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Hi everyone,

my big plan for the next year is to start a new C:SM army. I played a mech army for the last two years, and now I want to try something different. I chose the Raven Guard as my new chapter. The one downside with this plan, you ask? I absolutely hate painting and using units with jumppacks. I know, that those are a signature unit of the Raven Guard, but since I dont care too much about fluff ... I dont really care. The reason why I chose Raven Guard, is that I always wanted to paint an almost black army that does not look like "im too lazy to paint stuff so i just stay with the black primer". SCC´s "Shadow Force Dragomir" (google that!!!) gave me the final push towards starting this army.

The basic goal of this, is to have at least four or five units that have the (theoretical) capability of an alpha-strike. By that, I mean posing an immediat threat near my opponents force during the first and second turn.

HQ
Captain 130
- Relic Blade

Command Squad 220
I need c&c on this unit
- Apothecary, Champion, Vet with TH, Vet with SS, Vet with Melta
- Drop Pod
(Not quite happy with that loadout since I dont have experience with podding units. More survivability [more SS] or more shooty action [more PG or MG] ?)

Troops
10-men Tactical Squad
- MM, Flamer, Sgt. with Combi-Flamer, Rhino 215

10-men Scout Squad 165
- 4x CCW/ BP, 4x Sniperrifle, ML, Sgt. with Combi-Melta and MB
(They will split up. The "sniper-half" camps on an objective [without killing much]; the other half rides in the LSS)

Elite
Dreadnought #1 150
- MM, HF, Drop Pod

Dreadnought #2 150
- TLAC or PC, Drop Pod (drops empty)

Fast Aussault
Trike Squad 100
- 2x MM

Land Speeder Storm 60
- HF

3-Men squad Scout Bikers 140
- 3x Astartes Grenadelauncher, LB, Sgt. with Combi-Melta and MB

Heavy Support
Dakka Pred 85

Dakka Pred 85

So, concerning the alpha strike units, I have the Command Squad, one Dreadnought, Scout Biker, LSS Scouts, and the Trike squad.
Or should I drop-pod both Dreads (in that case both with MM/HF) and the CS later?

The above list does not have a libby (so no psychic defense), which does bother me a bit. But I just could not find a way to find extra 100 points. I would like to field the Predators without sponsons jusyt because I like the look of it; that would free up 50 points. Maybe one of you finds a gap for the extra 50 points. If I expand this list to 1750, a libby is an obvious choice.

Cheers,
ChairmanMeow

Don't like your command squad. If you want to alpha strike with it, it's going to need to be shooty since you can't assault out of the pod. Meltas seem like the obvious choice, but it's not gonna be worth it to maybe kill one unit. I think you realize they're all going to die as soon as they land. Would you rather gamble the 350pts on maybe doing something useful or spend them on units you can support and count on?

Firstly, the rules of combat squading and reserves probably will not you allow to use the scouts as you wish. Anyone?

I think I would go for one more melta for your combat squad. They will either be shot or assaulted, due to FNP I feel assault is more common so I like the cc weapons.

I think with pods you need to be flexible. It is too easy to not deploy to cancel drop pod assault.

Hey drop the storm and try the BA codex

I think he can split off half the squad to ride a storm as long as both squads start on the board. He can't deploy one half and reserve the other in the storm. He can reserve both the full squad and the storm, but they can't combatsquad off the table so they'll have separate reserve rolls and the storm will be empty. It doesn't matter though he can just split the squads into two. I guess it's another 10pts for the extra sergeant?

Almarine wrote:I think he can split off half the squad to ride a storm as long as both squads start on the board. He can't deploy one half and reserve the other in the storm. He can reserve both the full squad and the storm, but they can't combat squad off the table so they'll have separate reserve rolls and the storm will be empty. It doesn't matter though he can just split the squads into two. I guess it's another 10pts for the extra sergeant?

How about infiltrate? You can infiltrate half and half, combat squading as they deploy. The first can get into sniping positions then the second can deploy besides the storm and then get in the storm on their scout move, then the storm can do his scout move.
So that would work though you have to be careful.

Can they really embark in the scout phase? And then have the vehicle move flat out? That doesn't even work in the regular movement phase.

But it's possible you can infiltrate the combat squads separately. They're not in reserve and we're still in deployment, it doesn't seem to me that's any different from deploying them in combat squads. But then the storm doesn't have infiltrate, does it? Hmmmm...

Thanks for the replies you guys!

Almarine wrote:Don't like your command squad. If you want to alpha strike with it, it's going to need to be shooty since you can't assault out of the pod. Meltas seem like the obvious choice, but it's not gonna be worth it to maybe kill one unit. I think you realize they're all going to die as soon as they land. Would you rather gamble the 350pts on maybe doing something useful or spend them on units you can support and count on?

You are right. No matter what way I look at it, drop-poding the Command Squad just wont work. As you said, even if I give them more meltaguns, they can only kill one tank just to die the next turn.

If I leave them out of this list for good and replace the Captain with a libby, that would give me 250 points to toy around with. In that case, I guess the Tactical Squad would get a Drop Pod so both Dreads can pod in on the first turn with MM/HF on each one.

I also have a squad of Vanguard Vets gathering dust on my shelf, they would fill out the 250 point gap and just might work with multiple locator beacons on the scouts bikers and drop pods. But my FA slots are already full...

I will keep thinking about this and report back as soon as possible,

CURRENT LIST

Here is my updated and reworked list:

HQ
Libby 100
- Nullzone, Avenger

ELITE
Dreadnought 150
- MM, HF, Drop Pod
Dreadnought 150
- MM, HF, Drop Pod

TROOPS
5-men Tactical Squad 175
- Combi-Flamer
- Razorback with LasPlas
5-men Tactical Squad 175
- Combi-Flamer
- Razorback with LasPlas
10-men Scout Squad 165
- 4x CCW/BP, 4x Sniper, HB, Sgt. with Combi-Melta and MB

FAST ATTACK
Land Speeder Storm 60
- HF
Trike Squad 100
- 2x MM
3-men Scout Biker Squad 120
- 3x Astartes Grenadelauncher, Sgt. with PW and MB

HEAVY SUPPORT
Dakka Pred 85
Dakka Pred 85
TFC with Drop Pod 135

1500

So my firebase would consist of two Preds, two RBs, one Sniper Squad and one TFC. While two Dreads and two "Melta-torpedos" (LSS and Scout Biker) perform an alpha-strike. Plus two MM-Trikes in melta-range at turn two.