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In the UK this Wednesday there is going to be a big strike over pensions. Both sides say the other is a lying gakker. Now I know it's a very radical idea, but what about putting the facts up somewhere so people can see them? This would mean we can then either agree that the government is a bunch of lying, thieving, swine's or that the unions are just power hungry, greedy, stubborn whiners. Job done.

Or perhaps the two groups are the same and don't want to be rumbled?

Well they'd see these facts, run with the ones that agree with them then call the rest lies. If anything it'd either be ignored or fan the flames more.

Bobbies carry pepperspray?

They do indeed carry pepper spray.

The better question would be how unlikely would the crowd be to not complain about it being excessive and requiring an investigation?

Think there be students involved?

Unions? Which unions? Pension unions? Who is actually striking here? Retired people?

Doesn't need to be students, just chavs. Though they'll likely express it as "that's fething bullgak" and set fire to something.

Wolfstan wrote:In the UK this Wednesday there is going to be a big strike over pensions. Both sides say the other is a lying gakker. Now I know it's a very radical idea, but what about putting the facts up somewhere so people can see them? This would mean we can then either agree that the government is a bunch of lying, thieving, swine's or that the unions are just power hungry, greedy, stubborn whiners. Job done.

Or perhaps the two groups are the same and don't want to be rumbled?

The fact are avalable. The problem is that there are fact and there are facts and it depends on how you spin them. The Unions say that they should get the pension they paid in to and should keep paying in to it, the govenment say that it is unsustanable. Some companys still have final salary pensions, others got rid of them saying they cannot afford them. Who is right? It is not a matter of cold hard yes or no fact's I'm afraid.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15925017

Think of this as a similar debate to Social Security. One side says "I paid for it I should get it" AND "the system is sustainable in the long term" the other side says "now, or in the near future the system will run out of money" replace our recognized American players with Brit agitators on both sides and your all set. Except that they are actually willing to talk about it.

Paul wrote:

Wolfstan wrote:In the UK this Wednesday there is going to be a big strike over pensions. Both sides say the other is a lying gakker. Now I know it's a very radical idea, but what about putting the facts up somewhere so people can see them? This would mean we can then either agree that the government is a bunch of lying, thieving, swine's or that the unions are just power hungry, greedy, stubborn whiners. Job done.

Or perhaps the two groups are the same and don't want to be rumbled?

The fact are avalable. The problem is that there are fact and there are facts and it depends on how you spin them. The Unions say that they should get the pension they paid in to and should keep paying in to it, the govenment say that it is unsustanable. Some companys still have final salary pensions, others got rid of them saying they cannot afford them. Who is right? It is not a matter of cold hard yes or no fact's I'm afraid.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15925017

That's good to know, but you still have the government saying that the pension makes them no worse off in the end and unions saying they will be. So it would be handy for the actual facts to be posted somewhere so that we can see if the facts are being "skewed".

If it turns out that people will have to work longer, but get around the same pension, then I would say that the government is doing the right thing. However if the facts show that they having to work longer, pay more and end up with a worse pension, then they have a right to feel wronged. Agreeing with that is down to your own personal beliefs.

Wolfstan wrote:

Paul wrote:

Wolfstan wrote:In the UK this Wednesday there is going to be a big strike over pensions. Both sides say the other is a lying gakker. Now I know it's a very radical idea, but what about putting the facts up somewhere so people can see them? This would mean we can then either agree that the government is a bunch of lying, thieving, swine's or that the unions are just power hungry, greedy, stubborn whiners. Job done.

Or perhaps the two groups are the same and don't want to be rumbled?

The fact are avalable. The problem is that there are fact and there are facts and it depends on how you spin them. The Unions say that they should get the pension they paid in to and should keep paying in to it, the govenment say that it is unsustanable. Some companys still have final salary pensions, others got rid of them saying they cannot afford them. Who is right? It is not a matter of cold hard yes or no fact's I'm afraid.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15925017

That's good to know, but you still have the government saying that the pension makes them no worse off in the end and unions saying they will be. So it would be handy for the actual facts to be posted somewhere so that we can see if the facts are being "skewed".

If it turns out that people will have to work longer, but get around the same pension, then I would say that the government is doing the right thing. However if the facts show that they having to work longer, pay more and end up with a worse pension, then they have a right to feel wronged. Agreeing with that is down to your own personal beliefs.

Its likely not just a question of facts, but of factors/assumptions used in forecast values. Even with the same set of initial information, factors used in analyzing future cash flows or NPVs are the big monkey in the room.