Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

This is an automated message added by the articles system.

A new article titled Civilian vehicles in 40k has been added to the dakka articles system.

This message thread is for the discussion of content in the article.

If you have anything to add to the article, then just jump in and edit it by going to the actual article page and clicking 'edit' (the link can be found just above the article). If there is no edit link then the article is locked for now, so just add your comments or content to this thread and if they are appropriate then they should eventually get merged in.

If there is something in the article that you wish to debate or comment on, then this is the place to do it. Just hit the reply button and get chatting! You need to be registered and logged in to post in the forums so if you are an anonymous article editor then now would be a great time to register and join in dakka's great forum discussion!

Great article, thanks for that!

Thanks! I'm about 10 pages in to my 90 page document with more images to post.

Very nice, looking forward to the rest.

Uploading all the images I yoinked is taking a bit of time but I'm getting there.

Good article enjoyed it a lot.

In Faith and fire there is a reasonable description of private higher vehicles, again this is a design limited to a specifc planet. The vehicles use a cogged track system, with only offical vehicles have tru freedom of movement.

thanks, I added that example to my section on cars.

Thanks for writing that article it had provided the info that I needed for writing some background fluff on my army.

Wow, just navigated here from the Background and this is an amazing article! Good Job!

-STS

I've always felt like that was something missing from most battlefields, and increasingly the fluff, evidence of real day to day life before the battle. Great stuff.

This articles hits me like a truck...
I never imagined that in a Universe where is only war people have time for civil life
But it make sense thou, Hive Cities and mining facilities and such.... pretty interesting

Wow, a sudden outbreak of discussion!

Thanks!

Sometime later this year, after I finish this course at school, I'll be doing some major revisions.

Some of the companies I recommended have closed, others have appeared and the whole thing needs some polishing.

As always PM me or post here if you have ideas.

I remember, that in one of the Last Chancers books there was mentioned a Limousine for the Commisariat But until your article, I was always thinking that there is no civil life in the Imperium, only one large bible of the Emperor, written by Euphrati Keeler, that everybody reads.

One of the explanations why we never see sign of urban life in WH40K, terrains might be that those ruins we play among are ruins from hive cities destroyed centuries ago, or even Pre-heresy ruins.

Oh yeah, if you liked this one, check out the sequel on Civilian life in general

http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Civilian%20Life%20in%20Warhammer%2040%2C000%20AD

That's one thing that always irritated me was the complete lack of any civil life (or even barracks life) mentioned in anything I've ever read (although I've not read a lot)

I mean, even space marines have down time as they are flying from system to system or after a battle, so what do they do to keep from getting absolutely bored to tears? I know there's training, but you can only do so much training before you start getting burnt out and need a break from the monotony.

Well, time to go look at some pics and read the article

Space Marines are as much a religious order as they are a military unit; what do monks do all day in a monastery?

There's a breakdown of a Marine's daily (non-combat) routine in the 3rd edition Codex: Space Marines, I think. Mostly training, maintenance, prayer, meditation/reflection, meals and 15 minutes of personal time a day.

All of which varies by Chapter, of course; Space Wolves seem to have plenty of time for drinkin' and fightin', and the Imperial Fists do a lot of whittling. The Blood Angels are big on artistic pursuits as well.

The Ciaphas Cain novels have quite a lot of detail on civilian life, since he spends so much of his time around them. Matthew Farrer's Enforcer trilogy is mostly about the particular Arbites precinct, but has some detail on what civilians might get up to that they shouldn't, and the characters in Ravenor spend a lot of time hiding out in various civilian populations.

kaotkbliss wrote:
That's one thing that always irritated me was the complete lack of any civil life (or even barracks life) mentioned in anything I've ever read (although I've not read a lot)

I mean, even space marines have down time as they are flying from system to system or after a battle, so what do they do to keep from getting absolutely bored to tears? I know there's training, but you can only do so much training before you start getting burnt out and need a break from the monotony.

