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I wanted to discuss something, it may be in fact the future of the Inquisition instead.
Lynata mentioned in "inquisition orders" topic that Grey Knight codex said that "Grey Knights act as a chamber militant for entire Inquisition". ( page 7 of the Grey Knight codex ).
Same is in new SoB White Dwarf update, there is no mention of Inquisition at all ( but they are represented as "army of the Ecclisiarchy", page 1 of White Dwarf update, and when they are not is service of Imperial Church they train or worship ).

Does that mean that they are rewriting the Inquisition? SoB became their own army, and Grey Knights are represented as the militant arm of the Inquisition ( there is no mention of Ordo Melleus, so they probably mean the whole organization ).

Does that mean that they are reorganizing the Inquisition, and how will that effect the remaining third party: the Deathwatch?
Why are they doing this? I see nothing wrong with Daemonhunters, Xenohunters and Witchhunters.

The SoB were their own before, the WH piggybacking on them was only in the previous codex. If anything they've just reverted to how they were.

Likely the GK had this change in mind and is so super special awesome it is no restricted to just one arm of the Inquisition.

I had the same thoughts pretty much.

Most likely they are moving towards a single Inquisition codex, covering all three branches. The Grey Knights are too few in number to be called on by all three branches...

The only logical build up to this is introducing a full, proper Inquisition army or bringing back the Allies rules.

Aye, it does seem to be a design change. As for the why's ... hard to guess. Maybe the guys at the studio feel the Inquisition became too important for the game as a whole?
I do remember rumours that the "Chamber Militant" idea was only cooked up back then as a means to hype their "Inquisitor" RPG they have released at about the same time. No idea whether this is true or just yet another bit of internet hearsay, of course, but I did notice this line in the PDFs the studio still offers on their website:

"When we were first discussing ideas to include in the sample characters for Inquisitor, the Grey Knight was the most obvious choice for a Space Marine character. It was partly for this reason that we decided to introduce something new instead, in the form of the Xenos Deathwatch."
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1320038_Using_Space_Marines.pdf

So whilst the Grey Knights have existed before, at least the Deathwatch was at least partially cooked up specifically for this relationship as something GW did for an RPG they no longer actively support.

As for the fate of the Deathwatch - like in the other threads I will point out that this organization is, as far as I'm aware, not mentioned at all in any 5th Edition material. It does not show up in the Space Marine Codex, where the Grey Knights are mentioned, and it does not show up in the "Defenders of the Imperium" list of the Core Rulebook, that lists (amongst others) the Grey Knights and the SoB. So possibly the DW Kill Teams are being "squatted" by not being mentioned anymore?

Whilst I do not mourn the apparent loss of an official connection between the Ordo Hereticus and the SoB, I will say that I did like the idea of the Deathwatch as being the Ordo Xenos' Chamber Militant. They offered what seems to have been a very efficient resource for OX Inquisitors and even one of the few (or the only?) angles for mixed teams consisting of both Astartes as well as normal humans (notably without the latter having to be Inquisitors).
It will certainly be interesting what future studio material will contain in this direction.

Mr Hyena wrote:The Grey Knights are too few in number to be called on by all three branches...

But that's what is being done as per the new GK Codex.

One should probably have to keep in mind that an Inquisitor can always requisition normal Space Marines, Sisters, AdMech and Imperial Guard support in addition to the Grey Knights (or instead of, if they are unavailable) if he so wishes. They do not have to be an officially sanctioned Chamber Militant to do so.

Maybe the guys at the studio feel the Inquisition became too important for the game as a whole?

It doesn't come anywhere near as close to how important they are for the fiction though.

Mr Hyena wrote:

Maybe the guys at the studio feel the Inquisition became too important for the game as a whole?

It doesn't come anywhere near as close to how important they are for the fiction though.

They are the hands of the Emperor after all. There should only be Codex: Inquistion + requisitions

But that's what is being done as per the new GK Codex.

One should probably have to keep in mind that an Inquisitor can always requisition normal Space Marines, Sisters, AdMech and Imperial Guard support in addition to the Grey Knights (or instead of, if they are unavailable) if he so wishes. They do not have to be an officially sanctioned Chamber Militant to do so.

Which is why Codex: Inquisition needs to be made. Give it Inquisition, Assassins, SM/IG/GK and other Imperial tools.

Mr Hyena wrote:Which is why Codex: Inquisition needs to be made. Give it Inquisition, Assassins, SM/IG/GK and other Imperial tools.

