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Title is self explanatory
Please restrict yourselves to helpful comments only

HQ:

Wolf Lord 275 pts
thunderwolf mount
saga of the warrior born
thunder hammer
storm shield
wolf tooth necklace
- runic armor

Troops:

10 Grey Hunters 160 pts
2 plasmaguns

Rhino 50 pts
dozer blade
hunter killer missile

10 Grey Hunters 160 pts
2 plasmaguns

Rhino 40 pts
- dozer blade

10 Grey Hunters 150 pts
2 meltaguns

Rhino 40 pts
dozer blade

10 Grey Hunters 150 pts
2 meltaguns

Rhino 40 pts
dozer blade

Fast Attack:

3 Thunderwolf Cavalry 270 pts
Storm shield and power fist
storm shield and melta bombs
storm shield

Heavy Support:

6 Long Fangs 140 pts
5 missile launchers

6 Long Fangs 140 pts
5 missile launchers

6 Long Fangs 140 pts
- 5 missile launchers

Overall it looks fairly solid; however, here are some thoughts I would like to share after running a pretty similar list for the past year:

1) Rune Priests are priceless...every Space Wolf List needs one in some way shape or form. Now more than every with the fact that even the lowliest Grey Knight squad can butcher a unit of Thunderwolves.

2) If you're going to run your Lord with a Thunderhammer, Saga of the Bear is a must. If he gets stuck in with Dreadought, you won't be sweating too hard when it comes to roll those 3+ Invulnerable Saves. Just as well, if he ends up dancing with Mephiston you can just smile and relish in the ease with which you kill him.

3) Wolf Scouts are a wise investment. This comes with the prevalence of Rifleman dreadnoughts; as well as, parking lots of all shapes and sizes.

4) Wolf Guard are pretty important as you'll need that 1 point of Leadership more than you might think.

With the above statements in mind, here's my suggested list:

H.Q.

Thunderwolf Lord
Runic Armor, Wolf Tooth Necklace, Storm Shield, Runic Armor, Saga of the Bear -270

Rune Priest
Chooser, Living Lightning, Murderous Hurricane

Elites

Wolf Guard 4x
4x Combi-melta/Power Fist -172

Wolf Scouts 5x
Melta -85

Troops

Grey Hunters 7x
Melta, Wolf Standard, Rhino -155

Grey Hunters 8x
Melta, Wolf Standard, Rhino -170

Grey Hunters 8x
Melta, Wolf Standard, Rhino -170

Fast Attack

Thunderwolves 3x
Power Fist/Storm Shield, Storm Shield, Storm Shield/Melta Bombs -270

Heavy Support

Long Fangs 5x
4x Missile Launchers -115

Long Fangs 5x
4x Missile Launchers -115

Long Fangs 5x
4x Missile Launchers -115

Total: 1747

Just a quick point on the weapons load out of your thunderwolves.
If you put a thunderhammer on the wolf lord, you get a lot of s10 hits but I5 is wasted on that baby, since the lord will be the main thing your enemy wants dead he'll stick all the wounds on the lord to make sure it doesn't strike in combat. Weight of numbers will be a problem, to get the best effect with the lord switch to a wolf claw, he hits with 6 attacks on the assault, I5, S5, hitting on 3's with a re-roll on either the hits or to wound rolls. That averages about 4.5 wounds a turn on average against space marines, while a thunderhamer would kill more, 5.5, you will have twice as many attacks to weather.

For taking out the big problems you can stick a thunderhammer on the thunderwolf instead of a powerfist and stick melta bombs or use the 5 points somewhere else. I think it's a bit of overkill/waste to have two s10 I1 thunderwolves in the squad.

It comes down to what the playing field looks like nowadays and how well the unit can perform for weapons choices. I ran 2 Lords with 3 Thunderwolves recently and the Thunderhammer Lord made the Wolf Claw Lord look like a chump. Granted, they were fighting Paladins, but the Thunderhammer instagibbing 3 models as opposed to putting out 3 wounds was process. Additionally, with the way some of the vehicles and troops are with higher armor and toughness S5 can become a wash even with re-rolls.

