Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Well it's been years (literally) since I last posted on Dakka. feels good to be back. After playing nothing except Tyranids for 7 years I have finally finished a Space Wolf army and it will be getting it's first outing at the end of February when my local gaming club has one of their regular 'lock ins' (gaming all day from 11am, then the doors to the public close at 6pm, over 18's only and beer/pizza ordered through the night until 1am when it's chucking out time).

Having played Nids for so long I thought it would make a nice change to use an army that actually gets an armour save most ot the time and doesn't take 1 hour for the first two turns just to do my movement phase (I play horde Nids)! The list that follows is just for fun and for the character of the Space Wolves, altough I do not want to get thrashed so some advice would be appreciated, however don't go overboard. I wont be entering the Throne of Skulls with this.

HQ
Svartur - Wolf Priest. Plasma pistol, jump pack, wolf tooth necklace and wolf tail talisman.

Hrfan - Rune Priest. Plasma pistol, wolf tooth necklace.

Canis Wolfborn.

Troops
10 Grey Hunters - 2 x Plasma guns, Rhino with extra armour.

10 Grey Hunters - 2 x Plasma guns, Rhino with extra armour.

Elites
Gamli - Dreadnought. 2 x Twin linked autocannons.

7 Wolf Guard - 2 x Terminator armour, one with assault cannon and power fist, the second with storm bolter and chain fist (Baldur and Hallbjorn the two brothers). Remaining Wolf Guard all have storm bolters and power weapons. Drop Pod. Lead by the Rune Priest.

Fast Attack
10 Skyclaws - Power fist. Lead by the Wolf Priest.

Heavy Support
Vindicator - Siege shield and extra armour.

6 Long Fangs - 1 Squad leader with boltgun and 5 x Missile launchers.

6 Long Fangs - 1 Squad leader with boltgun and 5 x Heavy bolters.

1998 pts.

Tactics wise the long fangs and dreadnought will find somewhere nice to castle themselves and secure a flank with vast amounts of firepower, splitting their fire as and when required. I had considered using a termie Wolf guard with cyclone missile launcher to lead the missile launcher long fangs (7 missiles a turn was very appealing ), but in the end I decided that the assault cannon Wolf Guard in the drop pod would be more effective.
The Grey hunters will start in the Rhinos and form a spear, or wedge, with the Vindicator at the point and charge forward into the heart of the enemy. Canis will be inside the wedge for cover and keep pace with them. At the last second the tanks will peel, allowing Canis to charge headlong into the enemie's ranks. By this time the assault squad should have arrived and be hitting the flank of whatever unit Canis has assaulted to back him up. The wolf priest will give the skyclaws preferred enemy (I predict specifiying 'infantry' every game) which will help them hit harder. The rune pries lead Wolf Guard in the drop pod will arrive behind the enemy and their storm bolters/a.cannon will ensure that they can pack a helluva punch the turn they arrive (jaws of the world wolf from the priest as well) and then they can also assault the following turn. Giving them power weapons will mean they wont have as many attacks as they could have, but I've gone for hitting hard, rather than hitting lots.
Grey Hunters will capture objectives/provide fire support as a primary role, but given the fact that they have a bolter plus two close combat weapons they can always leap into combat as well.

So, what does everyone think?

I love the wolves. I haven't personally played them (take that into consideration) but my brother only plays Wolves so I've had experience around them.

I really like your idea of hitting hard instead of hitting a lot.

It seems odd that you brought Canis but no Fenrisian Wolves. I may be wrong, but I think a full squad is only 120 points, with ld8 ini5 from Canis they would be great for adding extra bodies and they move fast. Even though they don't "hit hard" they'll hit before the enemy most often.

My personal experience with plasma weaponry is that I love it on cheaper models (Regular MEQs) and I hate bringing it on my expensive/leader models. Only because I always kick myself when it misfires in the exact situation I needed it for sometimes turning the fight from "even-matched" to "I'm praying to the dice gods".

Your wolfguard squad is amazing scary, but it will be hindered by the Wolf Guards in termie armor just because slow and purposeful. I imagine that would make it more difficult for all those power weapons to get into assault. I also love PW wolf guard (It's cheap!!!) but imo the Wolf-priest would be better off with this unit, WS4 rerolling PWs. That's hard hitting.

