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Hi all,

Been thinking this through since I started Deliverance Lost, have really identified with the Raven Guard and want to collect a small force for when I don't feel like being evil space Elves. Have used the BA codex, as I think it allows for a closer fit than simply Shrike and a C:SM list.

Raven Guard apparently have limited access to Land Raiders and Predators, as well as being less devout than some other chapters, consequently I've decided not to use Chaplains (although one may be acceptable at a later date) and avoid the tanks. Have also avoided any uniquely and obviously Blood Angel troops (Death Company etc..) to avoid any accusations of cheese, feel the Furioso fits though, as RG have a predilicton for Lightning Claws, which Blood Talons are effectively Dread sized versions of.

SOP would be Termies and Captain (rethinking him, may end up with Libby instead) in Storm Chicken with Furioso in the boot (trunk for our American viewers!) with the others deploying/deepstriking as dictated by the board and mission. Have gone for heavy melta as with the mobility of the troops, range shouldn't be an issue and I feel it fits with the "hard and fast" guerilla style that the Raven Guard favour.
If I have a concern it is the number of shots the list can output against infantry, I could see Orks or Nids being a little overwhelming, so any suggestions how to fix that, or words of comfort would be great!



* HQ (160pts)

* Captain (160pts)
Melta Bombs
* Power Armour (
Jump Pack
2x Lightning Claw

* Elites (365pts)

* Furioso Dreadnought (150pts)
* Furioso (150pts)
Blood Talon with built-in Meltagun, Extra Armour
* Blood Talon
Built-in Heavy Flamer

* Terminator Assault Squad (215pts)
2x Terminator with Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield 3x Terminator with Twin Lightning Claws
* Troops (375pts)

* Assault Squad (125pts)
4x Assault Marines, Meltagun, Retain Jump Packs
* Veteran Sergeant
Chainsword, Infernus Pistol

* Assault Squad (125pts)
4x Assault Marines (72pts), Meltagun, Retain Jump Packs
* Veteran Sergeant
Chainsword, Infernus Pistol

* Assault Squad (125pts)
4x Assault Marines, Meltagun, Retain Jump Packs
* Veteran Sergeant
Chainsword, Infernus Pistol

* Fast Attack (210pts)

* Vanguard Veteran Squad (210pts)
2x Bolt Pistol, 4x Chainsword, Infernus Pistol x 2,
* 4x Vanguard Veterans
4x Jump Packs
* Veteran Sergeant
Bolt Pistol, Jump Pack, Thunder Hammer

* Heavy Support (380pts)

* Dreadnought (165pts)
Extra Armour, Multi-melta
* Blood Fist
Built-in Heavy Flamer
* Drop Pod
Storm Bolter

* Stormraven Gunship (215pts)
Extra Armour, Twin Linked Assault Cannon, Twin Linked Multi Melta

Any C+C welcome, both on the list itself and on my philosophy behind it.

Just a comment... don't post the prices for upgrades. It makes GW angry. Just post the unit w/ upgrades and the total cost.


HQ
Captain, Melta bombs, Power Armor, Jumpack and 2x Lightning Claws (160pts)


etc. etc. etc. Please go back and edit the first post so it's inline with that format.

Done, had cut and pasted from Battle Scribe, hadn't noticed it had done it.

Good deal. I wish I played BA so that I could have more advice for you.

It would be a handicap, but very fluffy for the Ravenguard to have units of 6, 7, or 8 marines to represent their difficulty on filling their ranks. It might also be fluffy to have some units of scouts as your troops to represent the recent raw recruits that they are forced to field.

In general, I think that a RavenGuard army works really well out of the VSM book. Shrike to give your army fleet, scouts as troops, and part-full units of assault marines. The Stormraven and Dreadnoughts are also really nice, fluff-wise.

It was a toss up, but Shrike will feature as the miniature of my captain, but I felt a lightning claw based dread, plus the Stormraven (it even has Raven in the name!) plus assault squads as troops was closer to my vision of how I wanted the army to be.

Scouts were definitely in the running, but just didn't fit with how I wanted to play (which is basically DoA, I now realise, but I really did write the list in a bit of a vacuum and didn't know that was the sort of list I was writing, honest!)

Ok, partly due to rethinking a few units and their war gear, and partly because I wasn't exactly inundated with responses, here is my revised list, 1495 points, same fluff criteria as before, feel free to comment!


HQ (160pts)

* Captain (160pts)
Melta Bombs
Terminator Armour
Lightning Claws

* Elites (345pts)

* Furioso Dreadnought (135pts)
Blood Talon with built-in Meltagun
* Blood Talon Built-in Heavy Flamer

* Terminator Assault Squad (210pts)
2x Terminator with Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield, 3x Terminator with Twin Lightning Claws

* Troops (405pts)

* Assault Squad (130pts)
4x Assault Marines, Flamer (5pts), Retain Jump Packs
* Veteran Sergeant
Bolt Pistol, Power Fist

* Assault Squad (140pts)
4x Assault Marines, Meltagun, Retain Jump Packs
* Veteran Sergeant
Bolt Pistol, Power Fist (25pts)

* Assault Squad (135pts)
4x Assault Marines, Meltagun, Retain Jump Packs
* Veteran Sergeant
Bolt Pistol, Power Fist

* Fast Attack (240pts)

* Vanguard Veteran Squad (240pts)
4x Bolt Pistol, 4x Power Weapon
4x Jump Packs
Veteran Sergeant (60pts)
Bolt Pistol, Jump Pack, Thunder Hammer

* Heavy Support (350pts)

* Dreadnought (150pts)
Multi-melta
Blood Fist (
Built-in Heavy Flamer
Drop Pod (35pts)
Storm Bolter

* Stormraven Gunship (200pts)
Twin Linked Assault Cannon, Twin Linked Multi-melta

The variation in the Assaults gear makes for a good spread. My only concern would be fighting Dark Eldar, but you probably know why.

