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Heya. I currently use a 1500 list that I've found quite effective. However, I have a 1750 tornement coming up and I'm wondering how to grow my list.

So, at 1500 pts:

Libby with Unleash Rage and Blood Lance and Jump Pack
Honour guard with 4 plasma guns and Jump Packs

Sanguinary Guard with banner, Infernus pistol and fist
2 Sanguinary Priests with JPs. 1 with a lightning claw

3 Assault Squads, 10 men, 2 meltas, 1 fist.


There are several options at 1750
Vanguard Vets
Missile Launcher Devs
Assault termies
Another Assault Squad
Other....

I've used VV before and found them lacking. Incredibly expensive for that DS + Assault. Can't fit 10 men in 250 points and I don't think it's worth dropping a priest to get them in. However, there are some situations where are they REALLY effective. Obliterators, Long Fangs, assaulting squads blown out of transports by DSing melta squads (however I feel this requires serious luck to pull out).

Missile launcher devs cover one weakness with this list. Lack of shooting firepower, specifically firepower that can crack transports and hurt MCs. DE are one army I can never catch with Doa and devs would let me bring down some of their transports. However... I've used them in a few games and found that that first turn sitting on the board on their own is just awful. Nearly every time I see the squad hit by all the shooting in the enemy army (obviously) and just get wiped off the board before they fire a shot. I could put a priest with them, but I don't know if it would help them much. Alternatively, I could fit 2 squads in? Dropping a lightning claw off my priest to have 8 MLs.

Assault termies. I have them in 2000 pts riding in a SR. They're great as they bring needed Inv saves to my list and hit hard. I can't fit an SR in 1750 which means they'd have to DS in (not ideal) and couldn't take a priest with them (no way to fit a termie armoured one in). However, even though they're slow and inaccurate they are a massive problem that the opponent would have to deal with.

I could take another Assault Squad, just for more bodies on the board. Not much hitting power but possibly 10 extra bodies would make a hell of a difference. It's more melta and more hitting power in general.


Anyway, please give me some ideas

Thankyou
Lunarman

This is my own personal opinion from playing DoA for the past year or so. Vanguard Veterans aren't worth it as you mentioned. I have yet to try devastators simply because I don't have enough, but that is what I would suggest you do. Try and put in 2 squads of Devastators or maybe even 3? I would drop the upgrade off of the Sanguinary Priest. Sanguinary Priest should never be in base to base contact with other models in assault since it means you lose FNP and Furious Charge.

Also why run Sanguinary Guard? I find them to be a waste for 200 points considering they have no invul and die to AP2 which is quite common nowadays. I would drop the Sanguinary Guard, add in more Devastators and possibly another Assault Squad if you can fit it in. Just letting you know..when you play DoA with Devastators you should avoid Deep Striking. It essentially goes from a DoA army to a Jump Pack army that uses high mobility to its advantage. Dark Eldar with Venom Spam might be an issue for you, but that's why good deployment is key to winning (just like with any other army).

Personally, no matter what opponent i'm facing, a set of assualt terminators ( 4 with strom sheilds and thunderhammers and the serg with lightning claws) always does well, the enemy will try to destroy them, but they can can basically go toe to toe with anyting and put up a good fight. I use them for walkers, scary hqs and monsotous creatures or anything that has power weapons (which always cut assualt squads to pieces). Basically you need something to take on the big guys, and i dont see anything at the moment... I am currently engaged in a campaign with a deamon player who loves krhone. He is always wiping out my assualt squads, with bloodletters. However, he always stumbles on my terminator assualt squads, and when i add a furioso dreadnought (which his bloodletters can't hurt) i mash them to pieces!

Basically, my rule is always have a terminator assualt squad handy!

Strange that you find Sang guard not particularly useful, I find they are a real game winner for me.

You see, Assault Squads form a good core, they're numerous and put out a lot of attacks. However, I find they really struggle with high armour save enemies, especially with FnP. Other BA, plague marines or Orc Nobs/ GK can just make too many saves for your large number of attacks to hurt much. So I use my Sang guard as anti MeQ and they're really good at it. 2+ with fnp is very hard to kill. Obviously plasma will kill them easily, but the whole army is vulnerable to ap2, not an inv save in the lot. I run with a Banner and a fist. That's 16 master crafted power weapon attacks on the charge and 4 fist attacks. Not much survives that. Really good for taking those tougher troops in one turn. And with the shear number of attacks, they are good at horde too.

Hmmm, so with devs you think you shouldn't DS ever? I'm not sure I want to lose that flexability... I DS in about half my games, obviously some targets it's a bad idea against but for other juicy meched up armies the advantages of denying their gunline are just too great. I will consider it and probably try 2 squads as I can fit them in without changing it up too much.

I see what you are saying with the Sanguinary Guard, but it seems like too many points to be able to do that. They aren't very good at killing vehicles at all. The problem with Deep Striking if you have Devastators is you leave them on the field for a full turn making them vulnerable to enemy fire while your assault squads stay in reserve. It essentially allows your opponent to take you down piecemeal which is really bad for you.

I agree that a castled up mech army is a juicy target to deep strike around, but they can still wreck you in the face with all of their firepower and if someone is playing a vehicle based army and castled up against you they are doing it wrong. XD

With a fist and an infernus pistol they're not bad against tanks. Sure, there are much better things but it does widen their role.


More on topic. Samuel, do you find the inaccuracy and unreliability of DSing termies to be a problem? And then they're pretty slow when they arrive. I love assault termies, I just don't know if they'll be any use when not assaulting out of a LR or SR.

that is a good point i generally have them in a storm raven, but i sometimes have them deep striking. You have to be careful where you put them, but they can easily withstand a turn of shooting. Also wouldn't a terminator assualt tank a unit of sanguinary guard.

Anyway just thinking, is a storm raven not equal to a devastator squad? 230 points = 6 bolt guns and assualt cannon and a multimelta ( all are twin linked) and blood strike missiles. Or is my love for stormravens clouding my judgement

I find it more interesting you do not like vanguard but do like the guard.
I like to have your honour guard just in case I want to avoid cc and I like vanguard or sometimes the guard to deal with cc where the assault squads will fail.

So vanguard would be my choice but the guard do their job for you.

So 10 man assault squad with flamers and powerweapon because infantry needs killing sometimes. Then add an extra priest for the spare points.

Another priest with a 10 man assault squad could be really good. It's just that many more bodies on the board.

Maybe my setup is just wrong with vanguard. They're 345 for a 10 man squad with JPs and 1 fist and 1 pw and MB. That's a lot. Would you suggest I only take 5 guys but kit them out a lot more?

So we still don't fancy a terminator assualt squad!

well, i guess they're not to everybodys taste.

But on a seroius note, ditch the vanguard, they cost nearly the same as 2 assualt sqauds, and are no were nearly as good. they are a waste of points.

Sure you don't fancy any stormravens, land speeders, or drop pod dreadnoughts-a blood talon furioso will mash nearly any infantry unit, even power fist and power klaws will find it hard to destroy it 13 front armour! And krak grenades can't hurt them! (if you havent already guessed i don't play entirely DOA, all my units can deepstrike though.