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Played my Kan Wall against some Hive Guard last night who did mean things to me. We played that the Boyz got no KFF cover save from the Impaler cannon. Was this the correct call? And if it was, I imagine it would negate the Exhaust Cloud from Warbikes? Just hoping against hope.

Based on the wording of the impaler cannon it seems only area cover applies. Others will probably disagree and can justify it.

Cover saves granted by wargear or special rules cannot be negated by the Impaler Cannon. The rules of the cannon are referring only to "cover you are in or touching". There will always be a debate as to what "in cover" means to one group or the other. Some take it to mean "[physical] cover you are in or touching" while others take it to mean the general term "cover".

The wargear or special rule is expressly granting the unit a cover save and does not rely on its placement in or around cover.

puma713 wrote:Cover saves granted by wargear or special rules cannot be negated by the Impaler Cannon. The rules of the cannon are referring only to "cover you are in or touching". There will always be a debate as to what "in cover" means to one group or the other. Some take it to mean "[physical] cover you are in or touching" while others take it to mean the general term "cover".

The wargear or special rule is expressly granting the unit a cover save and does not rely on its placement in or around cover.

I agree with Puma. Im not too familiar with either armies special rule applications, but I skimmed through both codexs at the relevant info and this seems to be the most reasonable response.

I agree, but whats the specific wording on this cannon

As I said, others will disagree who can justify it. I guess I'm a little partial to my 'nids.

The rule states: the target can only count the benefits of cover they are in or touching if it lies between them and the hive guard.

Since the KFF is not a benefit of cover they get a cover save from it.

(i.e. it does not affect cover saves but benefits from cover)

As above. KFF, SoS, et al, will all give a cover save that the Impaler Cannons do nothing against

sry for ninjaing this topic but how works the KFF against things like the manticore
do i get a coversave in that case, too ?

Emulgator wrote:sry for ninjaing this topic but how works the KFF against things like the manticore
do i get a coversave in that case, too ?

Yes. It has nothing to do with actual cover, but a piece of wargear.

So the Impaler rule says it 'negates the benefits of cover' rather than 'negates cover saves'. I would hate for this to become another semantics discussion, but what is the wording for the Manticore? What else would/could ignore/negate the cover save granted by the KFF, other than Template weapons?

Ghenghis Jon wrote:So the Impaler rule says it 'negates the benefits of cover' rather than 'negates cover saves'. I would hate for this to become another semantics discussion, but what is the wording for the Manticore? What else would/could ignore/negate the cover save granted by the KFF, other than Template weapons?

I can't think of anything except random rules like Fire Dragons' Crack Shot. The rules of the manticore are not 'manticore' rules per se, but barrage rules. It states that cover is taken as if the shot came from the center of the blast marker, not the vehicle itself. The KFF expressly grants a save to the unit - it doesn't care where a shot came from, or if you're even in cover. You simply have a cover save.

The only thing that can beat it are things that explicitly negate cover saves.

The KFF/exhaust cloud isn't cover that is in between the 'nid and the orks; they are simply rules that give the orks cover saves. They still get them from the impaler cannon.

-cgmckenzie

What about the rules from the IG collosus or the eradicator?

Riddick40k wrote:What about the rules from the IG collosus or the eradicator?

They specifically 'ignore cover saves'.

puma713 wrote:

Riddick40k wrote:What about the rules from the IG collosus or the eradicator?

They specifically 'ignore cover saves'.

This is exactly what I am asking about! Thanks!