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Hey Dakka, First post here but wanted some impressions on my 2k tournament reserve list. I know its a little different then what some people are used to but bear with me
Now I have two versions of this list that I want impressions on.

HQ:

Yriel 155

Autarch 92
Avenger Shuriken Cata
Mandi-Blasters
Power Weapon



Elite
5 Fire Dragons 80
Wave Serpent 110
Shuriken cata
TL Shuriken cannon
SS


5 Fire Dragons 80
Wave Serpent 110
Shuriken cata
TL Shuriken cannon
SS


10 Striking Scorpions 212
Exarch
Scorpion Claw
Stalker
Shadow Strike


Troops:

10 Dire Avengers 177 (Yriel with them)
Exarch
PW/SS
Defend
Bladestorm

Wave Serpent 125
SS
Shuriken Cata
Scatter Lasers



10 Dire Avengers 152
Exarch
Duel Catapults
Bladestorm

Wave Serpent 125
SS
Shuriken cata
Scatter Lasers


3 Guardian Bike Squad 66

Heavy Support:

Eldar Warwalker 180
6 Scatter Lasers

Fire Prism 160
SS
Holo Fields


Fire Prism 160
SS
Holo Fields

Scorpions outflank with walkers and cause problems back field or where needed and everything is held in reserve untill turn two to come in on a 2+ to hit weak flanks etc.



My other version of this list is almost identical except for the troop section:

Troops:

x5 Dire Avengers

Wave serpent
SS
Shuriken cata
Scatter lasers

x5 Dire Avengers

Wave serpent
SS
Shuriken cata
Scatter lasers

10 Dire Avengers 177 (Yriel with them)
Exarch
PW/SS
Defend
Bladestorm


I drop the jet bikes and the other large squad of avengers as well as dropping the holo fields to pick up these extra units of DA in transports to take objectives.

What are your thoughts?

I would go with the first list, though I would drop the upgrades on the fire prism's and put a farseer into the Other than that I like the army.

I agree with BaneGuard a Farseer and Autarch is probably more useful then two Autarchs.

Anyone one have some more specific thoughts on the troops section or a more indepth look on the list as a whole? I struggle with the idea of the farseer, while I know they can be well and the powers a big buff to certain aspects of your army it does reduce the effectiveness of the army coming on the table when I need it ( I know its still on a 3+ on turn two, but I really like that 2+)

I haven't commented really commented on the troops because I agree with the troops. The reason I said the first list is because the dire avengers in squads of 10 are better use of them than two 5 man units. I also think the guardian jet bikes are a good idea.

I've done Autauch x2 several times and can 150% agree that while a 2+ is cool it is completely not worth the cost or loss of the ridiculousness that is the power of a farseer.

Rune of Warding single handled destroys the effectiveness about half the armies in the game and gives a GIANT finger to GK. Outside of that the farseer will turn that bladestorm unit from utter crap to pretty good.

Scorpions - Remember that an Autauch that is attached to a Scorpions unit can't outflank and an infiltrating Scorpions unit is just asking to get shot to hell. Ask yourself this, what is this unit trying to accomplish? You have a unit that can put out 36 S4 attacks on the charge, but in todays environment you are likely hitting a T4 3+ target and if you don't kill the unit your T3 isn't going to last long in return. At 212 points you have to ask yourself is there an more effective way of doing their role.


Removing holofields - will result in them being dead before you know what hit ya. I won't going into that one is depth because that is beat a dead horse. Do. Not. Ever. Not. Have. Holos. (Prisms and Falcons, Nightspinner is sometimes optional)

Bladestorm DA - Without doom/guide this unit will not be effective for it's points.

PS/SS DA - You are paying 177pts for a S3 T3 unit with 1 base attack and only the leader has a PW with 2 base attacks. Don't get me wrong, Yriel is a badass in CC however the DA he is with will simply be a liability. A 4+/5++ is cool in CC, but it won't get you far thanks to the amount of wounds you'll take thanks to T3. Banshees + Yriel will get you a LOT more mileage.

Dragons - Won't go into the dead horse of Spirit Stones and Cannons, but I'll just say that stones are 10% of the vehicle's cost to negate a possible "what if" situation that has a mere 17% chance IF the vehicle gets damaged before they get to their target. The vehicle won't be moving full out forever and scatterlasers or tons more effective then S Cannons.


