Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey folks,

Am struggling with a Codex Space Marine Trrop choice that is actually useful + worth the points... any suggestions??

Well, you have scouts or tactical marines, so a 50/50 choice anyways.

Since 5-man tac squads can't take any special/heavy weapons, they're most useful as 10-man squads. Most people run flamers or melta guns as the special weapon, and missile launchers or multi-meltas as the heavy weapons. Give them a rhino, and take two of those similarily equipped squads, maybe add a combi-weapon on the sarge that matches the special weapon and you're done.

Runs about 205-220pts depending on weapon choices.

But what if its a 500 point game?

Fido198674 wrote:But what if its a 500 point game?

Librarian - Combi-something/110pts
Tac Squad (5) - Combi-samething as above, Plazorback/175pts
Tac Sqaud (10) - Flamer, Missile Launcher, Combi-flamer, Rhino/215pts

Blacksails wrote:

Fido198674 wrote:But what if its a 500 point game?

Librarian - Combi-something/110pts
Tac Squad (5) - Combi-samething as above, Plazorback/175pts
Tac Sqaud (10) - Flamer, Missile Launcher, Combi-flamer, Rhino/215pts

Nice, I had something simlar but without the added armor of that razorback, thanks.

(Guess I should have started my own thread about this)

BennyB wrote:Hey folks,

Am struggling with a Codex Space Marine Trrop choice that is actually useful + worth the points... any suggestions??

Go with the 3rd option. Bikes.

It's a shame you can't get a similar synergy, as you do with bikes, but with assault marines!! (don't mention the Cheese Angel codex... )

Thanks Blacksails, this is what I had been pondering...

Sniper scouts just suck, can't kill much at all with them.

Normally play 1250 point games, so tactical squads at that kind of price are more than do-able ... i just think in the current rules than Tactical marines are over priced for what they can do.

That said, they are probably a better choice than scouts...

BennyB wrote: i just think in the current rules than Tactical marines are over priced for what they can do..

And that's why I reccomend bikes as troops. Look at it this way, you pay an extra 8 points per model, and this is what you get.

* TL bolter
* Relentless
* 2 Special weapons per squad, ie relentless PG or MG
* 12" move
* The ability to turbo-boost for 3++ cover and 24" move
* T4(5)
* MM heavy weapon that can move 12" and fire

And if the rumors of the BS vs. targets in 6th edition are true, the bikes will be even more powerful.
Ill be honest, since the DE and GK codexes were released, bikes have been a less competitve army, but that can be said of the C:SM codex as a whole.

You know, I completely forgot about bikes as a troop choice.

Definitely more of a finesse army, but very workable and there are a number of solid builds.

Good question.
I would go for all the same with maybe a single scout squad for flavour.
rhino melta, combimelta, ML or razorback melta, ML
Else go for bikes.

Though it depends on the list, I am more than willing to have squad having powerfists or use a drop pod if fits the list.

I can accept Pedro purely as that tactical squads are hardly your first choice.

all bikes look fun. I used to have a ton and got rid of them because they didn't fit the aesthetic i was going for at the time.

Rule of thumb regardless of income- NEVER SELL MINIS, you will always regret it!

One of my personal favorite tactical squad configurations -

Sergeant with combi-weapon (same as squad)
squad special weapon
lascannon
in a razorback.

Costs ~245 points or so for the squad, but gives you a lascannon that can fire at range, a razorback with heavy bolters, and 2 special weapon shots at short range.

Horst wrote:One of my personal favorite tactical squad configurations -

Sergeant with combi-weapon (same as squad)
squad special weapon
lascannon
in a razorback.

Costs ~245 points or so for the squad, but gives you a lascannon that can fire at range, a razorback with heavy bolters, and 2 special weapon shots at short range.

This is the standard bike squad for 245 points. This is my standard loadout that I bring, and I have found great effect with it.

