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Quick question... With the monofilament web Night spinner special rule, Does the squad hit have to take BOTH difficult and dangerous terrain tests? If so what order?

Yes.

THe only time the order would matter would be when moving into assault; do the difficult terrain test first, as if they dont roll high enough to make it in then they dont move at all ,meaning no dangerous terrain tests

Order always matters; and it is Difficult test first.

You roll the Difficult test before you actually move in all cases; you only roll the Dangerous terrain test when you are actually entering, exiting, or moving through.

So in the movement phase you can roll for difficult, then not move at all(because you do not like the results, or for whatever reason); then never even have to roll the dangerous(again since you have not moved at all).

Also if you plan to enter dangerous-difficult terrain from Clear terrain, and you do not roll high enough to actually enter the dangerous terrain, you do not have to roll for the dangerous terrain(you have not met the requirements to do so).

You can kinda mitigate this by moving just one model, instead of all models in the unit.

That way, you'd only test for dangerous terrain once.

But, this tactic still sucks since the squad "stays" put... which is usually just fine with the eldar opponent.

Kommissar Kel wrote:Order always matters; and it is Difficult test first.

You roll the Difficult test before you actually move in all cases; you only roll the Dangerous terrain test when you are actually entering, exiting, or moving through.

So in the movement phase you can roll for difficult, then not move at all(because you do not like the results, or for whatever reason); then never even have to roll the dangerous(again since you have not moved at all).

Also if you plan to enter dangerous-difficult terrain from Clear terrain, and you do not roll high enough to actually enter the dangerous terrain, you do not have to roll for the dangerous terrain(you have not met the requirements to do so).

This is actually not valid. Monofilament would still be on the unit because it never moved and the mark stays on the unit unit they move. If you want to remove the effect you have to move at least one model and take one test.

To answer the original question the sequence order is:

- Model gets hit in a unit the unit is tagged, regardless of wounding. Best to tag multiple units
- When that unit goes to move for whatever reason they roll difficult terrain
- Any model that moves takes a dangerous terrain test, PER MODEL not just rolling dice equivalent to the number that moved and plucking who they choose
- Once that movement is complete, remove the token. If the unit doesn't move it stays until they do

If the unit is assaulted their defenders react is considered a movement that doesn't take tests, therefor the token is cleared. Also be aware that if you ask your ork player to roll model by model on those 90 boyz that are tagged... you may get dreadsocked. Ask them to roll seperately the ones that really matter like the front runners and the PK Nob, then he can go ahead and roll the rest together.

Are Night Spinners accepted as regular units, or are they still on a "ask your TO" basis?

EVery tournament I've ever been to has accepted them as Codex units

Same here and I have fielded one in every tourney I have attended since they came out. Keep the PDF printout in your codex for reference beyond jsut Army Builder and if someone has an issue point them to the GW Fire Prism/Nightspinner page that has the PDF for download.

The unit has as much validity as the Sisters of Battle Codex.

puma713 wrote:Are Night Spinners accepted as regular units, or are they still on a "ask your TO" basis?

The WD article added them to the Eldar codex for all intents and purposes(as in, it explicitly stated that "The Nightspinner is a Heavy Support choice in an Eldar army")

BlueDagger wrote:

Kommissar Kel wrote:Order always matters; and it is Difficult test first.

You roll the Difficult test before you actually move in all cases; you only roll the Dangerous terrain test when you are actually entering, exiting, or moving through.

So in the movement phase you can roll for difficult, then not move at all(because you do not like the results, or for whatever reason); then never even have to roll the dangerous(again since you have not moved at all).

Also if you plan to enter dangerous-difficult terrain from Clear terrain, and you do not roll high enough to actually enter the dangerous terrain, you do not have to roll for the dangerous terrain(you have not met the requirements to do so).

This is actually not valid. Monofilament would still be on the unit because it never moved and the mark stays on the unit unit they move. If you want to remove the effect you have to move at least one model and take one test.

To answer the original question the sequence order is:

- Model gets hit in a unit the unit is tagged, regardless of wounding. Best to tag multiple units
- When that unit goes to move for whatever reason they roll difficult terrain
- Any model that moves takes a dangerous terrain test, PER MODEL not just rolling dice equivalent to the number that moved and plucking who they choose
- Once that movement is complete, remove the token. If the unit doesn't move it stays until they do

If the unit is assaulted their defenders react is considered a movement that doesn't take tests, therefor the token is cleared. Also be aware that if you ask your ork player to roll model by model on those 90 boyz that are tagged... you may get dreadsocked. Ask them to roll seperately the ones that really matter like the front runners and the PK Nob, then he can go ahead and roll the rest together.

You misconstrued what I was saying.

I was speaking only of Difficult and Dangerous Testing and the proof of which happens first and why it matters.

I had said nothing about rolling the Difficult, not moving so as to not have to test for dangerous, and then being out of the web; what I had said was the RAW on Difficult and Dangerous tests.

whembly wrote:You can kinda mitigate this by moving just one model, instead of all models in the unit.

That way, you'd only test for dangerous terrain once.

Based on the rules for "counts as moved" as it pertains to heavy weapons (if anyone in the squad moves, the whole squad counts as moving), I had assumed that if one model in a squad affected by Monofilament Web moves, everyone in the squad must make a dangerous terrain check. Therefore, you couldn't get around this by having just one model move (and having that model make the check). This would make sense for fluff reasons as well: you're still trapped in the web until you walk out of it.

Then again, the rules for dangerous terrain state that only the models moving through the terrain (not every model in the squad) must make dangerous terrain checks, which would support the trick of only moving one model in the squad. The Night Spinner rules themselves could go either way, although it does use the term "units" rather than "models".

Does everyone here play it "just move one model and only he has to take the dangerous terrain check, token removed", or does anyone play it "whole squad must make the check if any model moves"?

Only the models that move take the test. Since the wording of the Mono rules states that the unit counts in Diff and Dangerous terrain the next time it moves, then if only one guy in the unit moves he is the only one "moving" though the terrain and takes a test. Fluff wise the others guys would count as still being covered however the token goes away at that point and the unit is no longer counted as being in.

If you were playing fluffwise for monofiliment then cover would never be granted since it's slice right through it.It also wouldn't just be slicing through your armor at a mere 17% of the time.