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Is there such a thing as a competitive Grey Knights list that doesnt involve Draigo and Paladins.

1. HQ: Crowe
Troops: 5 or 6 man Purifier squads in Rhinos or Razorbacks
Support: (Venerable) Dreadnoughts

The above is probably the most competitive of all GK lists, it's certainly the most common.

2. HQ: Coteaz, Librarian
Troops: squads of 6 Death Cult Assassins + 4 Crusaders in Stormravens
Support: Techmarines, Vindicare assassin, Dreadnoughts

3. HQ: Coteaz
Troops: various Weakling squads in chimeras or razorbacks
Support: (Venerable) Dreadnoughts

There are quite a few others that can do well, though in fairness few GK builds are optimal if they lack a named character (except possibly a Librarian as sole HQ). Despite what some people think Draigo and Mordrak (but no Ghost Knights) are far better value than normal Grand Masters.


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One of the best things about the GK codex is the sheer number of viable but different builds that are possible. It's one reason why it's often hard to answer 'how do I beat GK' because a Crowe/Purifier list is utterly different to a Draigo/Paladin one and neither pose the quite same sort of threats as possible Coteaz lists.

People might bash Ward for some of his background writing (though all the background stuff is pretty risible in my view) and he could take a little more care with the way he words things when it comes to special rules. But he's produced a crackerjack codex in terms of its sheer diversity of viable builds.

The Metal Tide wrote:Is there such a thing as a competitive Grey Knights list that doesnt involve Draigo and Paladins.

Um, yes. You can make shooty gunlines that make even IG armies jealous with Henchmen+Psyrifleman spam, you can make Purifier spam armies that can outfight anything point for point and keep on par or better in terms of shooting, etc.

Draigowing armies aren't that bad. It's the abuse of Psyrifle dreads, psybolts in general, and Henchmen.

Artemo wrote:
People might bash Ward for some of his background writing (though all the background stuff is pretty risible in my view) and he could take a little more care with the way he words things when it comes to special rules. But he's produced a crackerjack codex in terms of its sheer diversity of viable builds.

Probably not quite the greatest thing in the GK's case when most of it revolves aroundd spamming abusive mechanics like Cleansing Flame, 5pt Psybollt upgrades on BS4/5 nigh-unshakeable TLAC platforms, and the most min/maxable units (which can score) in the game.

Yeah, Draigo and Paladins are big expensive points sink. If you've got all your points on them, I can probably just drive around you for a chunk of the game. They can make a sort of effective army, but alone they're not terribly competitive. As said, Psyfleman dreads, psycannon razorbacks, and so on are what's scary.

How you play is entirely up to you.

You can, for example, buy a 25 point Inquisitor and then spend your points buying massed strike squads, interceptors, and purgation squads. That's not the best combination, but you'll have a huge number of troops shooting and enough melee to hold your own.

You can run terminator heavy lists (sub-optimal because terminators aren't as good as Paladin and point for point the Strike Squad is better, but you'll still have fun).

How you play them is up to you. Given that they're one of the strongest lists at this time playing a sub-optimal list won't handicap you that much.

I would claim that GK armies that don't waste points on Draigo and Paladins are possibly even more competative than those who do.

I think that to regard Draigo and Paladins as a waste of points is a rather narrow view. But I would agree that paladins don't tend to mix very well with power-armoured GK (for a number of reasons). On the whole I think Draigo does best with a list where the only troops are paladins. I'd agree that a Crowe/Purifier list may be more competitive than a Draigo/Paladin list as may (possibly) some Coteaz lists. But a decent Draigo/Paladin list is easily as competitive as any non Coteaz or Crowe build.

Draigowing is only crap when the GK is dumb enough to leave all their psyflemen at home... It's easily the best army in the game at kill points, as you typically need to cause 11 wounds to a 10-man squad before one of them drops. Any S8+ shots that might threaten a pally in draigo's unit will simply be allocated to draigo himself.
Support draigowing properly with the mandetory dreads who are so badly undercosted it's not even remotely funny, add a couple cheap support characters (xenos inquisitor or techmarines who also get those stupid grenades) and/or a libby. If pts allow, squeeze in a stormraven to give some much needed mobility to the army.

The only mission where draigowing really suffers at all is if there's 3+ objectives on the table. A good draigowing player plays the game like chess and seeks to dominate the center of the table. Once there, their reach extends to anywhere on the table and you'll have a helluva time trying to shift those squads.

Draigowing is by no means a gak list, you just see alot of dumb players using it because the inter-tubes told them too!

I never use draigo wing