The Lone jump-packing squad seems very vulnerable at this point size, considering everything else except the long fangs (long long distance) is mounted up (I imagine they're going to hold out behind the tank wedge until the opportune moment?) Also you're spending a lot of points for a WS3 PF that you said is mostly going to have reroll against infantry. I personally always love the PF for instant kills on enemy HQs (they always have high WS) or to save your unit from getting stuck in combat with walkers both of which it seems he'd have trouble hitting.

The same goes with the Vindicator, it just seems very vulnerable all by it's lonesome in a 2000pt list, it's the only 11+ armor besides the dreadnaught, So a good player will focus fire down that vindicator pretty fast since you'll be running it right at them.

The list looks like a lot of fun, but it appears very versatile (not a lot of MEQ, not a lot of armor) sometimes that can get you easily whittled down in 2000pt games. I'm just commenting on your list trying to help.

I'd drop the Wolf Tooth Necklaces. These aren't our Rune/Wolf Priests of old. They already have WS5 though so you are hitting 99% of infantry models on a 3+ already. Without I5, they aren't going toe to toe with any characters . Well, maybe the Wolf Priest can with his 4++ but you don't have Eternal Warrior and only have 2 Wounds so against most that you would need it for its moot anyways.

I'd also drop the Plasma Pistol on the Rune Priest. Almost every one of your psychic powers is a shooting attack that is better than the Plasma Pistol. Its workable on the Wolf Priest though. A Chooser of the Slain would be nice as well. Infiltrators could ruin your day with a list like this.

I'd also consider making your own Thunderwolf mounted HQ. Either a Wolf Lord or a WGBL. The reason being, Canis has no Invulnerable save.

Take Wolf Standards on your Grey Hunters. Even without special close combat weapons its worth it, but doubly so when you take some.

For the Wolf Guard, if it were me I'd want to mix in Bolt Pistols with the Storm Bolters. No sense losing an attack in close combat in my eyes. Could take Wolf Claws, Thunder Hammers, and Storm Shields on the ones with Storm Bolters. Maybe a Combi-Weapon for the other terminator instead of a Storm Bolter.

For the Skyclaws I'd rather take Power Weapon and Mark of the Wulfen myself. Just give Meltabombs to the Wolf Priest, but then I've really started to hate Power Fists now that I can't take 2-3 in a squad.

I think your Vindicator needs Extra Armor as well. To be honest, its probably going to get blown up since Demolisher cannons terrify everyone. But if its not, you really don't want your plan stalled for a turn cause of a Crew Shaken result.


I think you made a smart move with the Assault Cannon. I've tried both that and a CML and every time the CML disappoints me, especially when its with Long Fangs. The AC has done sooo much better for me. I'm also glad to see that you understand that taking a Wolf Priest doesn't compensate for WS3! Pet peeve of mine, hate seeing that 'argument'.

For 2000 points you are a bit light on troops. You typically see 3-4 Grey Hunter packs at 1750. And they tend to be kitted out better. But since you are taking 3 HQs its no wonder you have less so just remember what you are sacrificing: staying power for killing power. If you can't get to grips with the enemy quickly and cause a lot of damage, you aren't going to do so hot.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Koski wrote:
It seems odd that you brought Canis but no Fenrisian Wolves. I may be wrong, but I think a full squad is only 120 points, with ld8 ini5 from Canis they would be great for adding extra bodies and they move fast. Even though they don't "hit hard" they'll hit before the enemy most often.

I totally overlooked that. That would be pretty mean to do!

Koski wrote:
Your wolfguard squad is amazing scary, but it will be hindered by the Wolf Guards in termie armor just because slow and purposeful. I imagine that would make it more difficult for all those power weapons to get into assault. I also love PW wolf guard (It's cheap!!!) but imo the Wolf-priest would be better off with this unit, WS4 rerolling PWs. That's hard hitting.

Terminators aren't Slow and Purposeful, that's Meganobs. Terminators are Relentless and can't Sweeping Advance.

Good point about the Wolf Priest, but consider: 10 Skyclaws have 40 attacks on the charge and need a character otherwise they'll charge things you don't want. 7 Wolf Guard have 21-28 attacks but all with power weapons. If anything, I'd want to take two Wolf Priests if you could find 100 points. Probably half way there if you drop 1 Wolf Guard, which you need to do to fit him anyways.

