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My GW store is running a 250pt LotR league over the next couple months. This'll mean tiny games with small warbads, which sounds like a lot of fun with a lot of tactical potential (I like games small enough that every model counts) but it'll also mean a lot of the builds and strategies useful in larger battles go out the window. My orcs tend to rely on shaman/captain synergy to make tough anvils with trolls as the heavy hitters, but at 250 there isn't going to be room for any of that.

I don't know exactly what I'll be up against - the two lists I've seen were a Moria list with a cave troll and goblin spam and a small Isengard force with Lurtz - so I'm going for an all-comers setup as much as possible, but the problem is my collection is hardly optimised for small games and I don't actually have a lot of the stuff i'd recommend people take in a game this small (like vanilla orcs or wargs)

There shouldn't be too much shooting or cavalry around, so an infantry list is probably fairly safe. Trying to cram a troll or named character in there seems counterproductive - with a low model count I'd be easy to run off the board.

A couple of things I want opinions on, then:

Is a shaman likely to be worth it at this level? Normally I'd never go anywhere without one, but if he's the only hero it dramatically reduces his effectiveness since he can't pull the auto-stand-fast trick with Fury. On the other hand, that Fury is going to encompass a reasonable percentage of my whole force, but is the save worth foregoing the hitting power of a captain? I'm leaning toward "no", but if there's an argument for the shaman I'd love to hear it.

Are uruk-hai going to bring enough benefit to such a small force to be woth the premium you pay to get them? Compared to a morannon orc an uruk is expensive and fragile, the only advantage is better fight value and courage. Fight value is generally thought of by a lot of people as one of the least important stats, and courage 3 still isn't very good, so I'm not sure they're worth shelling out for in a force this size, but again, someone might disagree.

Is it worth cramming in a banner? I can see it being useful, but I can't see many circumstances where I'd rather have it than the extra models those points could be used for in a game this size where model count will be a Big Deal. Again, thinking "no" but open to contrary opinions.

Finally, choice of list and captain: using the Barad-dûr list gives me a choice of vanilla or morannon orc captains, while the Black Gate ditches the vanilla captain altogether and offers the uruk captain instead; 5pts more than the morannon orc for +1 fight and courage. I'm leaning toward the morannon captain for theme reasons, but the extra courage on the uruk is tempting.

Any other thoughts or suggestions are welcome! I'll work up a couple of lists for feedback in a while, too.

I've always been a big fan of the Mouth of Sauron, he's a bit more expensive then an orc captain but he can use magic when he is in a pinch. His terrifying aura is great for stopping archers from sniping him.

Either that or go cheap, Two orc captain would only run you up 90 points when equipped with a shield. Morannon orcs are nice and they are good for backing them up.

I'd also consider throwing in a few wargs and giving one of your captains one as well to help you manoeuvre better.

Captain: Shield
Captain: Shield Warg
3 x Warg Rider w/ shields

Which would leave you about 150 points for orcs and stuff.

Or just grab a Troll Cheiften and base the rest of your army around him

I'd go for wargs if I had any (they'd be really useful in a game this small) but I don't, unfortunately.

Hadn't considered two vanilla orc captains, that's a good idea. More might points that way, at least.

Hadn't considered the troll chieftain, either, ruled him out as too expensive. He could work, but I'd be worried about my opponents simply ignoring him and breaking the force by killing the 110pts of other stuff.

I'd prob throw a decent chunk of Morannons in all with shields at 8pts per orc led by a captain - also with shield for 50pts you gotta S5 gribbly

Maybe a few bows but I dont really bother with them for Mordor too much, rather just have the numbers surging forward but defo take Warg riders - that way your army at least S4 and stilll cheaper than uruks

Maybe:
Morannon Orc Captain with shield - 50
10 Morannon Orcs with shields - 80
5 Warg Riders with Shields - 65

that then leaves you 55 points for maybe some archers (11 trackers maybe? - volley fire there as well then), or an Orc capt on Warg with shield its up to you really - its not massive but for 250 it should carve a path with its high strength across the board

thats my 2 cents anyways

or just for the lols - 2 trolls and a siege bow see how ya get on

I think you have to look at it by what your most likely to face.

Three kinds of armies,
Big hero Army (Aragorn or Boromir followed by elites)
Standard Foot Slogging army
Mobile Army.

Two orc captains would be fairly effective against the last two as they'd have the numbers and the arrows to bring down a normal good army. If the guy brings out anything more powerful the faramir then you'd be in trouble.

Do you know what kind of terrain you will be facing? If the field is fairly covered by trees and ruins i'd suggest foregoing all bow models entirely and just bunch up and run at the guy with morannon orcs and a troll. Wouldn't be very effective against a mounted army but thats the trade off

Cheers for the input folks

foofighter wrote:I'd prob throw a decent chunk of Morannons in all with shields

Yeah, this is definitely going to be the backbone of the force. I like your warg idea but as I say, alas, I have no wargs. In larger games my cavalry would be Morgul knights, but of course Morgul knights and Morannon orcs is a combo that requires a lot more points to play around with...

Sold on the MO captain I think - he's fluffy and that S5 will be useful.

TheGateway wrote:Do you know what kind of terrain you will be facing? If the field is fairly covered by trees and ruins i'd suggest foregoing all bow models entirely and just bunch up and run at the guy with morannon orcs and a troll. Wouldn't be very effective against a mounted army but thats the trade off

It'll vary by game but most of the time it should be exactly that - smallish boards with moderate to heavy terrain cover, ideal footslogger country.

You can cram a dozen Morannon orcs (Morcs?) into 100pts, so that plus the captain seems like a good starting point. For the remaining 100, that troll is awfully tempting (not a lot is going to stand up to a Mordor troll in 250, after all) but the other option would be doubling the number of Morcs - much harder force to break, and since they're all S4 it still has a reasonable amount of hitting power.

you might be able to still pull off a few morgul knights - you can get 5 for every troll and if you tree hug so archers can't shoot ya and other inf cant quite reach ya their terror and lances should prove quite deadly in a small game

if your gonna run all morcs then consider another hero lest your force be broken and alot of your guys find themselves outside stand fast range - could be costly