I just started using RG as BA because a lot of it does fit. My group and I don't play competitively so we "fluff-up" the rules, such as using letting me use the BA codex and still have a Speeder Storm or Shrike.

Also RG 1st Company uses Furioso pattern Dreads, exactly for that reason. My army is the 1st Company, which allows me to name my own Shadow Captain as myself

I'd like to use bigger units of assaut marines, maybe dropping the dP dread for them. You can keep it fluffy like it has already been said and make them 7-9/unit

I take your point on the squad size, but its simply a financial decision initially, as Assault Marines come 5 to a box! I will very likely pick up another box to distribute around and make the squads larger eventually, but will stick with 5 man squads for now. I've already planned the next block of 1000 points, may well post that later.

This was supposed to be a side project to take a break from DE! *facepalm*

Hi Azreal13, That looks like a great idea basing your Raven Guard on Blood Angels. I didn't know such athing was possible or allowed!! I play BA and am in the process of building a Raven Guard army from recliamed projects (mainly my son's renegade Space Marine army and stuff I got from eBay) so my flat stinks of Dettol much to my lass's dismay!!
My plan is to have a bike mounted captain (based on Kon'sarroh Khan as I like the idea that the whole army can outflank!! Oh, and that nifty big sword of his!), command squad and two bike squads with attack bikes attached. I've subscribed to your link as I'm keen to see how you get on with your army.

Great, I'll try and keep some sort of update going!

Am attempting to post a few pics here as I go too http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/426755.page I warn you, my painting's ok, but my photography sucks!

As for subsuming one codex for another, its totally possible. Technically you should get your opponents permission, but in this case, all i'm essentially doing is painting my Blood Angels black, and informing my unit choices with a slightly different philosophy. I'm not changing any rules, so therefore nobody can really object!

Ok, phase 2 has been designed, an additional 1000 (well 1005) to work with the 1500 already written. Same criteria as before, no Land Raiders, no Predators, no Chaplains or equivalent, drawn from the BA Codex, but written to reflect my vision of how the Raven Guard wage war.

C and C welcome, specifically not sure about the loadout on Speeders, am toying with a Typhoon/HB combo as a lot of the list is melta heavy and short ranged, so might be an idea to balance that with a little more ranged punch, also not sure if power fist on Scout bike Sgt is a little redundant, as I intend to use this squad to harry from distance with the AGLs, but don't like a unit to not have some sort of anti-tank/MC in it if possible.

HQ
* Librarian (175pts)
Blood Lance, Epistolary Unleash Rage
* Power Armour
Bolt Pistol, Jump Pack

* Elites (265pts)

* Sternguard Veterans (265pts)
Boltgun, 4x Combi-Melta, Flamer, Meltagun, 7x Sternguard
* Drop Pod
Deathwind Missile Launcher
* Sergeant
Chainsword, Combi-Melta

* Troops (300pts)

3 x Scout Squad (100pts)
Missile Launcher, 3x Sniper Rifle
* 4x Scouts
4x Camo Cloaks
* Veteran Sergeant
Bolt Pistol, Camo Cloak, Sniper Rifle

* Fast Attack (265pts)

* Land Speeder Squadron (140pts)
2 x Land Speeder
Heavy Flamer, Multi-melta

* Scout Bike Squadron (125pts)
3x Astartes Grenade Launcher, 2x Scout Bikers
* Veteran Sergeant
Power Fist

I'm at a loss as to why you would run this list out of the Blood Angels codex. Fluff wise, I don't see how using the normal codex is any different, especially since the Raven Guard are supposed to be a codex chapter. The only BA specific thing is the Librarian powers, and Gate of Infinity plus whatever seems like a better fit for the list than what you have.

As for the list itself, I'm struggling to see how you can kill anything once the Land Speeders and Sternguard are gone. Is this list intended to be added to the previous one? It works a lot better in that context, but I think that you would do better to add another Stormraven, or maybe even three. Plus you should beef out the Assault Squads and add Honor Guards to get some Chalices in the list. I guess I'm assuming you aren't opposed to Chalices.

Yep, trying to avoid chalices or anything overtly Blood Angel-ey.

The main reason I've chosen to use BA is Assault Squads as troops, availability of the Stormraven, Furioso dread (giant lightning claws, RG like lightning claws!) all of which fit with the hard and fast style that RG are supposed to use.

I realise avoiding certain options that are key to a successful BA list is handicapping myself, but its only intended for friendly play in the main, but it doesn't mean I don't want to get the optimum weapon load outs, equipment etc on the choices I do make.

I'm still not clear on how, if at all, the two lists fit together.

I get that you aren't trying to be totally optimised, but on it's own, the second list will struggle to kill anything. At the very least you might drop Epistolary and the Deathwind Launcher to add some more Scout Bikers or something.

Ah, I see, its not a second list, its an additional 1k points to add to the first list, and give me some flexibility on units, so I don't have to run the same list all the time (unless I start playing a lot of 2.5k games!)

I did write it to be legal on its own, but never intend to play it as such.