Well, time to go look at some pics and read the article

Some IG books describe a lot the from the barrack life while they transit with ships into the warp. The Third Last Chancers books describes huge traning grounds in one of the ships where they trained for special mission. In one of the Gaunt Ghots novels (cant remember which one) they had special drills for landing - Elysian style As mentioned above me Caphias Cain book really give a light of the barrcks life, but i've read only the first one booke - the one with the Tau ambassadors.

@OP thanks for the link! It seems that evne a nobel lady hangs around with a bolt gun and a sword

Thanks for those bits. As I've stated, I've not read a whole lot, mostly just what's in the rulebooks. So there is definitely more to a space marine's life than fighting (even though it's mostly fighting)

It's hard to compare monks to soldiers as monks are typically non-violent so when they're not meditating, they are enjoying nature and being serene (they're not mediating and praying all waking hours)

Anyways, the whole point goes along with the idea of this article, knowing more about what's beyond the war we see on the table-top gives ideas of things to put on the table-top for that immersion that most tables are missing.

Also, I don't know if it was mentioned in the article (I got distracted by all the cool conversions and ideas that started hitting my head like a 100 story skyscraper) The space marine game actually had a train in it for carrying raw and finished materials that actually made up an entire level of the game. Would make an awesome center piece on a table.

Kid Kyoto, I have an alternate theorem for you.

How to depict civilian vehicles in 40K.

First there is no standardisation as civilian transport will differ from world to world. The laws regarding civilian vehicle usage will also vary. However we can also summise that some designs are passed down through the STC.
To the Imperium in most cases the vehicle is relatively unimportant, only the engine unit matters, because engines are of religious significance. Also who gets to use a transport and why is important but that is a social and legal issue. As for the vehicle itself it will likely be overengineered and built to last, but more importantly it may well have a separate engine.
For 40K going gothic is generally a reliable sign you are on track for depicting the background clearly. What is more gothic than the locomotive and the horse and carriage, thus my envisiojning of 40K vehicles is based on this.

40K locomotives.

Almost all mainstream civilian vehicles will be locomotive based, and engine pulling a separate carriage or multiple carriages. Normally this will be as a conventional train, trains for with the gothic theme easily and are logical for a centralized society with limited individual mobility. They are also big in the Victorian gothic era and thus good for 40K.

For individual transports the engine and carriage analogy stands. The engine would be about horse sized, sometimes larger sometimes smaller, very heavily built and running wither on a pair of tracks, quad tracks or multiple wheels, generally around six or eight. For a typical 'car' engine I envisage a block engine with a heavy metal case covered with the usual motifs with dials and purity seals which show its last tech service. These engines while poor, are still relics of the machine god and are loaned from the Adeptus Mechanicus and seldom if ever formally sold. The carriage it pulls is the property of the carriage operator, its loss is of relatively lesser consequence. It may resemble a stagecoach, made out of metal with four large tyred wheels, or something else. We will go with the stagecoach for now. The passengers/car owners ride within, the drivers, being a lower caste person rides on top exposed to the elements (or in a drivers cab similar to that on an excavator if the environment is not suitable). The drivers enjoys a good field of view but is personally vulnerable. High security vehicles would require a different design, something more akin to a civilianized Rhino.


The vision.

Imagine a western stagecoach.



Replace the horses with a single block engine running on quad tracks or bogey wheels. This is attached to the carriage by a limber, possibly two metal beams attached from the front of the carriage to the sides of the engine. The engine may have an exhaust, depdning on how it is powered. It will have admech skulls, various access panels, an exposed diagnostic panel with datascreens, and an armoured cable leading from the rear top to the drivers station where it plugs into a steering unit.

The carriage itself may be similarly proportioned to the carriage shown, but the wheels are large 'monster truck' tyresd wheels larger at the back than the front, and possibly out of proportion to the bogey wheels or tracks driving the engine unit. The framework would of course be well built and made of study metal, the cab would have three 'cloister' windows, the central one of which is also a side door. The interior is paneled and padded and relatively comfortable.
The driver sits exposed, he may well be wearing a protective environment suit of sorts. Next to him rides a carriage guard, armed with a shotgun and a laspistol.