Walkers - Walkers are drastically ineffective for their squishiness and are even weaker without guide. You are paying 180pts for something that can be downed by bolter fire just to target one enemy in the rear. Back when things were slow they were a little better because an enemy had to commit hard to a flank, but now things can spread out more and the walkers will be caught and destroyed after they fire once.

Jetbikes - Put a farseer with Embolden with them or don't waste your time. That Ldr 8 will run off the board so fast your head will spin.

PS/S DA - Great with Yriel and a farseer dumping fortune on them.

Banshees + Yriel - Great with Doom.

DA will stand up longer but banshees will slaughter 1 enemy unit. Take your choice.

But the true bottomline is both options are a heck of a lot more powerful with a farseer.

BlueDagger wrote:I've done Autauch x2 several times and can 150% agree that while a 2+ is cool it is completely not worth the cost or loss of the ridiculousness that is the power of a farseer.

Rune of Warding single handled destroys the effectiveness about half the armies in the game and gives a GIANT finger to GK. Outside of that the farseer will turn that bladestorm unit from utter crap to pretty good.

Scorpions - Remember that an Autauch that is attached to a Scorpions unit can't outflank and an infiltrating Scorpions unit is just asking to get shot to hell. Ask yourself this, what is this unit trying to accomplish? You have a unit that can put out 36 S4 attacks on the charge, but in todays environment you are likely hitting a T4 3+ target and if you don't kill the unit your T3 isn't going to last long in return. At 212 points you have to ask yourself is there an more effective way of doing their role.


Removing holofields - will result in them being dead before you know what hit ya. I won't going into that one is depth because that is beat a dead horse. Do. Not. Ever. Not. Have. Holos. (Prisms and Falcons, Nightspinner is sometimes optional)

Bladestorm DA - Without doom/guide this unit will not be effective for it's points.

PS/SS DA - You are paying 177pts for a S3 T3 unit with 1 base attack and only the leader has a PW with 2 base attacks. Don't get me wrong, Yriel is a badass in CC however the DA he is with will simply be a liability. A 4+/5++ is cool in CC, but it won't get you far thanks to the amount of wounds you'll take thanks to T3. Banshees + Yriel will get you a LOT more mileage.

Dragons - Won't go into the dead horse of Spirit Stones and Cannons, but I'll just say that stones are 10% of the vehicle's cost to negate a possible "what if" situation that has a mere 17% chance IF the vehicle gets damaged before they get to their target. The vehicle won't be moving full out forever and scatterlasers or tons more effective then S Cannons.


Walkers - Walkers are drastically ineffective for their squishiness and are even weaker without guide. You are paying 180pts for something that can be downed by bolter fire just to target one enemy in the rear. Back when things were slow they were a little better because an enemy had to commit hard to a flank, but now things can spread out more and the walkers will be caught and destroyed after they fire once.

Jetbikes - Put a farseer with Embolden with them or don't waste your time. That Ldr 8 will run off the board so fast your head will spin.

thanks for the reply, so like you said a farseer will make this list better, have you ever run an all reserve list with only one autarch, I feel like giving up the other +1 really hampers the whole point of the list and increases the chance of you coming on in slow chunks to be slaughtered by the enemy. The scorpions I have found can kill MEQ anyday getting the charge and hitting any squad with 36 I5 attacks and 4 PF attacks hurts anything. The outflanking can be good for contesting back field objectives aswell and hitting dev. squads and the like.

Other question why I know guide makes War walkers much better I always find it hard to be able to out flank the walkers in a place I want them, yet have the farseer close enough to cast guide. (can you cast guide the turn they come on? I thought you cast powers then move reserves on.) so if I were to bring a farseer with both runes and stones what two powers should I bring (Doom, Fortune) for Yriel's squad or (Doom, Guide) for the walkers?

I play a more spam twin autarch list. I figure that you need as much fire power out there as possible since you don't have farseers to buff your squads.

I would switch the Striking Scorpions for:
10 Banshees 187 (put yriel here)
Exarch w/ executioner & acrobatic

And give them a wave serpent with star engines and SS by dropping the GJB squad and holofields on the fire prisms. This squad has done extraordinary for me.

After that, I would as many 5 man DA squads in Wave Serpents with Scatter lasers and SS in the list as you can fit.

Hope this helps, I've never had much luck with 2 autarch lists though

In an army like this with the dire avengers I would take the doom and guide combo. The guide would also help the war walkers.