Just a thought to keep in mind.

Unholy_Martyr wrote:Overall it looks fairly solid; however, here are some thoughts I would like to share after running a pretty similar list for the past year:

1) Rune Priests are priceless...every Space Wolf List needs one in some way shape or form. Now more than every with the fact that even the lowliest Grey Knight squad can butcher a unit of Thunderwolves.

2) If you're going to run your Lord with a Thunderhammer, Saga of the Bear is a must. If he gets stuck in with Dreadought, you won't be sweating too hard when it comes to roll those 3+ Invulnerable Saves. Just as well, if he ends up dancing with Mephiston you can just smile and relish in the ease with which you kill him.

3) Wolf Scouts are a wise investment. This comes with the prevalence of Rifleman dreadnoughts; as well as, parking lots of all shapes and sizes.

4) Wolf Guard are pretty important as you'll need that 1 point of Leadership more than you might think.

With the above statements in mind, here's my suggested list:

H.Q.

Thunderwolf Lord
Runic Armor, Wolf Tooth Necklace, Storm Shield, Runic Armor, Saga of the Bear -270

Rune Priest
Chooser, Living Lightning, Murderous Hurricane

Elites

Wolf Guard 4x
4x Combi-melta/Power Fist -172

Wolf Scouts 5x
Melta -85

Troops

Grey Hunters 7x
Melta, Wolf Standard, Rhino -155

Grey Hunters 8x
Melta, Wolf Standard, Rhino -170

Grey Hunters 8x
Melta, Wolf Standard, Rhino -170

Fast Attack

Thunderwolves 3x
Power Fist/Storm Shield, Storm Shield, Storm Shield/Melta Bombs -270

Heavy Support

Long Fangs 5x
4x Missile Launchers -115

Long Fangs 5x
4x Missile Launchers -115

Long Fangs 5x
4x Missile Launchers -115

Total: 1747

I like this list alot better but would it be cheaper and better instead of the wolf claw and storm shield to just turn him into Canis Wolfborn cuz then you have a change to get up to 10-15 attacks on the charge!!!!!! if i remeber correct then you have about 90 pts to put somewhere else.

Problems with Canis Wolfborn:

1) No Invulnerable Save

2) Vulnerable to Instant Death

3) Low Leadership (8)

Those 90 points are completely worth the splurge.

actually have completely rethought the army
Now gonna start with 1500 points, rather than 1750


HQ:

Rune Priest 110 pts
choser of the slain
living lightning, jaws of the world wolf

Rune Priest 160 pts
choser of the slain, master of runes
living lightning, tempest’s wrath

Elites:

5 Wolf Guard 100 pts
2 combi-meltas, 3 bolters

Troops:

8 Grey Hunters 125 pts
meltagun

Rhino 35 pts

8 Grey Hunters 125 pts
meltagun

Rhino 35 pts

10 Grey Hunters 160 pts
2 plasma guns

Rhino 35 pts

10 Grey Hunters 160 pts
- 2 plasma guns

Rhino 35 pts

Heavy Support:

6 Long Fangs 140 pts
5 missile launchers

6 Long Fangs 140 pts
5 missile launchers

6 Long Fangs 140 pts
5 missile launchers

1 Rune Priest is plenty at 1500 and Master of Runes is generally a waste for just about everything. With that said, drop the Master of Runes Rune Priest and trim the Wolf Guard to 3 men with Combination Meltas and Power Fists. Add in a squad of Wolf Scouts with a Melta and Melta Bombs and you'll be solid.

Well I disagree on the 2 rune priests, I think they are a fine addition to the list, more lightening, jaws and hurricanes per turn and more of an anti-psyker bubble.

What I'd do myself is the following.


