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Ok so if you have read the book you will (maybe) agree with me that the M.I. are pretty damn cool. I am going to go about seeing how to fit them into 40k, either as a lone unit (probably in an IG army since they are just regular humans) or as an army in and of itself (in which case I'd mix the film with the book and television series so there can be more choice). I would see them as a harder crisis suit (what with their ability to jump, the strength, the armour, etc), with weapons as they have in the book (flamers, rockets, nukes, bomb dispensers, all that jazz). I'll do a single unit up as a marauder suit unit, but as an army you would also have command and scout suits, I guess it depends how people take this as to whether or not I do go on with it.

So here we go;
Elites/Heavy Support (I'm not sure which, I'd like elites but that'd make them a no-sh** choice i think, whereas HS means they have to contend for a spot).
Points; 55
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 4 4 2 3 2 8 3+
Unit Size: 1 Cap Trooper

Equipment: Marauder Suit, 2 Hand-Flamers, 2 Grenade Launchers, Vox-caster

Options: An additional 4 Cap Troopers can be purchased for 55 points per model.
Any Cap Trooper can purchase a Missile Launcher for 15 points per model.

Special Rules: Jets, Marauder Systems, Mobile Infantry, Combat Drop
Jets; Marauder Suits provide a MI trooper with the ability to engage foot mounted jets during battle, greatly increasing their mobility.
-Cap Troopers can make a move of up to 6" during the assault phase, regardless of what weapons have been fired that turn. They move as jump infantry (therefore take DT tests when landing on terrain etc). They may not use this if engaged in close combat, if pinned, etc. [This is meant to be basically the crisis suit move, I think...if I missed anything, do tell please]
Marauder Systems;The Marauder Suits are state of the art engines of war, capable of bringing a Cap Trooper through the rigours of his drop, the combat and the retrieval, all while keeping him alive, fighting and communicating with his team.
-The advanced targetting systems of the Marauder suit allow the troopers to fire any combination of 2 weapons a turn, no matter how they move. However, if they fire 2 weapons, they cannot then assault (however, they can still fire one and assault, even if it is a Missile Launcher). If they do not engage their jets and jump in the assault phase, they gain +1 BS in the shooting phase (keep a note of which units do what).
Mobile Infantry; The Mobile Infantry are well trained soldiers, bonded through numerous combat drops into the teeth of enemy forces. They are veterans all, even the greenest man fresh from boot is considered well blooded after a single drop. They hold courage and loyalty in high regard, because every man is a volunteer, a willing fighter. The men you go into combat besides will not be suffering from 'conscript sickness' or try to shirk their duty, and this knowledge makes every cap trooper fight all the harder.
-Cap Troopers may always try to regroup (so long as they are far enough away from enemy models) regardless of the state of their unit (it doesn't matter if they have lost over 50% casualties)
Combat Drop; The favoured method of entry into battle for MI cap troopers, dropped in their 'eggs' from a drop-ship, they arrive on-time and often on-target, ready to lay waste to the enemy.
-Cap Troopers must enter the battle from Reserves. They may appear on a 4+ on turn 1, a 3+ on turn 2, etc etc (basically the current reserve rules a turn ahead of normal). However, they only scatter 1D6 upon arrival, and may move upon arrival, shoot or run, and make their 'jump' in the assault phase. They may not assault an enemy unit however, only a fool would drop straight into hand to hand combat.

