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I'm a Space Wolf player if it matters. I do have a vanilla codex laying about and a friend and I have been trying to come up with different/unusual ways to do Blood Angels and Space Marines. Now ideas can sound cool or be neat on paper but worthless in a game. I'm not going to be surprised if this is one of those that sucks in execution, but thought I'd toss it out and see what you all think.

I'm actually going to play test it a few times just for grins, both against hard tourney lists and friendly lists. If it doesn't tottally suck I may expand my collection into another space marine army since it will play differently than my Space Wolves. Anyways, here is the list:

So you are looking at 15 Missile Launchers, 10 Lascannons, 8 Meltaguns, 9 Special Ammunition Boltguns and an Orbital Bombardment. 101 Space Marines in Power Armor on the table. A potential 8 scoring units, 4 of which can happily run forward with the Chapter Master while everyone else hammers things away.

Downside number one is that they are all on foot. Maybe drop one of each squad and throw in some Transports but it takes away from some of the fun.
Downside number two is that most units are 5 man. Power Armor and Cover Saves should do a lot to keep them alive, but probably not enough I'm thinking.

Anyways the basic idea is to take as many heavy weapons as possible in as many different units as possible so they can't be silenced. I play a foot list with my Space Wolves so with this list I'm not totally against going mechanized/drop pod, but that does limit the heavy weapons slightly.

Maybe drop one of each squad to throw TL Lascannon Razorbacks in the mix? I don't know. What do you think can be done here for a shooty list?

Blood angels would be a better choice for this last actually.

Cheaper devs, and las/plas razors for troops are much cheaper. Also, you want a librarian for the hq, the orbital isn't worth it.

Could you elaborate on why the Orbital Bombardment isn't worth it? I figure with all the Heavy Weapons on Infantry as it is this is one of the few lists where it wouldn't be worthless. But then I could just be jealous of the Imperial Guard's artillery.

A single blast guaranteed to scatter isn't much use vs vehicles or small elite groups of infantry, and against hordes, they are usually in cover anyway.

Eh, its Barrage at least. That cuts out the vast majority of cover saves in this edition. And a S10 Ordnance Blast isn't terribad. It may scatter 2D6" and not do anything, but given how much is on the table at the point range I wouldn't count on it.

Personally I still like it better than the Librarian. Psychic Hoods are nice but aren't always necessary.

I don't know, I always love it when a foot SM list doesn't pack a Librarian against my CSM, lashing your troops into Zerker range is a beautiful feeling.

Other than that, BA would most likely run this list more efficently, but on the other hand it's brilliant to see somone use the Vanilla Dex differently to how the internet says you have to to win, I salute you sir!

Have you considered Vulkan?

It's a 40 point upgrade on your CM and you trade that Orbital bombardment for a Nifty relic blade, 2+3++ and re-rolls on your meltaguns.

Sorry, but he truly is an overpowered character for 190 points.

This list sounds like it would work great. If you combat squad your tactical squads then there would be more targets that the enemy would have to focus on. All your firepower can destroy anything. Space Marines are tough as it is anyway. I think you lost marines and added transports then the transports would be destroyed quickly. I like this list.

I personally like my sternguard squads to have bolters or combi-bolters if need be. you are paying for special ammo, why not take guns that can use them.

Might as well run Pedro and make your sternguard scoring.

I like the list. Could be fun

The list would be better as space wolves
Loganwing gives a similar list which easier to use due to being relentless where needed.

Scipio Africanus wrote:Have you considered Vulkan?

It's a 40 point upgrade on your CM and you trade that Orbital bombardment for a Nifty relic blade, 2+3++ and re-rolls on your meltaguns.

Sorry, but he truly is an overpowered character for 190 points.

That sounds dirty for sure. Making those shots Twin-Linked is interesting, but that'd be the only real benefit. Its a large benefit but not sure its worth the point increase. If i was taking Flamers and Thunder Hammers and Multi-Meltas it would be a no brainer.

Chaos Lord Gir wrote:I don't know, I always love it when a foot SM list doesn't pack a Librarian against my CSM, lashing your troops into Zerker range is a beautiful feeling.

Other than that, BA would most likely run this list more efficently, but on the other hand it's brilliant to see somone use the Vanilla Dex differently to how the internet says you have to to win, I salute you sir!

I keep hearing this. My friend runs Blood Angels so I'll have to double check that. The downside is if you end up getting Rage on your heavy weapon teams!

And at least the updated Chaos FAQ makes it so you have to roll to hit with Lash now

Go Big Green! wrote:This list sounds like it would work great. If you combat squad your tactical squads then there would be more targets that the enemy would have to focus on. All your firepower can destroy anything. Space Marines are tough as it is anyway. I think you lost marines and added transports then the transports would be destroyed quickly. I like this list.

That's kind of what I was thinking, just overwhelm the enemy with models and units and bring enough firepower to destroy any Armor on the table.

Cozzy215 wrote:I personally like my sternguard squads to have bolters or combi-bolters if need be. you are paying for special ammo, why not take guns that can use them.

3/5 in each squad still have Bolters. But Sternguard can take two Heavy Weapons for a reason. The goal of the list was to bring as many of those as possible. Honestly I wish there were more points for more Sternguard, but I didn't want to trade off long term survivability of my scoring units for their ability.

Inquisitor_Dunn wrote:Might as well run Pedro and make your sternguard scoring.

Interesting idea. Looking at his special rules, he's a perfect fit for the list. The only question is what do I take out to get the 20 points necessary to upgrade the Chapter Master to Pedro?

Zambro wrote:I like the list. Could be fun

MFletch wrote:The list would be better as space wolves
Loganwing gives a similar list which easier to use due to being relentless where needed.

Lack of Combat Squads and less Lascannons and less Melta shots. 1775 points would get me a lot of Missile Launcher shots in Loganwing (31 to be exact) but zero Meltashots, no artillery, and less scoring units (meaning its easier for the enemy to concentrate fire). I'd also only have 59 models vs 101 models. That's a massive difference.

I'd actually say this may be better than Loganwing, unless your playing Loganwing right and just replacying Grey Hunters with Wolf Guard instead of using Logan to take too many Wolf Guard and neglecting your Cavalry and Scouts.

Anyways, thank you all for the positive feedback! I was starting to think I was stupid to try this but the response has been very positive! The only tweak I can see making to the list at the moment however is to drop the Combi-Melta shots and upgrade the Chapter Master to Pedro to gain 3 more scoring units and +1 Attack to all models within 12" of him.

Not sure if this is worth it or not, but it feels like the right move. A poll may be in order...


EDIT:
1) Blood Angels can do this list for 60 points cheaper at the risk of your heavy weapons having Rage. You also lose out on Orbital Bombardment but some may not think that's a big deal. I personally would have to use it a few times to be sure. Never had artillery at my disposal before but it sounds useful. It also means no Pedro so 3 less scoring units.

2) I'd only have to lose 2 Combi-Meltas to get Pedro. Alternatively I can lose 2 Lascannons. I'm thinking the 2 Lascannons may be the better sacrifice. They just get downgraded to Missile Launchers.