You're weak against heavy armour and the s9 shots are essential for dealing with LR and the like, plus when you get grey knights on the field having some ap2 weapons is a bonus.
I dropped the 3rd squad down to 8 as you may want to move around your priests especially if you get a squad torn up in the early game and want to keep the priest at the front.

When it comes to thunderwolf lords, the hammer is great for multi-wound models, hands down. The problem is that in a lot of cases you aren't going up against multi-wound models so you are not getting the most out of your weapons choice, I leave a hammer in the squad to have those hits ready for the second swipe but the lord get's in with the claws first and reduces the number of attacks coming at the squad. Even with 2+/3++ on the lord and 3+/3++ on the squad you're gonna fail some rolls so that's my opinion.
I play with a hammer lord and he hits hard and kills 4 models a turn every time nearly, but he does drop wounds to the numbers, if he had a fellow lord with a claw then I'm sure they'd be deadly and I'd be throwing them at tougher things off the bat instead of using them to pick off troops and support as is.

160 points can either get you a 1 shot per turn model that can get instagibbed in more ways than one would like to think...or it can buy you 8 men and a Transport that have the ability to nuke tanks and eat the insides. Even more, they add another scoring unit and allow you to keep pushing even if you lose a Rhino or two.

I don't think another troops choice is really needed, maybe dropping the 2nd rune priest for tooled out squads is the answer but I think at 1500 the list is decent enough to hold enough of the board to get the job done.

For the original list, Unholy_Martyr's revision is pretty solid. I would have dropped the 3rd Long Fang pack and a Storm Shield from the Thunderwolves to take TLLC Razorbacks for the Long Fangs and Wolf Tail Talismans for both HQs. Leaves you 10 points for Saga of the Beastslayer on your Priest (for that wonderfully accurate suppressing fire from Living Lightning).

I personally don't like throwing away the I5 on the Wolf Lord/WGBL with a Thunderhammer, but since you are taking Storm Shields on most/all Thunderwolves it doesn't matter that much. Definitely give him Eternal Warrior or he'll be eaten up though.

For your second list:

1) Drop Master of Runes, its a waste of points. Better to give one Saga of the Beastslayer or a Meltabomb.

2) Unless you are doing Loganwing, the strength of the Wolf Guard is that the wargear they can bring to the table. Combi-Weapons coupled with Power Fists/Wolf Claws are your top option as pack leaders.

3) Not sure where your Wolf Guard are going. Only 10 bodies can fit in a Rhino, you have 4 troops and 2 Long fangs. Only 4 of them can have models however so I'm not sure what you are doing with your 3 bolter Wolf Guard (which really are a waste).

4) You have nothing that hits hard in melee now that you ditched the Thunderwolf Cavalry. You should consider Mark of the Wulfen, maybe a Power Weapon on the Grey Hunters and definitely bring one or two Power Fists. I find I need only one fist per pair of troop in order to protect against Dreadnoughts and MCs.

So I find myself, as I typically do it seems, seconding Unholy_Martyr on this. Bring 3 Combi-Melta/Power Fist Wolf Guard and some Scouts. The Scouts are surprisingly destructive. You will be pleased with them.

I also agree with Liturgies of Blood. You could use some stronger ranged anti-tank than the S8 Missile Launchers. Again, I would suggest dropping the 3rd Long Fang pack to bring two TLLC Razorbacks. Still the same number of shots, but now you are mobile in Dawn of War deployments and you have stronger ranged anti-tank.

