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I need help on getting a list ready for a 2000 point GT early next year and as always....comments and critisizm welcome

HQ
CCS w/4 plasma guns in a chimera w/HHF-165

Elites
10x Psyker Battle Squad in a chimera w/HHF-165

Troops
Veteran Squad w/3x melta guns in a chimera w/HHF-155
Veteran Squad w/3x melta guns in a chimera w/HHF-155
Veteran Squad w/3x melta guns in a chimera w/HHF-155
Veteran Squad w/3x plasma guns in a chimera w/HHF-170
Veteran Squad w/3x plasma guns in a chimera w/HHF-170

Fast Attack
Vendetta-130
Vendetta-130
HellHound or 3rd Vendetta-130 (I need help on this one....HellHound is mainly bought for those pesky scarabs...please comment)

Heavy Support
Manitcore-160
Manticore-160
2x Hydra-150

Booyah!!!

Looks good. Honestly, flip a coin with the Hellhound/Vendetta. Hellhounds are nice for exactly what it was designed to do; kill light infantry, in cover or out. Against Dark Eldar, you also ignore FnP, cover, and armour, for the most part. Either way, it certainly won't go to waste.

I also like Hellhounds anyways, so go for it.

Solid list.

Blacksails wrote:Looks good. Honestly, flip a coin with the Hellhound/Vendetta. Hellhounds are nice for exactly what it was designed to do; kill light infantry, in cover or out. Against Dark Eldar, you also ignore FnP, cover, and armour, for the most part. Either way, it certainly won't go to waste.

I also like Hellhounds anyways, so go for it.

Solid list.

thank you for your feedback...much appreaciated........................I think i will go with the hellhound as i already have 2 vendettas and 2 manitcores and 2 hydras for vehicle death

Only thing I might do would be to drop two of the veterans chimeras to put them in the valkyries to add a third hydra, but overall good list. That's a lot of armor.

other than the PBS, i'd say !
Not saying they're bad. just not my cup o tea.
i'd probably double the CCS.

I'd say Hellhound if you think you might face enough Necon players.
Can't go wrong with 3 Vendettas either.
let us know how it goes!

Gendokari, he needs as many Chimeras he can get. Seven is light as it is at 2k points when your list is chimera hoard.

I also have to agree with AlarmingRick about the CCS and PBS... I say either run two PBSs or run none. With just one, if they are worried about them, the PBS will go down quick. With two, one might get a shot off or do some damage... maybe. Really the same mentality with Demolishers and every thing else.... double it up.

I have concerns over the fact you have Manticores and nothing really to protect them, as well as the fact your Chimera's goals are to get in 6"-12" range and your have big scatterable artillery. In a objective game your pulling back a Chimera from the assault to boot, weaking your attacking force. As long as you have a plan to deal with the situation, it can work.

I am also really surprised you do not have an Officer of the Fleet. If you end up switching something up, you should consider one to throw in your CCS.

Good luck!

yes but empty Valkyries make elsyians cry.

I have never used mandicores, so I cant really say if they are worth the points. I prefer to feild battle cannons myself. I would also drop the psykers and give the vets Demolitions or grenadiers. Other than that It looks pretty solid.

This is a tough one. I will another +1 for getting a second CCS or a second PBS. However, I really do not see where you can pull the points from.

At the end of the day, a fair compromise I believe would be to get 2xPBS with 5-6 Psykers each in a Chimera, give your CCS in a Chimera Plasma, and a CCS in a Vedetta Melta.

First place I would drop the points from would be the Hell hound as sadly he is the only one that is not doubled up on.

This would give you redundancy in both the PBS and CCS slots at expense of your HH.

Either way, just food for thought.

Good Luck

Grix.

TheGrimReaper911 wrote:I need help on getting a list ready for a 2000 point GT early next year and as always....comments and critisizm welcome

HQ
CCS w/4 plasma guns in a chimera w/HHF-165

Elites
10x Psyker Battle Squad in a chimera w/HHF-165

Troops
Veteran Squad w/3x melta guns in a chimera w/HHF-155
Veteran Squad w/3x melta guns in a chimera w/HHF-155
Veteran Squad w/3x melta guns in a chimera w/HHF-155
Veteran Squad w/3x plasma guns in a chimera w/HHF-170
Veteran Squad w/3x plasma guns in a chimera w/HHF-170

Fast Attack
Vendetta-130
Vendetta-130
HellHound or 3rd Vendetta-130 (I need help on this one....HellHound is mainly bought for those pesky scarabs...please comment)

Heavy Support
Manitcore-160
Manticore-160
2x Hydra-150

Booyah!!!

Alright, so you have:
9 melta guns
10 Plasma guns
6 TL Las that can shoot two targets a turn
2 D3 Big blast
8 Auto cannon shots that target one per turn
21 S6 Multi laser shots that can target 7 targets a turn
And flame templates.

What is your solution for mech guard? All those S6 and S7 aint gonna do much. So that leaves 7 units that can reliable damage to the enemy and only 4 that can do it at range and 2 of those can scatter. Also, your strongest armor value is 12. A good guard list has something that you want to draw fire. In this case I guess you would use your vendetta's but that takes away half your long range firepower. I would recommend dropping one of the manticore since they scatter a lot and possibly putting in something that can help against Horde elite infantry such as paladins, deathwing, and wolves.

Tomb King wrote:
Alright, so you have:
9 melta guns
10 Plasma guns
6 TL Las that can shoot two targets a turn
2 D3 Big blast
8 Auto cannon shots that target one per turn
21 S6 Multi laser shots that can target 7 targets a turn
And flame templates.