Justification; WS - MI are very well trained in hand to hand combat, they use it in their suits as well, even against Bugs and come out well (well enough anyway)
BS - a suit with fancy targetting systems and what not, if they remain stationary and not on the bounce then they can get +1 BS
S - They are meant to be able to crush a gorilla in a hug (and I bet marines could do that too) so S4
T - The suits sound like, well, armoured suits, so T4 suits (same as crisis suits, which are similar I think)
W - Seems to be a common thing for suits to have 2 wounds (crisis, broadside, etc)
I - I didn't feel good giving a guard unit more than I3. Despite the fact they are well trained in combat and all that, so are stormies and vets, and they are still I3, so I figured it would stay the same.
A - 2 Attacks seems reasonable, there is no way for them to get more (apart from charging) I don't think, so it won't end up with something crazy like 4 attacks each on a guard unit.
Ld - 8 is the norm for vets and stormies (codex isn't on hand, but I think I'm right) so 8 can do for these fellas as well
Sv - 3+ is better than anything else in the IG book, and in line with other combat jumpy suits. Also, theres no mention of shields or anything similar in the book so no invo save I guess.
Weapons - 2 Hand-Flamers because they are described as using 'a Hand Flamer in each hand' when burning out bugs. Similar reason for the 2 Grenade Launchers, they are described as having one on each shoulder (well, a bomb-dispenser kind of thing, but grenade launcher is similar and an already existing item). Option to buy a missile launcher because they do have rockets in the book, but I didn't want to just give them one, would either run the price up pretty hard or make them too good.
Jets - They have jets on their feet in the books which allow them to engage and fall back and what not. Its a no brainer.
Marauder Systems - They are often operating more than one weapon system, it is often mentioned how easy the system is to operate, and the +1 BS is due to all the extra optics, which I have dissallowed while jumping because that'd make them too good.
Mobile Infantry - John the narrator goes on and on about the brotherhood present in the MI, how they would do anything for one another, etc etc, how they are all volunteers who wish to fight. I thought this would be well represented with a similar mechanic to a bonding knife (its all just some kinda bonding in the end)
Combat Drop - I love the imagery that I got from the book of them dropping in, and he talked about how while a bad pilot could see them well rooted, a good pilot could put them pretty close to spot on, so yeah, better DS ability (even though they do not HAVE to DS this way in the book, it is by far the coolest way to rock up, and what is warhammer if not cool...right?)
Points - No real reasoning, here is where I need the most help.

Thanks guys

Im guessing this is a Starship Troopers unit ? If so could you recommend some of the novels as this sounds bad-ass!

From what i can tell they seem really good and the points seem maybe 5 to much even with all the stuff they got cause if they are a heavy support choice to have a squad of 5 dudes would be 275 without giving them rockets 350 with rockets so a fairly hefty point sink

Im guessing this is a Starship Troopers unit ? If so could you recommend some of the novels as this sounds bad-ass!

The one and only, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starship_Troopers

check it out, words can not describe how much i recommend this book.

edit: in regards to the OP, I like it. Your right about them being Physically similar to TAU crisis suits, where i think they differ would be the movement. My impression for their jumping from the book is that they would jump lang distances, like city blocks at a time, pop off some high explosive, then jump to hit somewhere else. This to me would suggest normal jump infantry rules, as opposed to tau jet packs who use jets and anti grav to kinda float over the battle field, no faster then walking, but being compleatly stable for weapon fire.

The rest of the rules seem fluffy, could use some better wording though. points wise 55 seems close, a fast and shooty paladin. maybe a bit more given the speed increase/guns/whatnot. Over all a good form and not over the top.

Cheers for the cc. I'll probably add 5 points and make them JI, but they do use the jets to bounce away from threats and what not, so I will keep that...unless that'd be too much? I steered away from mentioning some of their weapons because they would just be stupid in 40k (like nukes). Would you want to see my take on scout & command suits? Or is it a waste of time. Also, have you ever played the starship trooper wargame? is it worth getting into?

motyak wrote:Cheers for the cc. I'll probably add 5 points and make them JI, but they do use the jets to bounce away from threats and what not, so I will keep that...unless that'd be too much? I steered away from mentioning some of their weapons because they would just be stupid in 40k (like nukes). Would you want to see my take on scout & command suits? Or is it a waste of time. Also, have you ever played the starship trooper wargame? is it worth getting into?

