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How does a Necron Entropic Strike interact with Dark Eldar Flicker fields?

1.) Do you roll to hit and then on a 4+ allow the vehicle to make Flicker Field invulnerable saves against entropic attack?

or

2.) You roll to hit and reduce vehicle armor by 1 and Flicker Fields can only be used against any resulting glance or pen hits?

The latter.

rigeld2 wrote:The latter.

Yup. You only get saves against damaging results; Entropic Strike kicks in on successful hits.

Wow, so not good for Dark Eldar...

Its not like we don't rely on our 4+ invul saves anyway

This does not effect lower armored units as much I think. Against higher AV targets it would more useful.

Yeah, your stormraven with the 3+ shrouding cover save? No one cares.

Sir_Prometheus wrote:Yeah, your stormraven with the 3+ shrouding cover save? No one cares.

Good luck actually hitting a fast skimmer in CC though.

But yes OP you possibly lower the AV because of the hit, and cover and invuln saves do not protect against hits.

DeathReaper wrote:

Sir_Prometheus wrote:Yeah, your stormraven with the 3+ shrouding cover save? No one cares.

Good luck actually hitting a fast skimmer in CC though.

But yes OP you possibly lower the AV because of the hit, and cover and invuln saves do not protect against hits.

With 50 attacks on the charge, challenge accepted.

Good luck getting that many attacks to survive long enough to get into CC with the Stormraven.

And Stormravens do not usually last long enough for it to matter. they race up, drop their load, and if they are still alive, which is usually very rare, then you fly around and shoot stuff with them.

Should have been more specific, was thinking of that harp thing, only ranged entropic strike.

To attempt to steer this thread away from a potential argument over the relative survivability of scarab swarms vs. storm ravens...

I agree with Rigeld and Janthkin.

While the BGB doesn't specifically mention invul. saves for vehicles (unless I'm missing something), context and common sense dictate that they only function against damage results, not hits.

Hope this helps!
-GK

It doesn't really matter what the bgb says, against vehicles entropic strike works as the hit occurs. No other factors are considered.

Sir_Prometheus wrote:It doesn't really matter what the bgb says, against vehicles entropic strike works as the hit occurs. No other factors are considered.

Hypothetically, if invul saves for vehicles canceled hits, it would matter.

Since the BGB is silent with respect to invul saves on vehicles, it doesn't (and wouldn't) say that.

Scarabs; bypassing power codexs cheesy rules since november 2011!

i too will take on the storm raven challenge! last night 9 scarabs did the following vs DE:
- assaulted and destroyed a boat (unit pinned!)
- then assaulted said unit and wiped them out for the loss of 2 bases
- then assaulted 10 hover board rider lads. in 2 turns made them run for the loss of 3 bases. Total.
- 3+ cover save vs shooting is a beautiful thing!
- i may drop the anni barge and run a second squad of 6!

It's actually rather easy to catch fast skimmers with scarabs... 6" move, d6" fleet, 12" charge means they have the same potential movement as a flat out movement on a vehicle so ...

I think the bigger problem is that thinks like incinerators will wreck scarab bases like crazy. Doubled wounds plus instadeath due to double the toughness.

You read that right. Hit like, 4, 5 bases with an incinerator? Every 2+ to wound is two, count 'em two dead bases.

Umm unless I'm mistaking the incinerator is only s5? That's not enough to double ID scarabs. Need s6.

If you were referring to a flamestorm cannon, however, yes you'd be correct. Except that it's a template weapon, and as such will rarely be in position on the scarabs to use it effectively until the scarabs get a charge off.

psyflame incinerators are str6

So they are... was thinking the old witch hunter one for some reason. Point still stands on getting it in range when scarabs have a 19" - 24" threat range though.

If any DE player has been claiming a 4+ for Flickerfields they've been cheating you

The flickerfield entry just says it grants a 5+ invulnerable save.

You could (i suppose..if you wanted to stretch it) claim that it grants this 5+ against everything, as it doesn't specify just damage results.

I'm inclined to think it just means vs damage though, so scarabs wold work fine imo.

I believe the argument was 4+s to get entropic hits and then 5+ invluns on the wounds due to flicker fields.

Well, the specific tool I think would be a Dreadknight.

Heavy incinerator is kinds like IG tank, can project an incinerator template at range. (small end within 12", angled mostly as you wish)

Heavy Psycannon is a Str 7 large blast. Scarabs get cover against that, which is unfortunate, but you'll still get plenty. And I don't think you'll be able to hug cover so much if you want to be charging me.

Shooty dreadknight will kill a lot of scarabs at range. It's going to kill a good 3 or so bases in CC too, so it has a chance to avoid the entropic strike unless you get a ton bases on it without getting shot up, first, which I don't think will happen.

Really, even in CC, your chances of hurting the dread are low. 5+ to hit, 6's to wound. 2+ save. So yeah.....you need 108 swings just to land a unsaved wound.

Nevermind, Dreadknight doesn't need the guns.

Isn't the Dreadknight T7?

Edit: never mind. It's T6.