Sergeant with PF
2 PG
1 MM attack bike
2 Normal Bikes

This gives you the following
* 6 models, with 7 wounds total at T5(4). The first wound you should take will be on the attack bike (unless its a STR 8 hit), so you have one ablative wound before you lose effect
* When shooting at targets within 12", you have 5 shots total that are AP2 or better. I use 2 such squads to shoot at one target, which wipes most MEQ from the board.
* You have the speed to engage non-MEQ quickly. Take for example a guard player, you can engage his blob with every bike you own quickly. HIs STR 3 weapons wound you on a 6.
* Each squad has 1 MM in it. This means every squad has the chance to destroy AV 14.
* Each squad has 4 STR 7 shots in addition to the MM. This rips apart AV 10 (like the side of chimeras) and can do good damage on AV 11.
* As an added bonus each squad also has 4 TL bolters, or 8 bolter dice.

There are a few other things to keep in mind too, if you want to run a bike army.
* Bikes need support. While throwing down 35 bikes at 1750 points sounds good, an ork wagon list will rip it up. You need riflemen dreads, typhoons, and predators to make it work. Ive even found an empty land raider redeemer being worthwhile as its mobile cover and gives excellent flamer templates
.
* Bikes are a finesse army, and in many games I just zip around and turbo-boost for 3 turns. The 3+ cover saves makes them durable enough to resist fire. In one game, I zipping along the board edges while an IG player fired battle cannon after battle cannon shot at me until turn 5. He kept deviating off the board. On turn 5 I just turbo-boosted to objectives and won the game.

* Playing bikes gives you a lot of control over the game. You can choose where the batltes take place. For example, at 'ard boyz a C:SM player used teleporter homers to teleport his librarian and TH/SS terminator squad right in front of my bikes. He flamed me with the psychic power, which killed 2 bikes and did a wound to the attack bike. I then scooted 12" back and started the null-zone plamsa/MM reign of death on the squad. Thats control over the game which many other armies can't do.

* You have a ton of firepower in short range. Working with Null Zone, you can take down nearly anything. 10 TH/SS termies? Not a problem. They will fail 55% of their saves, and you can throw 19 wounds on them with 3 squads + support. Ive used that combo to tear apart twolf calv. Most players don't expect that kind of firepower from bikes, and its a nice edge.

* You will have a hard time vs some GK armies. One guy at my FLGS brings psybolt ammo on his storm bolters. The amount of STR 5 shots he can pour out is enough to nearly kill a bike squad a turn. Thats hard to face, especially as I need to get within 12" to be effective. Lots of psydreads will cause problems as they can deliver enough STR 8 hits to widdle down your squads.

Thanks folks, you've given me some intesting things to think about ... I have previously considered doing a small White Scars force, which would fit nicely with the bike troop option

White scars are a good theme, but Kahn is not that great until you get to about 2500 points.

The reason is that you can get a better character with a captain and relic blade. Combat tactics is also highly useful to bikes armies as well -- more useful than it is to regular marines.

Tactical squads all the way for me over the years i`ve never had any real joy with scouts.

My ultras have four of them and there great, a little jack of all trades master of none though, i must admit. Except for close range hot bolter death that is.

I`ve never had much luck with scout as i said but some do and heres an example. In my last game with my nids i had 2 10 man stealer squads 1 with BL on one flank manged to get a charge in on turn1 on a whirlwind as well. The scouts countered and not only did they survive but they won and broke both squads. Oh well.

I'm going to support scouts. 100 point investment gives you a 5 scouts with sniper rifles, camo cloaks and a missile launcher.
Sit that on an objective and go to ground the whole game or if your opponent chooses to ignore it, take pot shots at monsterous creatures and av 10-11.
The scouts will likely not do anything, but it takes alot of fire to dislodge them; 3+ cover save (2+ gone to ground) with a 4+ armor.
Yes they'll break to assault, yes they can be denied cover saves, yes they don't do much, but the point is they are 100 points and will either be a small investment towards holding an objective if ignored or draw enemies away from your marines.
not competive of course, but i find it quite effective...