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So, I'm making a nid list for a friend, and I've got some great anti-infantry stuff, with my army using 1 HQ, some troops and all fast attack slots. Basically, I need some anti-tank stuff, and with a fast-moving army. Seeing as most people dislike carnifexes and I dislike Zoanthropes, this leaves me a choice of Trygons (probably prime as I could do with more synapse) or the Tyrannofex with a rupture cannon. What do you guys think?

I just played a 1750 tourney yesterday that had a prime, a normal, and a tyrannofex. the field was x3 DE x2 Eldar x1 Necron x1 Guard x1 Tau and x9 various marines. I played against DE, Guard, Eldar, and Loyalists. I won against Eldar and loyalists. In the games I won the Tyrannofex was very relavent against land raiders and fire prisms. In the games I lost I think the str 5 electricity killed the most venoms and raiders.

I run Tyranids as a "one of" army really. I feel trygons are great against rear armor deepstrike shooting and if they live then just chomping on hulls. the tyrannofex is obviously the long range anti tank with a 2+ armor that comes into play alot more than you would think. he is very resilient. Most of my armies include x1 Unit of 3 Hive Guard, x1 Tyrannofex, x1 Trygon Prime, because they are very good quality wise and I enjoy those units. I do have zoanthropes in pod if I feel the field will be heavy armor and more hive guard if needed. I think the best thing to go in a list with Nids is balance. They have specialized units like a tool box.

TLDR; 1 of each they serve different roles; x1 long range anti heavy armor and x1 rear armor deepstriker/bullet magnet/chomper

So should I have 2 of each and be prepared to swap or what? I would probably need other stuff to defend a tyrannofex, but I don't want to take this unless necessary. Also, I don't particularly want to spend more money than is needed. What should I do?
Also, do you have a battle report for some of those battles? They sound interesting

Trygons work best in pairs with AG, or not at all. Single one is too much of a bullet magnet.

Tyrannofex I struggle on spending 265 points on WS3 with no ability to re-roll. Has a a tendency to fail when you need it most.

Nothing wrong with carnifexes either. Run them as TL devourers like a rifleman dread or tool them for CC and stick them in a spore.

The Tyrannofex is very point heavy for a big gun that will miss half of the time.

I've found Mawlocs a good option for anti-tank. That's if you don't mind deep-striking. Walk on 2 Mawlocs turn 1 and burrow them to get across the field quick. When they come up see if you can place their marker so that it pushes a tank onto terrain. Said tank would be automatically destroyed if it was pushed onto impassible terrain, another unit (that wasn't moved for the Mawloc), or something like that.

›Mad wrote:The Tyrannofex is very point heavy for a big gun that will miss half of the time.

Why do people say this? It's two shots. So it will miss 25% of the time, and it will hit both 25% of the time. Half the time, it will hit once. It has better permutations then a BS 3 twinlinked or a BS 4 one shot.

Also, T-Fex is much much more then just a rupture cannon. It can fire three weapons at once, which is cool cause like, its the only unit in the game that can move and do so (well I guess ravagers, maybe a few others, point is it's rare and all the others are vehicles).

ShadarLogoth wrote:

›Mad wrote:The Tyrannofex is very point heavy for a big gun that will miss half of the time.

Why do people say this? It's two shots. So it will miss 25% of the time, and it will hit both 25% of the time. Half the time, it will hit once. It has better permutations then a BS 3 twinlinked or a BS 4 one shot.

Also, T-Fex is much much more then just a rupture cannon. It can fire three weapons at once, which is cool cause like, its the only unit in the game that can move and do so (well I guess ravagers, maybe a few others, point is it's rare and all the others are vehicles).

... it's not much more than a rupture cannon though, as any other weapon it fires will have to be at the same target as the rupture cannon. RC is a long range anti-tank weapon while the other 2 weapons are short range anti-infantry, so there is no real synergy there. Shorter range weapons are really defensive ones in case something gets close enough for CC - but then you aren't shooting the RC for a turn.

Still think that 265 points is a lot for a BS 3 weapon. Even if 1 shot hits 50% of the time, you very rarely ever blow up anything with a single shot (about 5% per shot I think for a landraider assuming no cover). You therefore can't rely on the TFex to kill anything in one turn, whereas say 2-3 hive guard will much more reliably take out their target for less cost. You therefore have to divert other shooting into the same target as the TFex unless you're extraordinarily lucky. I think it's more reliable in CC as at least it gets 4 attacks on the charge, rather than the 2 ranged shots and if you're going CC then trygons are much better.