Indeed. That's what I think should have been a WD Minidex.

Though don't get me wrong, there certainly is enough background for a full book as well, but we all know how busy GW is with writing other codices - and considering the low count of "unique" units (mostly HQ and Elite, I guess) it would seem appropriate. Slap on proper Ally rules and you're done. Distribution via WD (and later website PDF) may even end up having more players using them than if you'd sell it as a full Codex.

I agree it would work much better as a minidex with the option to be stand alone or inserted into existing IoM forces rather than a full blown codex.

Brother Coa wrote:SoB became their own army

I know you dont' like paying attention, but as many times as this topic has come up I would think that you would have realized by now that sisters were ALWAYS their own army, even way back in Rogue Trader.

Melissia wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:SoB became their own army

I know you dont' like paying attention, but as many times as this topic has come up I would think that you would have realized by now that sisters were ALWAYS their own army, even way back in Rogue Trader.

Except when they were Witchunters and worked closely with the Ordo Hereticus. Same as Grey Knights were Daemonhunters and worked closely with Ordo Malleus.
For me that is being part of that organisation.

Brother Coa wrote:Except when they were Witchunters and worked closely with the Ordo Hereticus. Same as Grey Knights were

Again....

Melissia wrote:I know you dont' like paying attention but[...]

They were always stated to be the army of the Ecclesiarchy. EVEN IN C:WH this was so. They worked alongside the Inquisition because they share similar interests. By your definition the Space Marines are part of the Imperial Guard because they occasionally work together.

Yeh it was more of two allied forces than them belonging entirely to the Ordo Hereticus and being completely under their power.

Melissia wrote:By your definition the Space Marines are part of the Imperial Guard because they occasionally work together.

Space Marines were never "militant arm" of the imperial Gaurd, and run to help them when they ask.
But I see your point.

When the Inquisition asks, everyone is obligated to run to help them - be them Grey Knights, Sisters, Space Marines, Mechanicus or Imperial Guard.

In case of the connection between Ordo Hereticus and Sisters of Battle, the "Chamber Militant" thing thus seemed to be a little redundant. Unlike the Grey Knights or the Deathwatch, the Sisters were never "owned" by the Inquisition, merely called upon with a certain regularity. Perhaps the Convocation of Nephilim was thus a mere formality, perhaps it served to improve communication and co-operation in times when they are not already in direct employ of some Inquisitor (sharing reports and secrets?), or perhaps the Ordo Hereticus merely wanted to make sure that they alone could "reserve" the right to call upon the Sisters Militant, thus attempting to bar them from answering to the Ordos Malleus and Xenos (obviously any Inquisitor could still attempt to do so, but this might trigger internal conflict).

*shrugs*

Sometimes I wish we could chat with the writers directly to have them explain how they see this stuff. What I do know is that the Sisters were always meant to be kept separate, though - the Design Notes on the WH Codex specifically mention this bit, as the people working on that book wished to have it not contradict anything that has previously been published by GW on the Sororitas, basically re-validating all their fluff right back to their first appearance in the original Rogue Trader rulebook (which was mentioned there as well).

Hope it's not the direction GW takes, it's really stupid to have a small/elite specialist daemon-hunting unit also expected to take down Heretical Cults, assassinate Ethereals, or purge rogue Ecclesiarchy Priests. The Inquisition is a vast organization and should have better official resources to call upon. Yes, I'm aware that Inquisitors can mobilize Guardsmen and what not regularly but it is not the same as a Order Militant.

I think a glimmer of hope though is the Deathwatch. A fairly well-known Space Marine force of which books have been written. I doubt GW would just throw them away and pretend they never existed, especially since they're space marines.

Harriticus wrote:Hope it's not the direction GW takes, it's really stupid to have a small/elite specialist daemon-hunting unit also expected to take down Heretical Cults, assassinate Ethereals, or purge rogue Ecclesiarchy Priests. The Inquisition is a vast organization and should have better official resources to call upon. Yes, I'm aware that Inquisitors can mobilize Guardsmen and what not regularly but it is not the same as a Order Militant.

For the purposes of the Imperium, it's probably better to have the Inquisition be able to demand the obedience of nearly everyone, but only have the loyalty of a relatively small number of assets. It fits in a bit better with the whole philosophy of distributing power to prevent another HH from happening. Added bonus is that you get to have conflicts of interest and resentment between Inquisitors and those they command.