Purely from a game balance perspective, I would recommend EITHER making them Jump Infantry OR giving them Jetpacks, but not both. That would be a little insane; they can move 12" per turn, AND pull JSJ shenanigans like Crisis suits? It's a bit much. Based off the book, I think they're Jump Infantry. In the first chapter, when Rico fires off a nuclear missile, he has to stay in place briefly to shoot the missile launcher. In fact, he's almost hit because he stayed in place for too long.

I wouldn't give them any special close-combat abilities, or let them fire anything before assaulting. The MI are not close-combat troopers; I can only think of a single time when any MI actually engages in hand-to-hand combat in the book, outside of martial-arts training in boot camp; at one point, Rico mentions someone crushing a Bug to death, if I remember correctly. For that matter, I might even give them WS 3 and one Attack. . . MI boot camp is rough, but I doubt that living on Catachan, say, is any easier, and Catachans still have WS3 and one Attack. So do IG Veterans. Similarly, 2 wounds seems a little suspect; Space Marines are just as tough as MI and just as well-protected, I'd think. Crisis suits are much larger than man-sized, more something you drive than something you wear, whereas MI suits seem more like power armor to me.

Allowing them to fire two weapons per turn I like; very much in line with the book, and it makes them an interestingly unique unit. Firing Heavy weapons on the move doesn't seem to be something they can do, though; they do a lot of shooting flamers, grenades, and other things on the bounce, but when they're using missiles they hold still to do so. There's also mention near the end of the book of dedicated heavy weapons unit, which emplace themselves and don't jump around, so it seems like the MI don't use the big guns on the move.

Scout and Command suits would certainly be interesting; and why not include the mini-nukes? +30 points or so, one per squad, one-use, unlimited range S10 AP1 Large Blast. 40k is really, really abstract; I don't imagine a tiny nuke like the MI carry is any bigger in blast radius than an orbital strike from a battlecruiser, and that's represented by Large Blast.

Basically, I think they ought to be shootier and less of a 'generalist' unit. If a Space Marine Assault Squad hits them in CC, they ought to lose pretty badly; Space Marines fight with chainsaw swords on a regular basis and have decades of practice at doing so, the MI don't. However, you might give them a few more shooting options, and consolidate the ones they have; based on the book they do seem to carry a firearm as well as grenades and flamers, for instance. Rather than two hand flamers just give them a regular Flamer (precedent comes from the old SoB unit, which could have two hand flamers that fired together using the regular flamer profile), a single MI Grenade Launcher that's Assault 2 but has no krak option (they didn't use them for cracking hard targets, only suppressing infantry and less-armored bugs), and a couple of other options. The MI description of what they call a "heavy flamer", for instance, actually sounds like an energy weapon; Rico uses it to cut through a wall in the first chapter, and it's described as a "beam", so it's definitely not a flamethrower. You could justify that as a meltagun or plasma gun equivalent. You can then add a more basic firearm, something around the power of a bolter, which gives you a total of 2 basic weapons and 3 additional options.

With lower WS, cutting out the 'assault after firing' rule, and consolidating their weaponry, you could also have a slightly lower price; say 45 points if you wanted to keep 2 wounds, or 25-30 points if they only had one. Then just pick whether you want them in Heavy Support, Fast Attack, or Elite depending on what you'd want them to be competing with for space; they could easily fit in any of the three.

Elites/Heavy Support (Still undecided on which one)
Points; 50
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 4 4 2 3 1 8 3+
Unit Size: 1 Cap Trooper

Equipment: Marauder Suit, Hand-Flamer, Morita Rifle, Marauder Grenade Launcher, Vox-caster

Options: An additional 4 Cap Troopers can be purchased for 50 points per model.
Any Cap Trooper may replace their Morita/Hand Flamer with a Morita/Hand Flamer for free.
Any Cap Trooper can purchase a Missile Launcher for 15 points per model.
One Cap Trooper may purchase a Meltagun for 10 points, a Plasma Beamer for 10 points, or a Heavy Flamer for 20 points.
If the unit consists of five Cap Troopers, a second Trooper may be upgraded to wield one of these special weapons (melta/plasma/flamer).