Terminators aren't Slow and Purposeful

Ohhh that's right by bad!! Disregard my comment on the terminators, I forgot the rules obviously.

To be honest, I'd drop Canis altogether.

Reasons are:
1) You're not taking any Thunderwolf Cav. (which you'd want to soak wounds since he doesn't have an Inv. save)
2) No Fenrisan wolves to run with him either.

With the points saved from him, you could add a 3rd unit of Grey Hunters, which I agree with cowmonaut you're light on at 2k points.

You're also light an anti-tank weapons as well. You have only a handful of Str. 8 weapons, 5 Missile Launchers and 3 Powerfists in the list. The Heavy Bolters look nice, but you'd get more bang for your buck by (in their current number) going for 3 Missile Launchers, 1 Plasma-Cannon & 1 Lascannon.

And this recommendation isn't even really tournament driven, but you lack consistent anti-tank weapons. You have 1 thing that can penetrate an AV14 vehicle. And at 2k points that's not advisable, since you'll definitely start to see 2-3 AV14 vehicles in other armies at this level depending on what other armies you play against. And any player friendly or competitive is going to hit that Vindicator hard first turn to save his AV14 stuff from any penetrating shots. I know I would. The Plasma-cannon is for taking out heavy elite infantry (ie. Grey Knight Termies) it can wreck them when it hits 2-3 of them at once.

I'd take 1 Metlagun in place of 2 Plasmaguns in the GH's and the aforementioned change to the LF's.

Anywho, just my thoughts. Hope the event is fun.

edit: for missing ideas

Cheers for the advice guys. Just for the record, the Vindicator does have extra armour, I just forgot when I posted the list earlier.

I see what you guys are saying about Canis, but he was the first model I bought for the army. I just couldn't resist starting a Space Wolf army and not having the guy riding the giant wolf . I had a varient list where he was a normal wolf lord with war gear and a Thunder Wolf mount, but he was a lot more expensive than Canis. I may well swap him out in the future, but for now I'm hoping the tank formation will keep him protected until he can close with the enemy.
I may adjust some points though and swap a couple of missile launchers for lascannons in one of the devestator squads. Being able to split their fire will allow the lascannons to choose seperate targets to the missile launchers.
Will definately be keeping the heavy bolters though. My experience of 40K is that ideally you should have 85% anti-infantry to 15% anti-tank (there's a lot of Ork and Imp Guard players here in Aberdeen). Plus even in 2000 points most (non-cheesy) armies will not have many AV14 vehicles. But I don't get to game often nowadays, so I might be in for a shock in a couple of weeks!
I was also going to have each Grey Hunter squad have two melta-guns each originally, but damned if I wasn't just a little hacked off when I bought my first wolf pack box and saw every weapon option I wanted, except the melta So not having much money I stuck with what GW gave me and gave each squad plasma guns. Lets hope they don't blow themselves up!

I do agree though that I am light on Troops choices, but I really wanted to utilise the fact that Space Wolves can have more HQ choices then anyone else (originally I had four HQ choices before I persuaded myself to lower it to three). I think I have some spare bits to make a few more marines, so might drop a character and try to include another Grey Hunter squad, just for objective claiming support. Might be tricky though, as after 7 years of nothing but Nids my bits box is predominantly claws and chitin.

Thanks for the comments though. Always good to hear other perspectives.

Well I've taken some of the observations made on board and changed the army up a bit, just to give it a bit more flexibility. Canis has been dropped (although it was hard to come to terms with since he is a georgous model and to date my best paint job, so I really wanted him on the table) as I did realise that while he is a powerhouse, there is not really another unit that can support him effectively out of the models I have. This freed up some points to play with.