I'd consider having all your Grey Hunters in Rhinos be 8 man, and use the Rune Priests in the Plasma ones. They can move 6" and fire out the top, but this way your Melta squads can drive towards the enemy if you need to and you won't lose their suppressing fire. You don't want to leave them with the Long Fangs as their 24" anti-psyker bubble will help the Grey Hunters too much.

another list revision:


HQ:

Rune Priest 115 pts
choser of the slain, wolf tail talisman
living lightning, jaws of the world wolf

Rune Priest 115 pts
choser of the slain, melta bombs
living lightning, tempest’s wrath

Elites:

3 Wolf Guard 129 pts
2 combi-meltas, 1 combi-plasma, 3 power fists

Troops:

8 Grey Hunters 150 pts
meltagun, Mark of the Wulfen, Wolf standard

Rhino 35 pts

8 Grey Hunters 150 pts
meltagun, Mark of the Wulfen, Wolf standard

Rhino 35 pts

9 Grey Hunters 170 pts
plasma gun, Mark of the Wulfen, Wolf standard

Rhino 35 pts

10 Grey Hunters 185 pts
- 2 plasma guns, Mark of the Wulfen, Wolf standard

Rhino 35 pts

Heavy Support:

5 Long Fangs 115 pts
4 missile launchers

5 Long Fangs 115 pts
4 missile launchers

5 Long Fangs 115 pts
4 missile launchers

Drop the Plasmas ---> swap for melta. Its far far far better against vehicles, and in 5th ed Mech is king. Plus its only a little less effective against infantry, though its str8 so it'll instakill Paladins, Nobs and the like.

You don't really need 2 RP's @ 1500. I'd drop one, and pick up a Lone Wolf w/ TDA+CF+SS. He'll act as a nice tarpit against CC units and can carve up MC's/Walkers with ease. Plus he takes a lot of effort to remove, and he doesn't give up a KP.

The melta squads role is to be forward moving assaulting and heading for their objectives, the plasma is for forming ranks and blasting away at the enemy Sharpe style.

Cowmanaut has said it a lot and I agree to an extent that plasma can be a better choice depending on the roll the you want the squad to take, double wound terminators and av14 are a reason to have some melta but for everything else there is plasma. S7 will take out transports and tbh there are enough missiles and melta guns in there to take care of everything.
Plus I'll lay money on 6th ed having plasma as king instead of melta.

Lone wolf is fine but he's not got the stopping power to put down cc units, the MC's and dreads are probably dead 9/10 times, hell the guy will walk through a killa can squad but against squads weight of numbers will take his ass out. BA on the charge, orks, beserkers etc will see his ass gone. Even in TDA and a SS.
Being isolated and having to weather fire he may not have the survival or the return on investment that other units may have. With the online meta game wetting itself over mech lists with laz/plaz razorbacks maybe he isn't going to get the job done and is a loss of points.

Redid the list once more, back to 1750

1750 pts

HQ:

Rune Priest 110 pts
choser of the slain
Living lightning, Jaws of the world wolf

Wolf Lord 265 pts
thunderwolf
saga of the bear
runic armor
storm shield
power fist
wolf tooth necklace

Elites:

3 Wolf Guard 69 pts
- 3 combi-meltas

Drop Pod 35 pts

Troops:

9 Grey Hunters 170 pts
plasma gun
wolf standard
mark of the wulfen

Rhino 35 pts

10 Grey Hunters 180 pts
2 meltaguns
wolf standard
mark of the wulfen

Rhino 35 pts

10 Grey Hunters 180 pts
2 meltaguns
wolf standard
mark of the wulfen

Rhino 35 pts

Fast Attack:

3 Thunderwolf cavalry 210 pts
storm shield, power fist
bolt pistol, close combat weapon, melta bombs
bolt pistol, close combat weapon

Heavy Support:

6 Long Fangs 155 pts
4 missile launchers
1 lascannon

6 Long Fangs 155 pts
4 missile launchers
1 lascannon

5 Long Fangs 115 pts
4 missile launchers

I'd think about bringing some more Wolf Guard and dropping the Grey Hunter packs down to 8 man. This way if the Rhino the Rune Priest is in is destroyed he can hop into another one. You'll also retain the double special weapons for those 'must hit' situations.

You may even be able to squeeze out a Terminator with heavy weapon for the Drop Pod if you ditch one of the Thunderwolves, but most people will argue against that. At 1750 I havent' needed more than 3 models on Thunderwolves, including my WGBL, so its 55 points you could shave off there.