Special Rules: Jets, Marauder Systems, Mobile Infantry, Combat Drop
Jets; Marauder Suits provide a MI trooper with the ability to engage foot mounted jets during battle, greatly increasing their mobility.
-Cap Troopers are jump infantry
Marauder Systems;The Marauder Suits are state of the art engines of war, capable of bringing a Cap Trooper through the rigours of his drop, the combat and the retrieval, all while keeping him alive, fighting and communicating with his team.
-The advanced targetting systems of the Marauder suit allow the troopers to fire any combination of 2 weapons a turn, no matter how they move. If they do not engage their jets (and instead walk like regular infantry), they gain +1 BS in the shooting phase (keep a note of which units do what).
Mobile Infantry; Same as before
Combat Drop; Same as Before

Marauder Grenade Launcher
Range Strength AP Rules
24" 3 5 Assault 2, Small Blast

Morita Rifle
Range Strength AP Rules
24" 4 5 Assault 2

Plasma Beamer
Range Strength AP Rules
18" 7 2 Assault 2

'being brought up on the catachan planet doesn't give you WS4/2 attacks' isn't too relevant, because there isn't a unit which is actually catachan, apart from marbo/straken (and they are marbo and freaking straken), in this edition. but the veteran comment is good. I'll give them WS4 because they do really get drilled with the hand to hand, but limit them to 1A. I'll make them just JI as well, and drop the 'shoot and assault' bit.

I would make them fire as a flamer, but they are really just flatout called 'hand flamers' when he dual wields them and what not, so I'll just leave that. The nuke I'll save for the command suit (i know thats not accurate, but it'll limit its use). I stuck with established weapons for the meltagun because existing weapons seem to go down easier than made up ones, and close to established for the plasma beamer.

cheers.

Looks good! I'd take 'em, if I played IG anyway.

One last quick thing; the way you've got it worded, you could take a meltagun, plasma beamer, and heavy flamer all in the same unit. Is that what you were going for, with a 5-man unit being able to purchase a second of any given weapon, or do you want them to have only one special weapon period, with a second if they have five models?

Fixed. I knew what I meant, it just didn't make it to paper...well, screen. I meant that you can get one in the unit, then with 5 get a second. It could get just ugly otherwise

What's a morita rifle? I don't recall that from the book.

I know they have a nade launcher, missile launcher, flamers and a sorta welding thing that can cut through metal, but I don't remember any rifle.
Also, it would be fun to add in that psychological warfare grenade.

Overall, this is very good and accurate.

I thought that might be it. Anyway, I like the unit. Are you planning to do Scout and/or Command suits, as well?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:What's a morita rifle? I don't recall that from the book.

I know they have a nade launcher, missile launcher, flamers and a sorta welding thing that can cut through metal, but I don't remember any rifle.
Also, it would be fun to add in that psychological warfare grenade.

Overall, this is very good and accurate.

Whatever their ballistic weapon is is never named, but it seems to be referenced in passing on a couple of different occasions. Makes sense they'd have one, as a basic side-arm if nothing else; the design of the rifle has survived as long as it has because it's an extremely flexible weapon useful at a wide variety of ranges. Sending the MI out without one would be a bit silly.

I picked the name morita up from some random starship trooper things I was looking at, I think it is the rifle from the wargame which is used by the 'ape' marauder or something....not quite sure, it was on ebay and it said the thing was armed with 2 morita rifles, and then something else seemd to say the morita was the regular kind of issue rifle from the tv series/film, so I figure it was as good a name as any, better than kitten blazer or something. I'll do scout suits now so long as I get the time. If you want, you can have a crack at command?