It's slightly cheaper and works better with the fleshborer hive if you are wanting to get utility out of it's 3 weapons.

I played a game against tyranids with a tau player and he had two mawlocs but they didn't cause problems as they didn't come in on the same turn and so they didn't do anything.

... it's not much more than a rupture cannon though, as any other weapon it fires will have to be at the same target as the rupture cannon. RC is a long range anti-tank weapon while the other 2 weapons are short range anti-infantry, so there is no real synergy there. Shorter range weapons are really defensive ones in case something gets close enough for CC - but then you aren't shooting the RC for a turn.

Still think that 265 points is a lot for a BS 3 weapon. Even if 1 shot hits 50% of the time, you very rarely ever blow up anything with a single shot (about 5% per shot I think for a landraider assuming no cover). You therefore can't rely on the TFex to kill anything in one turn, whereas say 2-3 hive guard will much more reliably take out their target for less cost. You therefore have to divert other shooting into the same target as the TFex unless you're extraordinarily lucky. I think it's more reliable in CC as at least it gets 4 attacks on the charge, rather than the 2 ranged shots and if you're going CC then trygons are much better.

It's slightly cheaper and works better with the fleshborer hive if you are wanting to get utility out of it's 3 weapons.

That's exactly the wrong way to use the T-Fex, and why many rate the big guy so poorly.

To use the parlance of another poster, he's a nose tackle. Dive him right at the heart of the enemy. The RC is just something for him to be doing on his way up the field. You can do infinitely more damage with the Pie Plate/Template weapons. By turn 3, he should either be in the middle getting jiggy with your opponent or dead, in which case he ate a health supply of fire power on his way.

Also, if you want to make him dedicated anti Xport, you can give him the 5/4 4 shot and the rending template. Particularly against DEldar this config can be pretty monstrous.

Ive had alot more success than Ruminator with my T-fexes and Primes than he im guessing.

Primes can Run solo in game up to 2500 points. Sure getting two increases saturation, but i'd rather get one and something else scary, imho it provides the same saturation while increasing your options.

In about 15-20 games of use, I've rarely seen my Trygon killed in 1 turn of shooting, maybe twice.

It could be the way i use it, I almost always reserve it, and it typically pops in behind vehicles or by isolated units, I think anyone who tries to use a Trygon for frontline combat is suicidal as stat wise, it can make short work of any vehicle or shooty unit, but i think decent dedicated Assault units are not targets for Trygons, AKA if you are using it to kill TH/SS Termies, your doing it wrong.

Actually, Tyrannofexes can only fire 2 guns per turn, unless I'm completely mistaken.

Andilus Greatsword wrote:Actually, Tyrannofexes can only fire 2 guns per turn, unless I'm completely mistaken.

The thorax weapon can be fired in addition to the other two (Hiveys can do this too, but no one ever takes Thorax on a Hivey).

Thanks for all the advice.
I'm thinking of running 2 T-fexes behind the bulk of my army then letting them get stuck in later in the game, but this would only leave me 1 spot for a trygon prime: should I do 3 T-fexes, 2 and a trygon, 2 trygons and a T-fex, or 3 trygons?

Also, what thorax weapon should I take for the T-fexes?

Andilus Greatsword wrote:Actually, Tyrannofexes can only fire 2 guns per turn, unless I'm completely mistaken.

Monsterous creatures can fire all of their weapons

Dracoknight wrote:

Andilus Greatsword wrote:Actually, Tyrannofexes can only fire 2 guns per turn, unless I'm completely mistaken.

Monsterous creatures can fire all of their weapons

No. They can fire two weapons as previously stated.
Thorax Swarm can be fired in addition to these two due to its special rules. This is all clearly spelled out within the entry on p82 of the codex.

I have a feeling we're getting new Hiveys with our new T-Fex and been brewing up a list with maximum Shooty and thorax weapons for funsies.

Something like:

HT HVC, Brainleach, Thorax
HT HVC, Brainleach, Thorax
Venomthropes
T-Fex RC
T-Fex RC
T-Fex RC
Termagaunts
Tervigon Onslaught
Termagaunts
Tervigon Onslaught
Termagaunts
Tervigon Onslaught

Still tweaking points but sounds like a fun army to put together. Kinda like the idea of them lumbering down the field together running and shooting.