast 09) on troops...

I understand that our warjack caster (i can never pronounce their names sorry) is quite good at this too for his tow ability, but is it better than full throttle or epic butcher?

dbsamurai, you seem to be more of a Karchev Player. he is our other Jack Caster. he is literally a man inside a Warjack. hes also the most expensive Warcaster in the game. hes about $60

and in all honesty you won't spend nearly as much on Warmachine as you have on 40K.

I can understand budgeting. But I -just- got the Old Witch and x2 Kit's of Kossite Woodsmen. To compliment my starter force and so I can use Yuri the Axe.

It would be roughly the same. As buying x2 boxes of Space Wolves and the Rune Priest. There was roughly a $15-$20 difference. When this hangover fads I'll post the statistics.

For Mother Khadoria!

poor college student. I literally have 30 bucks a week to get me thru, hence why I wanna make sure i'm getting my money's worth lol

To get the best bang for your buck I would suggest looking at purchasing used minis from people getting out of the game. Khador are very popular, so there are usually very good 50-60% off deals on the Dakka Swap Shop or Bartertown. The Winterguard Deathstar is a staple among most lists so they are relatively plentiful to find used, as well as other things like mortar crews, Great Bears, and various solos or warcasters.

i play khador too, hoping to max out my faily infantry based army with heavy 'jacks like Beast 09 and the behemoth. i mean they are things that all players fear, also i would recommend the pikemen with UA, ive got them and their great IMHO

good luck