Heres the ebay thing that mentioned moritas as 'morita claws' but I remember from the TV series that suit would always lift its arms up and dakka away, so thats where that thought came from (way down the bottom)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/StarShip-troopers-Miniatures-Game-M-8-APE-Marauder-Suite-/320832880244?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ab3213e74

and heres the other random thing I found when looking for moritas. I know its all about the movie but hey, better than nothing
http://starshiptroopers.wikia.com/wiki/Morita_Assault_Rifle



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Should Scout Suits be a unit in and of themselves? or should it be a conglomerate unit. They are part of the platoon in the book and work closely with the marauders, but that would lead to quite the unwieldy unit...i dunno

your thinking of the film were the MI were essentialy basic guardsmen. they were standard issued with the morita assault rifle. the suits had things such as chain guns and flamers.

in the book all MI were suit mounted and could carry REALLY cool stuff.

in the film they also had electro pulse hull defences.

master of ordinance wrote:your thinking of the film were the MI were essentialy basic guardsmen. they were standard issued with the morita assault rifle. the suits had things such as chain guns and flamers.

in the book all MI were suit mounted and could carry REALLY cool stuff.

Right, but it makes sense that the suits would also have some kind of basic ballistic weapon; and it might as well be called the Morita, since at least that's a name associated with Starship Troopers (if only through that abominable movie).

motyak wrote:
Should Scout Suits be a unit in and of themselves? or should it be a conglomerate unit. They are part of the platoon in the book and work closely with the marauders, but that would lead to quite the unwieldy unit...i dunno

I can see a few ways to work it.

1) Have Scout Sections as separate units; probably the simplest. Since the units are quite expensive, you're probably almost never going to be fielding an entire Platoon, so having the units spread out doesn't matter all THAT much.

2) Have an 'MI Platoon' be a multi-unit choice, like an Infantry Platoon, with Scout Sections being an optional unit within the entry; this has precedent you could work off of, but basically the only difference from #1 is that this lets you take all your MI in one Elites/Heavy Support slot.

3) Have an 'MI Platoon' be a single unit, but allow them to operate individually or break down into 'Sections' of two or three models without having to be in coherency with the whole unit. You'd have to figure out some way to deal with Leadership and Fall Back, but this would be the most faithful to the book and represent the independent nature of MI operations well.

I gotta put this on hold for the next little while as my travelling has me hopping round a lot for the next week and a bit, whereas when I was doing all the typing before I was in a (Relatively) fixed placed. If you guys feel like writing up something then go nuts, I won't be able to add anything really useful for about a week. guh.

BeRzErKeR wrote:

master of ordinance wrote:your thinking of the film were the MI were essentialy basic guardsmen. they were standard issued with the morita assault rifle. the suits had things such as chain guns and flamers.

in the book all MI were suit mounted and could carry REALLY cool stuff.

Right, but it makes sense that the suits would also have some kind of basic ballistic weapon; and it might as well be called the Morita, since at least that's a name associated with Starship Troopers (if only through that abominable movie).

motyak wrote:
Should Scout Suits be a unit in and of themselves? or should it be a conglomerate unit. They are part of the platoon in the book and work closely with the marauders, but that would lead to quite the unwieldy unit...i dunno

I can see a few ways to work it.

1) Have Scout Sections as separate units; probably the simplest. Since the units are quite expensive, you're probably almost never going to be fielding an entire Platoon, so having the units spread out doesn't matter all THAT much.

2) Have an 'MI Platoon' be a multi-unit choice, like an Infantry Platoon, with Scout Sections being an optional unit within the entry; this has precedent you could work off of, but basically the only difference from #1 is that this lets you take all your MI in one Elites/Heavy Support slot.

3) Have an 'MI Platoon' be a single unit, but allow them to operate individually or break down into 'Sections' of two or three models without having to be in coherency with the whole unit. You'd have to figure out some way to deal with Leadership and Fall Back, but this would be the most faithful to the book and represent the independent nature of MI operations well.

if your reffering to the first film then i dont know what to say. THAT was the BEST of the series.
if your reffering to the second then i agree with you entirely. THAT one was gak.