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Hi all, so I had a game today against someone outside of my normal circle, the second time that's happened this week, and I realised wound allocation aint all that. I play Orks and run 2 squads of nobs built like this;

Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Waaagh Banner!
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Bosspole, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Painboy w/ Cybork Body, Stikkbombz

I know wound allocation helps but I don't find that it makes a difference, am I missing something? Or are pople not causing enough wounds to my squad?

People are probabbly just not causing enough wounds. Wound allocation is very helpful against things like the LRP where it can throw out 20+ shots a turn and force alot of saves, some of which will inevitably fail

Ed Orange wrote:Hi all, so I had a game today against someone outside of my normal circle, the second time that's happened this week, and I realised wound allocation aint all that. I play Orks and run 2 squads of nobs built like this;

Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Waaagh Banner!
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Bosspole, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Painboy w/ Cybork Body, Stikkbombz

I know wound allocation helps but I don't find that it makes a difference, am I missing something? Or are pople not causing enough wounds to my squad?

They probably aren't causing enough wounds to your squads or are hitting you with lots of S8+ weapons where it doesn't make a difference. However, you also aren't fully exploiting wound allocation shennanigans either as you have many similar models. But, given your setup, if the entire unit were identical, a squad of 10 marines rapid firing would likely kill a nob off, by allocating the wounds across the various groups, you can effectively prevent any casualties by assigning only one wound to each model type in the unit as you have it set up as they likely will get 6 wounds on average that you can allocate.

Alternatively, if they hit your squad with a ton of bolter shots and a handful of melta shots (say a CSM termi with with combiweapons or something), you can stack all the meltashots on the models of least value and spread the bolter wounds over the entire unit (including some of the ones that took melta shots making them irrelevant) and greatly reduce casualties.

Ed Orange wrote:Hi all, so I had a game today against someone outside of my normal circle, the second time that's happened this week, and I realised wound allocation aint all that. I play Orks and run 2 squads of nobs built like this;

Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Waaagh Banner!
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Bosspole, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Painboy w/ Cybork Body, Stikkbombz

I know wound allocation helps but I don't find that it makes a difference, am I missing something? Or are pople not causing enough wounds to my squad?

You're not fully maximising the potential here as to properly play the horrible shinanigans, your squad should look like;
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Waaagh Banner!
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Bosspole, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa, Combi-rokkit
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Big Choppa, Twin-linked Shoota
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw, Combi-rokkit
Nob w/ 'Eavy Armour, Cybork Body, Stikkbombz, Power Klaw, Twin-linked Shoota
Painboy w/ Cybork Body, Stikkbombz

NOW you're playing the wound allocation game!
Basically now your oppent is either forced to hit you with only S8+ in order to inflict instant death on models, or else they have to cause 11 wounds before you lose 1 model. Putting them on bikes makes them that much nastier, though the pts can become prohibitive depending on your army list limits.


While orks are pretty good at playing the 'wound allocation game', by far it is the GK paladins who've taken it to the upper most levels of border-line broken'ness since they force you to start using S8 ap1/2 which is alot harder to come by in meaningfull quantities for alot of armies...

Hi I understand it now thanks guys. I can't put more points into the squad though, 485 is big in a 2k list, I'll upgread them in the bigger games though

wound allocation is something that works great but you have to understand its limits.

if you can stall the deaths of your models for a while but lets just say a unit of 5 thunder wolves. each has a wound on them. the soaked up an entire round of heavy shooting. they survived it because of the allocation but now that ENTIRE unit just lost a lot of durability. not only will they lose combat faster but the whole unit is now weak to getting completely wiped out.

I have seen a few people use wound allocation and expect the unit to become 100 times more durable. its just a way of trying to control who dies first. and can offer a short delay to having a whole unit getting killed. but it does not turn a squad into an unstoppable mob of death as some believe haha

Eh, I mean, it's okay, you can absorb a few more hits...but do you really want to be that guy?

IMO, it's not a case of being that guy. Wound allocation is a feature of 5th. It's just how the rules go.

And anyway, we all know Nobs aren't the WA kings any more, that goes to Paladins with apothecary

RxGhost wrote:Eh, I mean, it's okay, you can absorb a few more hits...but do you really want to be that guy?

You mean the guy who puts 10 different Nob Bikerz on the table, or the guy who puts 10different Paladins across from him? Are you talking about guys playing 'friendly' games, or guys playing the game to win? Are you talking about guys playing in 'Ard Boyz where a 2500 point army (I can't imagine the cost) is the prize? Are you talking about guys trying learn what they can do to be better, or what other Army tactics are competitive? This is a competitive game. The OP has a question about wound allocation. These are the tools we've been given. Do you want him to be a good sport and lose all the time without trying to challenge his opponents?

Yeah I'm just doing friendlies at the moment so I'm not trying to abuse it. I don't think I ever will to be honest. I was just interested to know.

They're probably not causing enough wounds. Wound allocation is crazy amazing. I'm stunned every time by just how much firepower Paladins withstand before their effective firepower even begins to dip.

daedalus wrote:They're probably not causing enough wounds. Wound allocation is crazy amazing. I'm stunned every time by just how much firepower Paladins withstand before their effective firepower even begins to dip.

Paladins break the system most of all though because;
a) They're 2 wound terminators! Best possible save in the game, plus a built-in invuln wereas IIRC, the other WA squads have ot pay for that priviliage.
b) They get abusive upgrades like multiple S7/rending guns combined with relentless, (they get double the numbers what regular termies get), and a 'super mark of slaanesh' combat option. As well they get easy access to the magical S8 for heavy hitting.
c) A cheap IC in the form of the techmarine who breaks the assault phase as he brings the 'derp grenades' to an already powerful unit. (even other deathstars will fear for their lives!)
d) A +1S psychic power that gets added before you multiply for daemon hammers! (because following the rules the everyone else isn't good enough for pallys!)
e) They pretty much auto-win kill points games! (hard to lose when the only viable way is for your opponent to outright table you!)
f) Access to FnP just because... However, considering they're far more likely to soak-up vast amounts of ap1/2 shooting, it's a very expensive option for less return that those nob bikers typically get out of it!

