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So updated list from the feedback, game plan is similar with a fire base of predators riflemen, predators and razorback. The addition of plasma cannons in the tactical squads brings the pain once I've popped transports and provides anti-elites/much needed ap2 firepower. The dakka pred and dual flamers in the tactical squads provide anti-infantry/burny goodness. The attack bikes are mobile tank hunters, and the terminators act as counter-assault or in your face threat (using GoI from the librarian). I will try swapping a rifleman for plasma cannon/heavy flamer loadout at some point for added counter-assault/anti-horde/anti-elite. Currently have 20 spare points, don't think its going to be game changing but currently undecided on what to buy, dual storm bolters for the rhinos, combi-weapon for the combat squat, etc, so again any suggestions would be very useful.
Thanks for your time.

HQ
Librarian (Force weapon & BP, powers; Gate of Infinity & Null Zone) 100pts

Elites
Hammernators (5) 200pts
Dreadnought (Rifleman) 125pts
Dreadnought (Rifleman) 125pts

Troops
Tactical Squad(10) (Sgt:Combi-flamer, Flamer, Plasma Cannon) 185pts
Rhino 35pts
Tactical Squad (10) (Sgt:Combi-flamer, Flamer, Plasma Cannon) 185pts
Rhino 35pts
Combat Squad Squad (5) 90pts
Razorback (Las/plas) 75pts

Fast Attack
Attack Bikes (3)(All Multi-Meltas) 150pts
Attack Bikes (2)(All Multi-Meltas) 100pts

Heavy Support
Predator (Autocannon & Lascannon sponsons) 120pts
Predator (Autocannon & Lascannon sponsons) 120pts
Predator (Autocannon & Heavy Bolter sponsons) 85pts

Total 1730pts

Its a good list, nice amount of anti-mech which should stand you in good stead. you have enough autocannons to put the crappers up DE players and they are pretty awesome at getting rid of most MEQ transports aswell.

Like you say though, not much in the way of threatening squads of marines, and especially FNP marines. I get the feeling that thats why you've stuck a plasma and combi-plasma in one of your tactical squads. I run a Vulkan SM army for tournies at 1750, and whilst it obviously plays differently to yours i've found that even a single plasma cannon for a tactical squad makes a massive difference against DC, PM, any 2+ save squads. So swap that expensive lascannon out and stick in a plasma cannon for 5 pts.

People tend to go nuts when i suggest this, but a Dreadnought with a plasma cannon and heavy flamer on its powerfist makes a great 'goalkeeper' unit to babysit your tactical squads, and would free up the Terminators to gate forward first turn instead of hanging back. Would also give you some ork squad killing ability, as you are currently a bit light in that department

Speaking of Vulkan, seeing as though there's quite a bit of melta and your hammers on the table, they'll benefit from his abilities. He's not all too essential though, but he's got that heavy flamer so there's some anti infantry for you.

Caranthir987 wrote:Its a good list, nice amount of anti-mech which should stand you in good stead. you have enough autocannons to put the crappers up DE players and they are pretty awesome at getting rid of most MEQ transports aswell.

Like you say though, not much in the way of threatening squads of marines, and especially FNP marines. I get the feeling that thats why you've stuck a plasma and combi-plasma in one of your tactical squads. I run a Vulkan SM army for tournies at 1750, and whilst it obviously plays differently to yours i've found that even a single plasma cannon for a tactical squad makes a massive difference against DC, PM, any 2+ save squads. So swap that expensive lascannon out and stick in a plasma cannon for 5 pts.

People tend to go nuts when i suggest this, but a Dreadnought with a plasma cannon and heavy flamer on its powerfist makes a great 'goalkeeper' unit to babysit your tactical squads, and would free up the Terminators to gate forward first turn instead of hanging back. Would also give you some ork squad killing ability, as you are currently a bit light in that department

Hmm, I'm definitely very intrigued by your suggestions (not least because they're slightly unorthodox), so I could switch both tactical squads to [Combi-flamer, flamer, plasma Cannon] change a rifleman to heavy flamer/Plasma Cannon, add the additional attack bike and have 20pts to play around with (predator storm bolter or dozer blades for the rhinos). That gives me plently of anti-horde and 3 plasma blasts for 2+/3+ armour (which will definitely be useful), the question then is am I sacrificing too much anti-tank :-P but I definitely like the idea (I love dreadnaughts, but recently they've only really seen action as riflemen).

If your worried about anti-tank then keep your meltasquad, but give your second tactical squad as the loadout you mentioned above. Very useful against marines or hordes. In the original list you have a very healthy amount of anti-tank, so with keeping a rifleman, 3 predators, 2 x2 MM attack bike squads and your melta tacticals, if you wanna squeeze in a PC dread, you'll still have more than enough for that points level

How are assault termies going to get into the action?
I think the points could be better spent elsewhere. You do not need a cc threat at this level of points.

I agree with the termies^

However, if you give them stormbolters + PF (aka normal termies), they can deep strike into the enemy lines and cause some problems. Powerfist on heavy infantry and tanks, and Stormbolters for when they land and cant do anything.

L_Dawg wrote:Speaking of Vulkan, seeing as though there's quite a bit of melta and your hammers on the table, they'll benefit from his abilities. He's not all too essential though, but he's got that heavy flamer so there's some anti infantry for you.

I like Vulkan but I don't think Im packing enough melta/flamers/THs to truly benefit from the buff (plus I'd have to ditch the librarian i.e. my psychic defense to afford him), though I could run the Attack Bikes as singles as they'd be pretty much guranteed to hit.

Caranthir987 wrote:If your worried about anti-tank then keep your meltasquad, but give your second tactical squad as the loadout you mentioned above. Very useful against marines or hordes. In the original list you have a very healthy amount of anti-tank, so with keeping a rifleman, 3 predators, 2 x2 MM attack bike squads and your melta tacticals, if you wanna squeeze in a PC dread, you'll still have more than enough for that points level

Think I'm definitely going to have to play test some variations (basically how many plasma cannons) but good advice :-D

MFletch wrote:How are assault termies going to get into the action?
I think the points could be better spent elsewhere. You do not need a cc threat at this level of points.

The terminators could deepstrike (the librarian would then go in the razorback), gate forward with the librarian simply hang around to provide cover or as counter assault unit. My previous list variation I used a pimped set of sternguard (HFs and combi-meltas) and I just found the list lacked any CC punch which was diasterous if I had a bad round of shooting or had a deathstar closing down upon me or even something better in CC than my marines (fnp marines, most grey knight units, termies, etc) this way I offer a deterent.

Zambro wrote:I agree with the termies^

However, if you give them stormbolters + PF (aka normal termies), they can deep strike into the enemy lines and cause some problems. Powerfist on heavy infantry and tanks, and Stormbolters for when they land and cant do anything.

I use to run tactical terminators with a cyclone missile launcher, basically they weren't durable enough and at the end of the day storm bolters aren't that scary 5+ inv isn't that great and any dedicated CC unit, or even an army with lots of ap2 shooting will decimate them (thinking IG), where as 3+ inv is very durable and fills a role I'm lacking in my army currently. Also I'd probably prefer to run when I deepstrike to get out of that nice template formation :-P