Carriages of this sort would be owned and operated by minor nobles, clergy and gentry, and those skilled craftsmen with access to them. Higher orders have more effective transport, lower orders have no motorised transport at all, but may have access to animal pulled wagons. A motor carriage might have a top speed of 40-50mph, enough to allow localised mobility, not enough to have true range. The engine may only be serviced once every thirty years or so, but must be delivered for service at a specific depot and is registered to a local region. Long distance travel is thus restricted socially and through religious doctrine. The upper middle classes have their freedom to enjoy the privilege of using a motor carriage, but lack the freedom of a truly independent vehicle. Note that the upper orders are not intended to drive motor carriages by themselves, but to employ a driver to do so.

Hope this helps.

I came across this article a while back and found it pretty useful. I actually used it, so that I could build some of my own 40K civie vehicles. So far I have a pair of Long March-style trucks, one in Imperial Guard colours and one as a Cultist wagon, both of which were based on M923 cargo trucks, as well as an Arbites police car, based on a Russian Gaz SUV (a Russian equivalent of an armoured Humvee).
http://propertyoflamb.deviantart.com/art/Long-March-Trucks-603954425
http://propertyoflamb.deviantart.com/art/Adepta-Arbites-Police-Car-574009757
I'm also working on a SoB cargo truck, based on a Unimog and have a Wargames Exclusive attack limo

Awesome!

The article desperately needs an update but I'm glad to see it's still useful!

Some more resources from Punkapocalytic

http://www.badrollgames.com/tienda/index.php?route=product/category&path=61

Sorry for the low quality, but here are two pictures of civillian vehicles from the 40k universe. The first is a simple truck found in the inquisitor rulebooks, the other is a requisitioned civillian steam vehicle of some type from Inferno issues 13 (during the Nis-Pazar Campaign). Either way, steam and traditionally combustion vehicles are extremely common in the 40k universe and I think the engines themselves for most vehicles are fairly easily understood by common mechanics.

Thanks! i can try and hunt down better images. I think I remember that truck.

I like the use of Natural Materials in 40K - leather armor with lasguns, wood on Trucks myself....





Bolting armor plates over the windows A) makes them look more grimdark B) means you don't have to deal with the often out of scale interiors and C) look like they belong in a war zone.

Neglect not the wooden toys in the search for vehicles - note quite a detailed, but with Bits they work nicely, especially as backdrop or terrain.



Domes make everything look Sci-Fi...

Excerpt from Crossfire by Matthew Farrer (2003), chapter 3:

"The Aquila Gate stood at the head of the Telepine Way, the great traffic artery for the south-western slope of the Bosporian Hive. Its arch was so deep it was almost a tunnel, bright with sodium lamps the same colour as Hydraphur daylight. Layers of galleries and catwalks ran along each wall, crowded with pedestrians who jostled along shoulder to shoulder with worn carvings of parading Adeptus a thousand years dead. At ground level the road to Bosporian proper was combed into lanes, the outer ones thin and filled with bemos and mechshaws, the inner lanes holding giant freight-drays rumbling treads or wheels so fat they were almost cylinders. Arbites were eveywhere, blocking every pedestrian walkway and inspecting papers, rummaging through the mechshaw baggage racks, swarming over the drays like ants on a housebrick or prowling in squads the space beyond the gate where queues of vehicles backed up. Drivers hung out of their windows and shouted, or waved paperwork or identity seals, engines revved, Arbitrator boots tramped. The din was stupefying."

I love any fiction that has me reach for a dictionary.

Twice.

bemos-an Indonesian term for minibus.

Dray-a truck or cart without sides, for delivering beer barrels or other heavy loads

You'll be in the seventh heaven if you read Ian Watson's 40k works, then.

Farrer and Watson are at the absolute top of Warhammer/40k writers, period. Despite the latter's toilet humour.

Tribute to KidKyoto's marvellous civilian vehicle article. Click link for background writings:

Hit Them Twice

Addendum to the particular subject of Imperial traffic. Click link for background writings:

Traffic Tower