What is your solution for mech guard? All those S6 and S7 aint gonna do much. So that leaves 7 units that can reliable damage to the enemy and only 4 that can do it at range and 2 of those can scatter. Also, your strongest armor value is 12. A good guard list has something that you want to draw fire. In this case I guess you would use your vendetta's but that takes away half your long range firepower. I would recommend dropping one of the manticore since they scatter a lot and possibly putting in something that can help against Horde elite infantry such as paladins, deathwing, and wolves.

I don't think you quite understand how mech guard works. The original list is one of the better lists you can field at 2000pts from any codex. Mech guard on mech guard will have the same problems against eachother, and Manticores are still solid anti-tank weapons, being barrage (side armour) ordnance (best of 2D6) S10 multiple large blasts. Honestly, the amount of anti-tank is not a worry in this list, as most guard players aren't afraid of driving a melta squad up, hopping out, and removing something from the table.

As for elite armies, the amount of high strength, low AP weapons will ensure a good mech guard list will have no problems against them. Draigowing is not that scary considering those lists will often have five units (three psyflemen, two blocks of paladins), meaning the most targets they can even shoot at is five. The Manticores will scatter as much as any other blast weapon.

Finally, a good guard list does not have a single unit to draw fire. A good guard list present a myriad of equally important threats behind a wall of AV12 (which isn't easy to deal with en masse). Redundancy is key in guard lists, deathstars or uber units are not what mech guard lists need.

Honestly, the list, as it stands, will stand equally against the hardest lists that BA, SW, GK and DE can put out. The rest boils down to player skill. This list has all the anti-tank you need, at long and short range. The anti-horde/infantry is taken care of with mass vehicles heavy flamers, manticores, and multi-lasers if the enemy has been de-meched.

Blacksails wrote:

Tomb King wrote:
Alright, so you have:
9 melta guns
10 Plasma guns
6 TL Las that can shoot two targets a turn
2 D3 Big blast
8 Auto cannon shots that target one per turn
21 S6 Multi laser shots that can target 7 targets a turn
And flame templates.

What is your solution for mech guard? All those S6 and S7 aint gonna do much. So that leaves 7 units that can reliable damage to the enemy and only 4 that can do it at range and 2 of those can scatter. Also, your strongest armor value is 12. A good guard list has something that you want to draw fire. In this case I guess you would use your vendetta's but that takes away half your long range firepower. I would recommend dropping one of the manticore since they scatter a lot and possibly putting in something that can help against Horde elite infantry such as paladins, deathwing, and wolves.

I don't think you quite understand how mech guard works. The original list is one of the better lists you can field at 2000pts from any codex. Mech guard on mech guard will have the same problems against eachother, and Manticores are still solid anti-tank weapons, being barrage (side armour) ordnance (best of 2D6) S10 multiple large blasts. Honestly, the amount of anti-tank is not a worry in this list, as most guard players aren't afraid of driving a melta squad up, hopping out, and removing something from the table.

As for elite armies, the amount of high strength, low AP weapons will ensure a good mech guard list will have no problems against them. Draigowing is not that scary considering those lists will often have five units (three psyflemen, two blocks of paladins), meaning the most targets they can even shoot at is five. The Manticores will scatter as much as any other blast weapon.

Finally, a good guard list does not have a single unit to draw fire. A good guard list present a myriad of equally important threats behind a wall of AV12 (which isn't easy to deal with en masse). Redundancy is key in guard lists, deathstars or uber units are not what mech guard lists need.

Honestly, the list, as it stands, will stand equally against the hardest lists that BA, SW, GK and DE can put out. The rest boils down to player skill. This list has all the anti-tank you need, at long and short range. The anti-horde/infantry is taken care of with mass vehicles heavy flamers, manticores, and multi-lasers if the enemy has been de-meched.

I guess it also comes down to what a player plans on doing with each unit he has. With 5 troop choices that are also suppose to be sacrificial which is what they would be if you moved them up and jumped out to take something off the board. I would worry about objective based games. For a GT they can have up to 5 or even 6 objectives. I was just pointing out the list last of long range firepower. After turn 4 he better hope all the high armor units are taken care of because he will be out of missles and his vendetta's will most likely be dead. That leaves just his melta guns to deal with high armor.

I think that the list has plenty of ranged firepower. I'm curious as to what you would run or change in the list. Because honestly, short of a minor tweak here of there, the list is about as good as guard gets.

*Edit* The vets squads are not sacrificial, but as a guard player, you shouldn't be afraid to throw one or two at a particularly dangerous unit to ensure it dies in a blaze of holy melta. That's why I prefer melta CCS, because I'm not losing a scoring unit when it dies a horrible death.

Blacksails wrote:I think that the list has plenty of ranged firepower. I'm curious as to what you would run or change in the list. Because honestly, short of a minor tweak here of there, the list is about as good as guard gets.

*Edit* The vets squads are not sacrificial, but as a guard player, you shouldn't be afraid to throw one or two at a particularly dangerous unit to ensure it dies in a blaze of holy melta. That's why I prefer melta CCS, because I'm not losing a scoring unit when it dies a horrible death.

In my ard boyz list that I won the semi's with I ran dual CCS with melta. They were exactly that. I could sacrifice them without losing a scoring unit and they could give themselves orders to boot.

Tomb King wrote:

Blacksails wrote:I think that the list has plenty of ranged firepower. I'm curious as to what you would run or change in the list. Because honestly, short of a minor tweak here of there, the list is about as good as guard gets.

*Edit* The vets squads are not sacrificial, but as a guard player, you shouldn't be afraid to throw one or two at a particularly dangerous unit to ensure it dies in a blaze of holy melta. That's why I prefer melta CCS, because I'm not losing a scoring unit when it dies a horrible death.

In my ard boyz list that I won the semi's with I ran dual CCS with melta. They were exactly that. I could sacrifice them without losing a scoring unit and they could give themselves orders to boot.

Amen.