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Has anyone here had any luck playing Necrons vs a CSM Lash list? My opponent generally brings a couple units with Lash, and 2 units of 6 oblits. For support he'll have bikes or landraiders or demon princes, plague marines - generally something pretty tough.

Last game I had a 20 warrior unit with two HQ and two crypteks get vaporized in a single turn (27 hits). The HQ's made it, but everything else died. The game was a tie, but it was close.

Has anyone had any success against this kind of list and what did you bring?

In what form does he bring the lash? Sorcerers or DP? Generally you will want to shut off the lash, cause Oblits tend to soak a lot of fire before they die. From your post I take it that he brings the lash in form of chaos sorcs, which he will most likely hide in a unit. In such cases I have had success with tying the unit in close combat. Lychguard with VoD are a nice thing in such cases. If the lash unit shoots on them they will survive and even reflect shots. Even if the LG get lashed and templated they have great chances to keep standing. At the very least they will have soaked the fire that would have wasted your less durable units. And if he ignores them they will bind the unit in the next round.

Murenius wrote:In what form does he bring the lash? Sorcerers or DP? Generally you will want to shut off the lash, cause Oblits tend to soak a lot of fire before they die. From your post I take it that he brings the lash in form of chaos sorcs, which he will most likely hide in a unit. In such cases I have had success with tying the unit in close combat. Lychguard with VoD are a nice thing in such cases. If the lash unit shoots on them they will survive and even reflect shots. Even if the LG get lashed and templated they have great chances to keep standing. At the very least they will have soaked the fire that would have wasted your less durable units. And if he ignores them they will bind the unit in the next round.

Lately he's brought sorcerers, one in a rhino with a squad of marines and the other in a landraider with a squad of terminators. The problem with VoD and deepstriking is that the reason the oblits are so effective is bunching up. A unit that deepstrikes can't do anything except waste the turn with a run move to spread out.

I think I'd have a better chance sending the lych guard against the oblits which are usually in cover. I am definitely considering CC options. It would also be the last thing he would expect.

I use to play Necron vs CSM pretty often cause I own both armies and have a coworker play against me who has no own army.

In our last game my coworker (playing Necron) did something that might be an idea for you as well. He had two units of scarabs and two spyders adding to these units every turn and following them. He went straight for the CSM Land Raider and Vindicator forcing me to concentrate the templates on them instead of the scoring units. Of course he made sure they are in cover so they benefit from their stealth, which meant I had to fire every single template for two turns on them (and they still wiped out the LR).

Harbingers of Destruction are very useful against oblits, ignoring their 2+ and causing ID as well as stopping them from shooting with a Solar Pulse or two.
Heavy Destroyers are also good.

I've played against Lash a bunch with my Necrons, and I too know the pain of losing a 20 man squad in one turn (one shot from a Defiler). Not sure what can be done about that...the Warrior blob is just a bigger liability against Lash than most other lists. I just try to avoid it by dismantling the Lash combo ASAP. My opponent usually brings 2 DPs, which are dispatched pretty quickly by Tesla Destructors. Haven't had to deal with Sorcerers, but I'd more than likely want to throw Wraiths at their squads.

Like others said, HoD Crypteks are the ticket for getting rid of Oblits. I usually have 8-10 Lances to pling away with, and they seem to get the job done. Solar Pulses are really useful here too...each one usually gets me a free turn of shooting. CSM don't have very effective counters to Night Fight.

Additionally, max squad size for Obliterators is 3 so at most he can have 9. As for killing them, just use any tactic that would work on Paladins or Nobz. Though Oblits should be easier as they cannot wound allocate.

You just have to bring more long range at&mc, heavy destroyers for example or make monolith/vehicle wall, and that lash cant hit you. Just be grate distance away from those lashes. You can also ask your opponent why he is playing this game, for winning? If so he plays wrong game. But if your opponent plays op list, look at his face when he/she loses. Its worth of seeing!

Lash is pretty terrible, esp after the FAQ ruling came down against it. Its a shooting power, so make sure that he plays it as such.

It also sounds like your opponent hasn't changed their list since 4th ed, so its still the plan old dual lash 6 oblit crap. It hasn't been good for awhile. I would look at what your list is doing first, because a good necron list shouldn't be overly worried about this. If your list is comparable to the better lists in the armies forum maybe look at your tactics.

If that doesn't work just switch up to a AV 13 skimmer spam list. It's close to a hard counter to lash, and necrons can field quite a few good vehicles if they commit to it. Kinda cheesey, but if you are banging your head against the wall trying to beat your opponents challenge, sometimes the best option is to respond with the spam.

whigwam wrote:CSM don't have very effective counters to Night Fight.

In my experience this entirely depends on the table and situation. Since any CSM tank has search lights and I usually put all my guys in cans I find night fighting ist often not a problem. Usually I will try to bring something into range of the necrons anyway and in many cases that LR or Rhino will spot the enemy. Also if my spearhead consists of berzerkers, maybe Kharn, those units don't care about night.

Yeah, it does depend on the table/terrain/scenario, but Night Fight has been a pretty reliable shutdown for me. I usually set up a little over 36" away from any vehicles looking to Searchlight...occasionally one of my units will get picked out, but with each Rhino/LR having less than a 50% chance to spot a target, I've yet to take much serious firepower on turn 1 from CSM. That said, the pain usually starts a turn later!

Now I've never actually encountered infiltrating Chosen in a Rhino, but I imagine they would do really well as spotters.

whigwam wrote:
Now I've never actually encountered infiltrating Chosen in a Rhino, but I imagine they would do really well as spotters.

Good point, I have to keep that in mind. With proper equipment this should give necrons some headache. And now we should stop this, cause it's exactly the opposite of what the OP wants. *grins brightly*

Some of the things my bud uses against my CSM. (I always play lash list).

Destroyer lord (mind scarabs) deepstriking with deathmarks or flayed ones. This guy will destroy defilers, dreads, big stuff very easily. His great AP combined with scarabs means the walker has no chance. The troopers are just there to soak wounds for him. If they do anything its not important.

Wraiths beat obliterators point for point. Maybe I roll bad but 3 wraiths usually kill 3 obliterators, and are a lot cheaper. It boils down to his invul save and rending vs my power fists, and my powerfists usually lose. I even feel like I should have the upper hand in that fight but I don't ever seem to.

Scarabs just wreck any armor in the list. Land raiders, walkers, rhinos. Its sad I have to waste half my shooting on scarabs or suffer the consequences.

Unfortunately Mindshackles don't work against walkers (although they are great for making Obliterators smash themselves). I'd be hesitant to get a Destroyer Lord into CC with a Defiler or Dread...with his MSS doing nothing, he's striking last with no save against a S10 punching machine. Does not bode well for the D-Lord. He is pretty consistently vicious against infantry and non-walker vehicles however. Still, I think two CCB Overlords are a stronger choice. While embarked they're impossible to Lash, plus you increase armor saturation and get access to a second Royal Court. And they can mess up walkers like a Destroyer Lord wishes it could.

Murenius wrote:

whigwam wrote:
Now I've never actually encountered infiltrating Chosen in a Rhino, but I imagine they would do really well as spotters.

Good point, I have to keep that in mind. With proper equipment this should give necrons some headache. And now we should stop this, cause it's exactly the opposite of what the OP wants. *grins brightly*

The rulebook is quite clear that you can't infiltrate a transport (though you can outflank).

Doop, getting my terminology mixed up. That's what I get talking about abilities neither of my armies can use... Thanks for the correction.