HQ
Svartur, Wolf Priest - Jump pack, Saga of the Warrior Born - 165

Hrafn, Rune Priest - Rune Armour, Chooser of the Slain, storm bolter - 133

Troops
9 Grey Hunters - Plasma gun, Rhino with extra armour - 195

9 Grey Hunters - Plasma gun, Rhino with extra armour - 195

5 Grey Hunters - Plasma gun - 85

Elites

Gamli, Dreadnought - 2 Twin linked autocannons - 125

The Einherjar, 10 Wolf Guard - 477
Hallbjorn - Terminator armour, chain fist.
Baldur - Terminator armour, assault cannon, power fist.
Geir - Storm bolter, power weapon.
Jokul - Storm bolter, power weapon.
Bjartur - Storm bolter, power weapon.
Eyvindur - Storm bolter, power weapon.
Brandr - Strom bolter, power weapon.
Drop pod (Lead by Rune Priest)
Ulfr - Frost axe (Pack leader for 9 Grey Hunters)
Styrr - Frost blade (Pack leader for 9 Grey Hunters)
Vigharthur - Terminator armour, cyclone missile launcher (Pack leader for missile/lascannon Long Fangs)

Fast Attack
9 Skyclaws - Power fist, Mark of the Wulfen - 205

Heavy Support
Vindicator - Siege shield, extra armour - 135

6 Long Fangs - 3 x Missile launchers, 2 x Lascannons - 170

6 Long Fangs - 5 x Heavy bolters - 115

Total - 2000 pts.

Managed to get a couple of lascannons in for a little more anti-tank, but also the Wolf Guard with cyclone launcher for even more missiles. So that's one heavy weapons squad that can pump out two lascannon shots and five missiles a turn, with the ability to split fire! Obviously to fit in the cyclone launcher I needed to up the wolf guard to 10 models, so I dropped the second plasma gun from each Grey Hunter squad and gave them a Wolf Guard pack leader. Keeps each squad at 10 men, adds a nice Str 5 power weapon and gets rid of a second marine who (knowing my luck) will commit suicide when the plasma gun overheats. The small 'combat squad' sized Grey Hunter squad is really to provide some objective seizing capability. While the rest of the army is very aggressive this small squad will hang back with the long fangs/dreadnought and hold an objective, or advance behind the main line to capture a forward objective.
The Skyclaws will take the place of Canis in the spear formation, protected by the tanks, able to keep pace and at the last minute they can jump over the tanks to assault.

I would swap out the plasma guns for melta guns in the GH packs, remember there not an assault weapon there rapid fire. Also take the wolf standard, it might not seem like much to re-roll 1's but remember it's ALL 1's in assault, rolling to hit, to wound, armor saves for just 10 points its dam good.

Throw in another pack of GH too, in a objectice game you will really strugle with only 3 troops.

Ditch the extra armor on the rhinos, that 30 points can be spent better somewere else (like 3 wolf standards) I find that rhinos don't last lone enough to gain from extra armor anyway.

The wolf guard pack is a nice shock troop but I would get rid of the last guy attached to the long fangs all together and upgrade the PA WG to wolf claws, re-rolls to hit or wound are great. Maybe swap 2 of the storm bolters for combi meltas for a bit of extra anti-armor to.

I have had some really good games with the sky claws but they need suport from the rest of the army. Yeah +2 attacks and the re-roll's from the Wolf Priest is great but they will get targeted for that reason. Also remember they only have a WS3 fo the next round of assualt they will get hit a lot.

Have you thought about scouts? For 85 points you get 5 guys with a melta gun and krak grenades that can come in behind your enemy, or sometimes they arrive late and do nothing . I have seen people change there whole deployment just cos I told them about the scouts.

The first pack of longfans is ok, you really need those las cannons but if you want to take another pack of them make it missile launchers insted. You have krak for armor and frag for troops and better range.


Well I think I have gone on enough....

Overall you have to play and built the army to how YOU play.

I play Wolves and I have no long fangs at all in my army cos I don't like that there heavy weapons so I have a lot of combi meltas in my army to make up for them.

No long fangs? Man, I couldn't do that. I love devestators/long fangs, much prefer them to tanks. Also the story behind my army is that they are from Gunnar Redmoon's Great Company and he favours veterans over all other warriors. So the long fangs and Wolf Guard are a must. I would have more troops if I could, but the list above uses all my available models, so I'm restrained at that. Don't want to split the large squads down to make more troop choices as I want them to be strong units. Can't tell you the trouble I've had trying to wipe out my mate's Ultramrine army when each troop choice he had is 10 marines strong. Unless you're using very specialist elite units you forget just how tough it is to wipe out 10 marines. And Grey Hunters are even harder! Plus only 1 third of games will be lots of objectives, while the majority will only have two or it will be kill points.