Thunder wolf cav & nob bikers required tactics to beat and while annoying, anyone could deal with them.
Pallys are plain silly and I have yet to enjoy facing that army when it plays the all-out wound allocation game... Typically I might be lucky to kill 25% of them simply because the grenades can make any assault an auto-lose, and I don't have easy access to large amounts of S8+ ap1/2 shooting.

Experiment 626 wrote:Pallys are plain silly and I have yet to enjoy facing that army when it plays the all-out wound allocation game... Typically I might be lucky to kill 25% of them simply because the grenades can make any assault an auto-lose, and I don't have easy access to large amounts of S8+ ap1/2 shooting.

Palladins vs. Necrons:

My 6x Deathmarks + 2x Harbinger of Despairs VoD in range of the Pallys. My second unit of the same composition does the same. They open fire, both using Hunters From Hyperspace. 4x Str 8 AP 1 templates and 20x RF shots that all hit & wound on 2+. It was beautiful.

I just wanted to share that with you. Hope it made you smile.

Experiment 626 wrote:
Paladins break the system most of all though because;
a) They're 2 wound terminators! Best possible save in the game, plus a built-in invuln wereas IIRC, the other WA squads have ot pay for that priviliage.

Eh, I don't know. 30 points is still amazing for a Nob. I'd be willing to maybe agree that they're starting to show age, however, I can't say that optionally paying for an invul save is really a BAD thing. I mean, the Paladins don't just get it for free. They just can't not buy it. There's a difference.

b) They get abusive upgrades like multiple S7/rending guns combined with relentless, (they get double the numbers what regular termies get), and a 'super mark of slaanesh' combat option. As well they get easy access to the magical S8 for heavy hitting.

RxGhost wrote:Eh, I mean, it's okay, you can absorb a few more hits...but do you really want to be that guy?

I have to say, of all the units that could have a fluffy justification for wound allocation shenanigans it would have to be the Nobz. What self respecting Nob would go to battle with the same kit as the guy next to him?

Fluff wise Gk are assigned their stuff thats unique to them. For example in one book a squad of 6 gk each had a varied load out. Alric had a halberd/sb, Dvorn has a NDD/sb, 2 others had psycanons and the last 2 had incinerators.

Well I sorta use the wound allocation game with Farsight and his bodyguard of free wargear and drones.

So far using them, they have yet to lose more than two suits from combat or shooting.

OP:
Of course wound allocation doesn't do much for you, simply because you are running much more nobz than you actually need. If you suffer six or seven wounds and two or three of your nobz get killed, you still have enough nobz left beat anything to a pulp. However, if you reduce your unit size to 7 and allocate wounds all over the place, your would be able to suffer the same amount of wounds without losing any offensive power but at about 100 points cheaper than the unit you are fielding.

That said, both 'eavy armor and stikkbombs are a waste of point of nobz. Give them a try without, you won't find yourself missing anything.

Wait just checking, so if i run 5 TWC one barebones, one melta bomb, one bolter, one storm shield and one thunder hammer, and i get 9 wounds (somehow) do i take the saves all at once and then any failed i just allocate about, or roll individually for eeach TWC model, and hope that they dont fail both saves?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

azazel the cat wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:Pallys are plain silly and I have yet to enjoy facing that army when it plays the all-out wound allocation game... Typically I might be lucky to kill 25% of them simply because the grenades can make any assault an auto-lose, and I don't have easy access to large amounts of S8+ ap1/2 shooting.

Palladins vs. Necrons:

My 6x Deathmarks + 2x Harbinger of Despairs VoD in range of the Pallys. My second unit of the same composition does the same. They open fire, both using Hunters From Hyperspace. 4x Str 8 AP 1 templates and 20x RF shots that all hit & wound on 2+. It was beautiful.

I just wanted to share that with you. Hope it made you smile.

Is that possible? it doesn't bring their leadership down... and as it is against their leadership i guess it would be 6s or 5s to wound (dont know their leadership value)

HfH doesn't lower toughness - it just makes that unit's rolls to wound a 2+, regardless of str vs toughness.

The Son Of Russ wrote:Wait just checking, so if i run 5 TWC one barebones, one melta bomb, one bolter, one storm shield and one thunder hammer, and i get 9 wounds (somehow) do i take the saves all at once and then any failed i just allocate about, or roll individually for eeach TWC model, and hope that they dont fail both saves?

You would dole the wounds out as evenly as possible (so 2 each on 4 of the guys, 1 wound on another guy) and then roll them individually. With this it's conceivable to fail 5 armor saves but still have everyone standing. It can make a unit far more durable for a turn.

Brother SRM wrote:

The Son Of Russ wrote:Wait just checking, so if i run 5 TWC one barebones, one melta bomb, one bolter, one storm shield and one thunder hammer, and i get 9 wounds (somehow) do i take the saves all at once and then any failed i just allocate about, or roll individually for eeach TWC model, and hope that they dont fail both saves?

You would dole the wounds out as evenly as possible (so 2 each on 4 of the guys, 1 wound on another guy) and then roll them individually. With this it's conceivable to fail 5 armor saves but still have everyone standing. It can make a unit far more durable for a turn.

K! TYVM for clearing this up for me
THANKYOU SPEHHS MEHREEN!