Will get a few games in and then report back how it fared .

I can report that the army list worked really well last night at the gaming lock in. Got three games and won two out of three.

The first game was a victory was against Grey Knights. It was Annihilation and I won 7 - 2. No Dreadknights or heavy tanks. Just Rhinos, Razorbacks, and three Dreadnoughts, then lots of Grey Knight marines. No termies though, my opponent said he just didn't like the models. It was a good game and we both had a lot of fun, although if I'm honest my Space Wolves were in control of the game right from the get go. Wasn't massively one sided in my favour, but I seemed to have the Grey Knights on the back foot all the time. They were never acting, only reacting and I kept the pressure up to stop them getting a chance to recover themselves.

The second battle was against a massively (and I can't state this enough), massively crisis suit heavy Tau army. Six broadsides, nine crisis suits and about six stealth suits with ten drones attached. His only toops were a teeny squad of Fire Warriors and 10 Kroot. It was one objective each, but bleedin' Dawn of War setup, which I'm not a fan of. Normally every time I play and we roll that result me and my friends always want to re-roll. As it was though I made a brave stab at trying to take his objective and hold my own, but sooooooooo much shooting!!!!! And marker lights are just scary. Karma must have been active, because after the glorious slaughter I wrought in the first game, all I had left at the end of game two was two Long fangs and three Grey Hunters. But if you say the result was 1-0 to him it doesn't sound like I got spanked quite so badly . My opponent was very sporting and a good laugh so it was still a lot of fun.

Third game was against Eldar and again it was a glorius victory for the Space Wolves. In fact my opponent conceded by the end of turn 4. It was one objective each again and he just couldn't get near my objective, protected as it was by the two Long Fang squads and the Dreadnought, with the wee 5 man Grey Hunter squad holding it. Meanwhile the 'spear' of my army just smashed straight into his lines and caused so much damage in turn two it was hard for him to recover (the vindicator wipped out 10 Harliquins with one shot!). The main highlights were the Rune Priest removing the Wraithlord from play with Jaws of the World Wolf and a tragic scatter shot for my opponent, when his Fire Prism's blast scattered off my Grey Hunters and onto his 7 Fire Dragons who had just arrived and disembarked from a Wave Serpent. Only one survived...until a Long Fang shot him in the head . His Avatar also missed with his 'melta-sword' twice, failed a charge when he only needed to roll a three or more on two dice and then was quickly dispatched by the lascannon/missile launcher Long Fangs. When my friend conceded the game it was 1-0 to me.

So overall I am very pleased with the army and the way it works. The 'spear' tactic works really well and the Long Fangs and Dreadnought can hold a flank and protect my rear lines exceptionally well. I will be making some changes though. I'm going to ditch the two lascannons from the Long Fang squad and revert them back to all missile launchers. The lascannons were nice, but I didn't feel the extra 30 pionts for the squad made any real difference and the missiles do have more versitility re: anti-tank and anti-troop ammo. I'm also going to take the power fist out of the Skyclaws squad and swap it for a power weapon. Because I will pretty much always be giving them infantry preferred enemy, thanks to the Wolf Priest, they are never going to be attacking things that are really going to need a power fist to kill. Elite infantry would squish nice with it, but a power weapon ignores armour aswell and gives that Skyclaw his full attacks.
With the pionts left over I am going to give the Wolf Guard pack leaders of the Grey Hunter squads power fists. Gives them a little extra punch since they don't have meltas and also because in my first game last night they got stuck in combat with a Venerable Dreadnought and the krak grenades just didn't cut the mustard.
A special mention must be made for Baldur, the assault cannon weilding Wolf Guard. In the first two games the Rune Priest and the rest of the Wolf Guard got wiped out by turn two, but Baldur not only lived much longer, but raked up a large amount of kills. He almost single handedly caused the Grey Knight left flank to crumble in the first game and in the second game he withstood a horrific amount of firepower for three turns, even managing to make three 5+ saves at one point to battle on, before finally being laid low by a railgun. Three games and already he has one hell of a saga to his name. Definately a future Wolf Lord in the making .